dual exhaust

[mazdaspeed32007]

just wondergin for no real reason at all. has anyone ever tried to run a dual exhaust on the 07-09 speed 3? i dont know if the suspension would allow it but i cant see why you wouldnt be able to run it like the current setup only use a y pipe right at the rear. it would have no function....it would be just to make the rear end symetrical. honestly....i dont think ill ever do it. lol. something i would like to see.

[JC-MP5]

Google and the search tab on here are your friends.

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123687532

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=119190&d=1194128384

[mazdaspeed32007]

Google and the search tab on here are your friends.

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123687532

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=119190&d=1194128384

thanks. i searched through pages of google and nothing. weird. maybe i missed it. looks nice though. sort of m3 ish

i knew i saw it before. i even posted in this thread but for some reason couldnt find it.

[240ka]

dual, 4banger=ghey rice

[oaklandopen]

dual, 4banger=ghey rice

the following cars are now considered "ghey":

s2000
mazdaspeed6
srt4 neon
audi tt
sti
evo
lotus elise

just to name a few. and im assuming that ghey rice is only a comparison to your ms3 because it has 1 exhaust outlet with only 4 cylinders? it can't be a comparison of quickness because that entire list of cars is faster than the ms3, and im sure there are more 4 cylinder cars with dual exhaust that are faster.

im a little passionate about these exhaust threads because it DOESN'T MATTER ONE BIT how many exhaust outlets you have on any number of cylinder engine. you can have 4 outlets on a 2 rotor, you can have 1 on a V12.

i happen to think that dual exhaust looks better on pretty much any car, especially ones considered a "sports" car. and by dual exhaust i mean outlets on either side of the rear of the car, not on the same side (see below list). it's really all about whether or not it goes with the looks of the car as a whole

examples of my personal picks of failed exhausts:

5.7L gto (true dual exhaust but out one side of the car)
http://i.imagehost.org/0164/gto.jpg (http://i.imagehost.org/view/0164/gto)
ISF (stacked whut?)
http://i.imagehost.org/0468/isf.jpg (http://i.imagehost.org/view/0468/isf)
boxster (looks like a butthole)
http://i.imagehost.org/0752/boxster.jpg (http://i.imagehost.org/view/0752/boxster)
viper (going from side exhaust to rear, no likey)
http://i.imagehost.org/0027/viper.jpg (http://i.imagehost.org/view/0027/viper)
dodge charger (V-6 has singe exhaust, but dodge in all their cheap glory still had a cutout for their V-8 dual exhaust. just plain sad)
http://i.imagehost.org/0623/charger.jpg (http://i.imagehost.org/view/0623/charger)

[mazdaspeed32007]

good call my friend. seems like people conform to what one person says about 4 cylinder with dual port being gay. although...if you think about it, you could totally make it a "true" dual if you split the header and made two seperate exhaust mani's....would that make it less gay?

[oaklandopen]

good call my friend. seems like people conform to what one person says about 4 cylinder with dual port being gay. although...if you think about it, you could totally make it a "true" dual if you split the header and made two seperate exhaust mani's....would that make it less gay?

basically this is just another one of those loosely used terms that lost its meaning. that's why sometimes you have to clarify things by saying "true dual" instead of just dual. but even then you have to be more specific.

one could argue that dual exhaust means 2 separate pipes, 1 for each bank. but when you say bank you kinda limit the engine to a V formation. maybe you could have a straight 6 and have 2 exhaust tailpipes being fed by 2 separate headers each getting fed by 3 exhaust ports.

but wait, if having dual exhaust means that the gasses are completely separated by 2 completely separate sets of piping then corvettes have single exhausts. there may be 2 headers, and 2 tailpipes, but the gasses sort of merge together somewhere towards the middle of the car in their H (or is it X) pipe configuration. by doing this one exhaust stroke sort of assists in pulling out the exhaust stroke of another cylinder at the merge point. difficult to explain in writing but it works

so really, like i've said before, the way the exhaust looks on the outside of the car has nothing to do with how many cylinders it has. it's purely for looks. and i like the look of separated dual exhaust on a "sports" car. and that is one redesign of the 3 (especially the 2010 ms3) that im jealous of

[mazdaspeed32007]

the more i look at the 2010 model dual port exhaust the less i like it. i like the way theu designed the ms6 exhaust. the 2010 ms3 exhaust looks likda shotty to me. not a fan. but i do like the 3 in this thread. classy.

[blkspeed]

dual, 4banger=ghey rice

wft yea thats your opinion but like that dude said
s2000
mazdaspeed6
srt4 neon
audi tt
sti
evo
lotus elise

those arnt rice to me

[CantCMe]

I never understood why they made that exhaust for the GTO...

[mp3-79bronco]

im gonna run 4 seperate pipes...one for each cylinder...then run mini turbos on each one

[creedns]

im gonna run 4 seperate pipes...one for each cylinder...then run mini turbos on each one

Its been done. Not on our cars but it has been done lol http://www.owendevelopments.co.uk/uploads/quad-turbo1.jpg

[oaklandopen]

I never understood why they made that exhaust for the GTO...

seriously...the only thing good about it is the obvious way you can tell the 6.0 from the 5.7. that and the hood scoops

kinda a shame about that car and the g8. both cars were pretty decent, but the gto never got any good reviews and the g8 didnt' last long cuz they threw pontiac away. i woulda rocked the g8 gxp...or even the g8 firehawk

[Olestra]

That dodge charger takes the cake.

[Ricktalife]

dodge charger (V-6 has singe exhaust, but dodge in all their cheap glory still had a cutout for their V-8 dual exhaust. just plain sad)
http://i.imagehost.org/0623/charger.jpg (http://i.imagehost.org/view/0623/charger)

Hahahah that is awesome. I think I recall Honda doing the same thing with the Accord 4 cylinder VS the V6 in previous years.

[oaklandopen]

it almost sucks being an enthusiast. 99% of car owners don't know how a car works, don't care how a car looks, don't know about any other car...which is why you have an empty cutout on that charger and ppl who look at a miata with a hard top and say "nice porsche" (happened to me).

im sure dodge and any other manufacturer who does that saved lots of money with that extra cutout. that means they only needed 1 type of stamp for that bumper instead of 2, saving time and money. all im saying is that it only really looks bad to the "enthusiast", and the rest of the time it goes unnoticed. oh well

[bigdaddy]

Hahahah that is awesome. I think I recall Honda doing the same thing with the Accord 4 cylinder VS the V6 in previous years.

yes, this is something I ALWAYS notice lol

[vtakk]

I don't understand dual on inline engines. sorry.
even on s2k. though it looks nice.

[P2K]

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p1-11.jpg

[vtakk]

it looks nice.

[Mz3Hatch]

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p1-11.jpg

HOLY COFFEE CANS BATMAN!! They look huge!

[mazdaspeed32007]

wow...honestly...those are hige but it looks clean as all hell....i hope theres some sheet metal or soemthing to seperate the can from the plastic bumper though...it may get a bit melty.

[Mz3Hatch]

Does look clean but I hope its the picture angle and such that is making them look huge. I think dual exhaust with the 07-09 tip size would look pretty good, but it would have to be as clean as this. The new '10s need a little larger tip IMO.

[mazdaspeed32007]

i agree. they just hang there....they need to fill in the space they were given a little better.

[Sport6]

I never understood why they made that exhaust for the GTO...

http://www.autospectator.com/cars/files/images/rear_7.jpg
They fixed that with the 6.0L GTO. 5.7 was the single exit.

[Ricktalife]

Wanna see something retarded? How about the Mugen Civic Type R that was released in Europe. Why wasn't it released in America you ask? Well as I read in the article that posted this picture, it would have cost approximately 40k MSRP. And why am I telling you this? Well here's the funny part...the dual exhaust you see (I've read) is not the real functioning exhaust! LOL supposedly you can see straight through the tips and the real exhaust is just a typical single exhaust that comes out somewhere along the rear bumper hahah I can't remember which side they said.

http://www.motorworldhype.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/mugen_civic_r_3.jpg

[vtakk]

this car is a joke.
last Type R was EK/EP; and now FN

[Ricktalife]

this car is a joke.
last Type R was EK/EP; and now FN

yea...haha I've also seen articles about a Mugen RR that was released only in Japan that had a WHOPPING 260-something hp! But I'm sure the MSRP for that would be somewhere around 45-50k HAHA.

[gate4sweden]

check out my video!

http://www.youtube.com/gate4swe#p/u/7/xLoZ46NcQrs

http://www.garaget.org/?car=132291

[Ricktalife]

check out my video!

http://www.youtube.com/gate4swe#p/u/7/xLoZ46NcQrs

http://www.garaget.org/?car=132291

well despite the fact that you probably didn't gain any power from that...LOOKS SICK!

[oaklandopen]

i just looooove the quad exhaust. very european imo

[Sport6]

well despite the fact that you probably didn't gain any power from that...LOOKS SICK!

Who cares if you gain power from it, any cat-back on a speed3 is very minimal gains as it is, if at all. So you could argue that all the catbacks for the speed3 are just for sound.

[mazdaspeed32007]

which they are. lol.

[Super Shredder]

i'm actually building a frankenberries exhaust (frankenstein/scare the dingleberries off ya) for my speed6 switching back to single pipe/single exit. the exhaust housings alone will keep it stock looking/sleeper but the one 3inch pipe and straight through muffler will definitely be a hp improvement if only 20hp.

the exhaust consists of 3 inch Corksport Resonated Test Pipe --> CP-E 3inch Catback Straight Pipe --> single 3inch straight through Magnaflow muffler. The sound should be quite perfect IMO cant wait to install it. waiting on a Corksport Urethane Exhaust Hangers group buy in the Speed6 section. if you have an exhaust that is bumpin around this is a great solution!

also you have to consider that car companies make dual exhausts for 4 cyl cars because they make less noise, vibration, and drone! they all do dB tests inside the car at idle, driving/cruising , WOT, and if they consider the exhaust noise to be too roudy for the average joe, they'll design a way to have resonators/mufflers added to gain approval. almost everything restrictive done to the speed3/6 was because of noise/vibration.

[mazdaspeed32007]

i dont even remember how my car soudned back in the day.

[mazdaspeed32007]

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p1-11.jpg

hey can you do me a favor and take some pics uf how this all was routed. what did you do for mufflers/muffler? where does it split? all the good stuff. thanks!

[P2K]

It's not mine but I do have more pics.

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p7-2.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p8-2.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p1-10.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p4-1.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p6-1.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p6-2.jpghttp://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p1-9.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a210/P2K/MS3/p4-2.jpg

[Anna-chan]

wow! that looks really good!

[vtakk]

clean job.

[Hank3]

If the tips were 1" smaller, I think it'd look REALLY good.

[714ms3]

If the tips were 1" smaller, I think it'd look REALLY good.

I agree fully man. But it still looks nice. I want to hear it too........

[mazdaspeed32007]

holy wow. this looks like a custom kit from the back, but a professional kit from the looks of the actual fitment and piping. unreal. looks like i have a custom job for the spring. cant say it will be as show like though. lol.

i like the big tips...it fills out the slots very well.

[Hank3]

Might be my eyes or the angle of the pics, but it seems like the passenger side tip is higher?

[mazdaspeed32007]

seems like your eyes to me.

[oaklandopen]

If the tips were 1" smaller, I think it'd look REALLY good.


I agree fully man. But it still looks nice. I want to hear it too........

me three...just a little itty bitty tadbit smaller and they'd be perfect in my humble opinion

i think the amount they stick out from the bumper is a little too far for my taste as well(too many ppl have tips that go out farther than some truck tow hitches, this isn't as bad though)

[Saskatchewan17]

Maybe half an inch smaller and sticking out half an inch less and it would be perfect to me. Wow. Great job though.

[mazdaspeed32007]

sometimes with exhausts its hard to get everythign perfect. i think its a pretty bang up job though. def the best exhaust ive seen on a 3

[BoostedSpd6]

holy wow. this looks like a custom kit from the back, but a professional kit from the looks of the actual fitment and piping. unreal. looks like i have a custom job for the spring. cant say it will be as show like though. lol.

i like the big tips...it fills out the slots very well.

no we can make it look that nice.. it'll just cost u more money to have it coated.. from the looks of it.. its a fairly easy job.. nothing my pipe bender and welding equipment cant take care of.. ull need to grap some tips and a muffler that fits in that spot they have it in..


sometimes with exhausts its hard to get everythign perfect. i think its a pretty bang up job though. def the best exhaust ive seen on a 3

yup.. my custom exhaust was'nt exactly centered.. the passenger side was off by a 1/4 inch but u couldnt see that unless looked at it for a while..

[ohhryan]

Get a factory tip on other side to keep the stock look. There's certainly enough takeoff MS3 exhausts systems available.

[meicalnissyen]

the following cars are now considered "ghey":

s2000
mazdaspeed6
srt4 neon
audi tt
sti
evo
lotus elise



Don't forget the Pontiac Solstice, its Bi-Curious

[h0rsies]

Do you lose power because of less backpressure even if you have a high flow cat in the downpipe?

[SRTie4k]

Do you lose power because of less backpressure even if you have a high flow cat in the downpipe?

Turbos don't like backpressure at all. On most turbo applications, the less restriction from the turbine outlet back, the more power you will make.

[Saskatchewan17]

Yes, the N/A rules of backpressure in the exhuast do not apply to turbocharged cars. The less restrictive you go, the quicker and higher the turbo can spool up.

[h0rsies]

so i wont lose any power from the dual? then why do most turbocharged vehicles switch to a single exhaust?

[vtakk]

so i wont lose any power from the dual? then why do most turbocharged vehicles switch to a single exhaust?
single is less restrictive on inline engines by definition - you don't introduce additional resistance in the point where you do fork.

[oaklandopen]

when the exhaust gets pushed out of the cylinder by the piston it needs some sort of backpressure regardless of being charged or naturally asperated. in an NA applications the exhaust plumbing design along with restrictions like the catalytic converters and muffler create the backpressure. in turbo applications the turbine is the main restriction in the exhaust. superchargers and prochargers are in the same boat as NA when referring to exhaust since they don't use exhaust gasses to charge the inlet air

when you have V configured engines, or if there are 2 separate banks of exhaust, they design the plumbing to help "pull" exhaust away from the combustion chamber through use of exhaust reverberations....ie H or X pipes in some V-8's

in addition, charged engines usually have bigger exhaust valves than intake valves. other way around for NA

[SRTie4k]

when the exhaust gets pushed out of the cylinder by the piston it needs some sort of backpressure regardless of being charged or naturally asperated. in an NA applications the exhaust plumbing design along with restrictions like the catalytic converters and muffler create the backpressure. in turbo applications the turbine is the main restriction in the exhaust. superchargers and prochargers are in the same boat as NA when referring to exhaust since they don't use exhaust gasses to charge the inlet air

when you have V configured engines, or if there are 2 separate banks of exhaust, they design the plumbing to help "pull" exhaust away from the combustion chamber through use of exhaust reverberations....ie H or X pipes in some V-8's

in addition, charged engines usually have bigger exhaust valves than intake valves. other way around for NA

Actually that's not entirely true. The concept of the necessity of backpressure on most modern fuel injected engines is more a myth than a reality.

When in the days of carbs and very rough engine tuning, the results from running an engine with a lack of backpressure used to be burnt valves and drop in torque, but that was caused more by lack of adequate A/F ratio at higher RPM's to compensate for removing that backpressure. In our modern world of fuel injection, most ECUs are able to compensate by richening the mixture and/or changing the timing to accomodate the removal of the restrictions at the exhaust.

Backpressure is an age old concept that really doesn't have any place in the world of modern FI ECU tuning.

[mazdaspeed32007]

^^cosign^^

the quad tips look really good. the single tips look ghey.

either way, dual on 4 banger is ghey rice

its for appearance purposes only. the asymmetrical back end is "ghey". call it gay, but when my ride is called gay for having dual exhaust and i smoke some douche with an 8 just for saying that then we'll talk about gay. my 4 beating a car with 2x the cylinders....talk about someone being gay.

[justanothermp5]

when the exhaust gets pushed out of the cylinder by the piston it needs some sort of backpressure regardless of being charged or naturally asperated. in an NA applications the exhaust plumbing design along with restrictions like the catalytic converters and muffler create the backpressure. in turbo applications the turbine is the main restriction in the exhaust. superchargers and prochargers are in the same boat as NA when referring to exhaust since they don't use exhaust gasses to charge the inlet air

when you have V configured engines, or if there are 2 separate banks of exhaust, they design the plumbing to help "pull" exhaust away from the combustion chamber through use of exhaust reverberations....ie H or X pipes in some V-8's

in addition, charged engines usually have bigger exhaust valves than intake valves. other way around for NA

i have never seen a car where the exhaust valves are bigger then the intake valves..

[oaklandopen]

i have never seen a car where the exhaust valves are bigger then the intake valves..

i might have been thinking about cam timing being different on charged than NA engines. harder to get exhaust out than incoming air in when your charging the intake

[justanothermp5]

yea turbo cars normally have diff cams/timing
but the exhaust valve is always smaller then the intake

[h0rsies]

I think Im the first one in VA to get the duals it looks sexy as fuck.all custom piping 3 inch all the way back with cobb downpipe sounds mean.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v475/philkim/1211091606.jpg rear diffusers are coming on next week

[ms6zoomzoom]

^ That looks super badass dude.

[squidmotion]

in my experience, a good free flowing exhaust is always good, but with a turbocharger there is a limit to how big you can go, to see any gains... it has to do with the size of the turbo, as that is the big restrictive force in the system. you can keep going to 4" if you like, but it isn't going to gain you anything else from the exhaust system until you start swapping out turbos...

keep in mind, there is a big difference in 'back-pressure', and 'restriction'

a slight back-pressure isn't going to bother one on the power end... i've heard (though all of this info is voodoo, imho) that turbos like a touch of back-pressure as it gives the turbo something to push against. and evens out the spool up.

now this is all from V8 racing style turbo guys and the set-ups i watched/helped put together.... no converters, no CELs to worry about... carbed and fuel injected...

in turbocharged engines, you are looking to eliminate 'overlap' or the small amount of time the exhaust and intake valves are open at the same time... the cams they were using in these engines were very mild. not much overlap, and not much lift compared to what we were running as roller-cams in our N/A cars. if you put a radical high lift turbo cam in a boosted V8, and you better have had a good cooling system, ignition timing had to be dead on, and you ran AV gas in it. they also ran low compression pistons, and forged or billet EVERYTHING.

intake timing on heavy boosted cars is critical as well, as the boost coming back from the exhaust side can blow your incoming charge back through the intake! one can only imagine what that could be like (i did see what a nasty intake backfire could do to a turbine). a N/A engine, the goal is to keep the air moving through the combustion chamber, using the exhaust exit to keep the intake charge headed into the cylinder..... in a turbo engine, the goal is to isolate the intake from the exhaust side, to keep from losing boost pressure, as well as keeping the exhaust heading in one direction.....

[h0rsies]

i dont think its a big deal in performance it just splits too a y pipe near the tips

[mazdaspeed32007]

^agreed. looks nice man. just what i had in mind. love it

[prenedo]

did you cut the factory bumper? How is the exhaust routed (is it not even routed through that pipe, like a dummy tip.) I like the look. Def. no performance gains but I like the symetrical look. You got any close ups of the bumper or under car shots?

[kneedragger241]

Yes, please!

[creedns]

Tasty! Someone needs to make a how to or a legit kit to do this

[AllLostThings]

Badass man I love it!

[liquidflem]

It's all about symmetry to me, I think the rear of an S2000 looks awesome and partially because it's so symmetrical