loss of power when hot/higher gears rpms

[msp1986]

hey guys,
first of all thank you for all of you input on the other threads similar to this one, they gave me a place to start and a lot of ideas as to what it could be... but after all i am very lost

So i just bought Sunlight Silver #1986, it was the last one sold in colorado, and shes been pretty good to me except for this...

It seems like when the car is good and hot after driving around in normal conditions and boosting a fair amount under full acceleration it hits a wall, it reaches full boost seemingly ok but the motor seems not to react to it at all like its accelerating as if the turbo is not even there and sometimes at about 5500 it seems to be released from whatever this is and accelerate normally until shift or redline. Mods are: Injen CAI, Custom upper IC hard Pipe, Blitz DD BOV, Apex'i Cat back, and boost/ oil pressure guages.

-Boost reading between 5.5 and 7 at full
-Vac reading between 15 and 20 at idle
-Vac line for boost guage tapped at the U on the right side of the intake mani as per the "how to" on this forum
-No CEL

Things ive tried in order (thanks to other posts):
-Hesitation ECU reflash from Mazda performed 2004
-Thought it was fuel related, seafoamed the shit out of the car via the brake booster plus lucas fuel additive to clean the injectors
-Checked all IC and turbo connections for leaks (none) and cranked everything tighter
-replaced almost all vacuum lines including original boostguage tap which was in the middle of a line between a sensor to what looked like the FPR.. improve BOV performance but otherwise no dice.
-Cleaned air filter really well
-replaced plugs with double platinums (old plugs didnt appeared to be fouled) HELPED A LITTLE

Please help i am so lost and i dont want to keep throwing parts at it or take it in to the stealership. My next attempt was going to be the WGA, but i am unconvinced that this is what it is, doesnt seem to be boosting slower or taking time to build.. but i dont know much about the symptoms... any suggestions or ideas as to what this could be would be greatly appreciated.. i hope i was thorough enough with my description

[MazdaPro03.5]

It seems like when the car is good and hot after driving around in normal conditions and boosting a fair amount under full acceleration it hits a wall, it reaches full boost seemingly ok but the motor seems not to react to it at all like its accelerating as if the turbo is not even there and sometimes at about 5500 it seems to be released from whatever this is and accelerate normally until shift or redline. Mods are: Injen CAI, Custom upper IC hard Pipe, Blitz DD BOV, Apex'i Cat back, and boost/ oil pressure guages.

Sounds like fuel cut or heat soak to me.

[msp1986]

fuel cut maybe... what could be causing it tho? and would heat soak really bog it down like that? i know nothing about heatsoak anyone care to enlighten me on fuel cut and heatsoak? thanks very much for everyones support it makes owning this car a lot easier

[Wardie77]

Mine seems to be the same way! When ever its been running for awhile there just doesnt seem to be any power at all. But when its been running for a few mins and a bit cooler it runs like a champ..... Would a new intercooler and hardpiping help this you think?

[msp1986]

it makes sense but its hard to belive that these cars had this heatsoak issue from day one.. i could be wrong but it would be good to know.. i think mine is having WGA issues but i know nothing about symptoms of that etc

[greasemonkey524]

Sounds like heatsoak but it could very well still be a bad tune. These cars still run uber rich even after the flash. Your best bet would be to get some sort of engine management if that turns out to still be the problem.

[mazdaspeedp]

i think it could be your intercooler cuz my car does the same thing today after driving 160kms for a while it seemd to loosed power and not boost as well i think you need to upgrade to the bigger side mount intercooler and hardpipes im gonna upgrade my pipes asap but protege garage has been slow to ship my items

[bradboyd80]

it makes sense but its hard to belive that these cars had this heatsoak issue from day one.. i could be wrong but it would be good to know.. i think mine is having WGA issues but i know nothing about symptoms of that etc

These cars definitely have heatsoak issues. The stock intercooler (and pipes for that matter) are complete junk. To check the wga issues, blow into the vacuum hose going to the wga. If its solid, you're good; if you can blow air into it at all, its not good. If your wga is on its way out, it could lead to overboost and cause the fuel cut.

[msp1986]

its weird because it seems only to happen after ive been driving a while and things are good and warm. i guess it could be heatsoak, but it feels like my problem goes in and out where with heatsoak i would assume it woould be constant after a certain temp is reached. it feels like the motor doesnt even react to boost, and sometimes miraculously at 5500 its released and accelerates fine. it feels calculated is my point. like something the motor or ecu is doing. if its wga boost would probably be higher than 6 to cause fuel cut? and if its a bad tune wouldnt it make it run like shit not just when its hot? im sitting at 15 to 20 vac at idle im not sure what stock vac should read but a vaccum leak wouldnt cause issues just at temp either would it?

[bradboyd80]

I'm not sure what vacuum is considered "normal" in Denver because of the elevation. Higher elevations should have lower vacuum right? I know down here in FL, 20-22 is normal. What about coils and wires? They seem to make your car run funny when they go bad. Or PCV? I changed out my PCV and it ran a little better.

[SeR_Cyclops]

I would guess its the msp super uber insanly rich tune.

[msp1986]

im gonna try pulling my plugs down to standard or single platinum and gapping them to .030 and cleaning the MAF and see what happens. aside from that i am completely lost. could be fuel related or a vac leak i just dont know....

[mazdaspeedp]

you should get a upgraded side mount and see if that helps let me know toocuz i might be getting one soon

[msp1986]

That's next on the mod list for me. Hard pipes upgraded fmic or smic and NBC of some sort (suggestions on what to get for all of this?) also read my reply on the wga question about an intake Mani leak or crack.. Think this may help us all with this problem

[Mr.broke]

I don't think an intercooler would do much good. I had the problem with my msp and i have upgraded the intercooler. I just put it the joe p fcd, i was skeptical but no more cut. i would recommend a a/f ratio gauge to keep an eye on it though. and a good tune.

[mp3-79bronco]

fuck mines doing the same thing...

and ive got a fmic....i mean exaclty what your describing. ive got a wideband and im running 11.5-12.0 afrs!!!!!

[mazdaspeedp]

so you 2 are saying that putting in a new intercooler will not solve the heat soak issue?

[Alejo_NIN]

fuck mines doing the same thing...

and ive got a fmic....i mean exaclty what your describing. ive got a wideband and im running 11.5-12.0 afrs!!!!!

i go thru the same thing. it really depends tho...not on weather but on how the msp is behaving that day. if it is happy, it feels peppy and responsive, but if it sad, it feels sluggish and non-responsive.

sometimes i hit 13.5 afrs and get MILs, other times it deeps to the 10s.

this car is fucking haunted!

anyways, altho a FMIC does help with heatsoak, the issue might lay somewhere else.
a bad O2 sensor can act right sometimes and others just like shit. remember that the ECU is contantly chekcing the sensors, and it acting up like that and then being ok, the ECU might not think is a bad O2.
also, check for cracks around the exhaust manifold, check your PVC valve for leaks and check your timming.

just some ideas...not everything fuel-cut related is FUEL. it could also be dirty filters, timming belts, O2 sensonrs, MAF sensors....it could be anything!
fuck, i hate ODB2!

[mp3-79bronco]

im gonna try the stage colder plugs

[just_B]

just an idea, but how's your by-pass valve? I just skimmed through here and didn't see anything, but they heat up and leak

[mp3-79bronco]

ive got a hks so its not that

[just_B]

just a thought =)

[mp3-79bronco]

i actually think i found my prob. i got the codes check and i have 2. one for malfunctioning speedo ( i have no speedo gear) and the second for lean in bank 1....so i think im in limp mode and its pulling timing

[mazdaspeedp]

i actually think i found my prob. i got the codes check and i have 2. one for malfunctioning speedo ( i have no speedo gear) and the second for lean in bank 1....so i think im in limp mode and its pulling timing

what is limp mode?

[jeanspeed]

i also have the same problem.... i have a fmic, hks bov hard pipes front and rear mount. and have a aem wideband. it hit 10 all the time. and when it starts running alright it 10.5-11.3 but them later back to 10.... i have ems a greddy ultimate but i dont kknow if its going to wirk. havnt heard any one using this system.. has any heard anyone here using that system??????????????

[orng1]

what is limp mode?


When you need viagra. (stfu)


LOL no when the ECU sees an error code or codes and retards timing and adds fuel to save itself from blowing up.

[ASmitty]

I have the same issue, and I am running and upgraded sidemount, INJEN cai, vibrant, hardpipes for both the hot and cold, and unichip. My WGA is fine, I hold the correct boost I have it set for and the correct vaccum. Kind of leads me to believe A: it's heatsoak, B: my unichip has a shit tune. I do run insanely rich still, will add that. May I'll send my unichip off to crossover auto guys for a tune.

[Warlock2X]

mine has done the same thing since i owned it (stock) i put an FMIC and hard pipes thinking that would possibly fix it and it still seemed to be doing it, next step is a unichip, and along with it a T28 from an older skyline, 440cc injectors, and re routed hard pipes

[orng1]

Mine hasn't done that since I went with the T3, the extra air flow really helps lean out the stupid rich fueling by the ECU.

[mazdaspeedp]

turbonetics?

[RFC]

I want to bring this back up as mine is doing the same thing. Any solutions?

My boost comes on normally but the car barely accelerates. Its like something is blocking the intake or something. This also occurs only after the car is completey warmed up. It is absolutely not fuel cut because I know what that is and how it feels. Also like the original poster it seems to free up somewhat (although not smooth) above 5,000 rpm or so.

I have heard heat soak here but can someone explain exactly what that does to limit acceleration like this? Again my boost is about where I would expect it at 7-8 psi. It just doesn't go.

[CHIQLES]

I think the solution is a fan for the intercooler for idle moments and a water sprayer for after hard driving when the car is shut off. when the car is not being used and has been run for a while all the heat sits in the engine bay and and is being absorbed by everything in it includeing intercoolers front\side doesnt matter. when you get back in the car the intercooler is actualy a pre-heater now becuase the air is actualy hotter after passing through it. Im not sure how much time it actually takes to drop your temps down on the intercooler back to its actual productivity point but a water sprayer should nock it down faster. does this make sense?

[orng1]

It sounds way to much like heat soak to me. with a good intercooler and getting rid of the T 2 small it eliminates a lot of that.

[LUI.MSP]

Any update? Exact same thing with mine hot or cool weather.

[msp1986]

i replaced my stock smic with a fmic kit and it fixed my problem..(im the one that started this post) of course it still lags a little because of the shit tune even with a flashed ecu. i have come to find that an FMIC with the shortest piping route and maybe a little heat wrap is the best way to fix this. even the upgraded smic kits get way hot because eventhough they flow better they still sit right next to the HOT radiator. unfortunately this can make a car run even richer.. but im looking into a fuel pressure reducer made for our cars or a good tune on an AFC using an afr meter.

[msp1986]

oh and cold weather certainly does help things... but thats with any car

[M4N B4G]

ok mine pulls hard for the first like 2 min and then as soon as its warm it bogs really bad when I go into boost. I have the Corksport fmic and the cold pipe is cold to the touch even once the car is warm so i dont think mine is heatsoak. I've triple checked all the piping connections and i have NO CELs. The other thing i've noticed is the spool sound changes once it is warm to a much louder sound and thats when i starts sucking. It always boosts fine but once its warm it hits the wall as soon as it crosses the 0 on the boost gauge. Out of ideas PLEASE HELP. Anyone with this that they have fixed?

BTW I dont think the car has the Mazda re-flash, does the same thing w/ BOV or BPV

[NocturnalSpeed]

We all just need a tune... I put a Turbolife/Perrin FMIC and SRI; didn't solve it. Recently installed a exhaust manifold and 3" from the downpipe back; still hits a wall.

Get a EMS and tune it. Tha'ts my next object.

[orng1]

You still have the factory midpipe?

[NocturnalSpeed]

mybad, yes I do..

[b6gtxawd]

anyone know what a good ems would be to get? has anyone here used the e manage untimate?

[b6gtxawd]

well my car just started doing this last night as well. seems to drive normal when im not trying to accell fast, but does seem to use a little more boost then usual(maybe im trippin a bit) . i tryed to pull out and pass a guy last night on my way home from work and the car just did not want to move at all. felt like it was almost an un turboed car.

anyone have any idea what i can get to help stop this?

i have a sri,fmic,koso boost gauge, 3" cat back, and a turbo xs dual stage boost controler that doesnt seem to work. i was thinking of getting the bigger injectors, fuel rail, bigger fuel pump, unichip or the e manage( not sure whats better, feel free to give me some advice) what does the better waste gate do as well? is it something worth looking into?

i want to love my msp again

[HighSpeed]

anyone know what a good ems would be to get? has anyone here used the e manage untimate?

I think most people steer away from the emanage. AEM FIC seems to be coming around now, and its cheaper, or go Haltech.....used it on my Celica Alltrac and worked great.

[M4N B4G]

well my car just started doing this last night as well. seems to drive normal when im not trying to accell fast, but does seem to use a little more boost then usual(maybe im trippin a bit) . i tryed to pull out and pass a guy last night on my way home from work and the car just did not want to move at all. felt like it was almost an un turboed car.

anyone have any idea what i can get to help stop this?

i have a sri,fmic,koso boost gauge, 3" cat back, and a turbo xs dual stage boost controler that doesnt seem to work. i was thinking of getting the bigger injectors, fuel rail, bigger fuel pump, unichip or the e manage( not sure whats better, feel free to give me some advice) what does the better waste gate do as well? is it something worth looking into?

i want to love my msp again


Kinda thinkin it has something to do with SRI or maybe the FMIC without the MAF relocated IDK the computer is definitely being thrown off by something and i think causing the computer to pull timing and/or dump fuel but mostly pull timing. I'm going back to CAI tomorrow and probably relocating the MAF next week. I really hope this works for me

[b6gtxawd]

yeah i have a relocated my MAF it seems strange to me that the car will all the sudden start running like this. its like it takes the turbo much longer to hit and when it does it seems like its barely there. im gunna try and get a chip or a new ecu and see what happens.

[M4N B4G]

Well this just in my wastegate actuator just took a sh*t. Ordered the Forge adjustable actuator. Results to follow.