Does anyone have?

[speed6r]

Does anyone have pics of a 06 MS6 with Mazdaspeed springs? i just ordered them from the dealer and i want to know what there gonna look like1 THX!

[kendon]

what' the price and estimated drop?

[speed6r]

The springs installed are $535 and I think its 1"1/4 in the rear and 1" 1/2 in the front.

[kendon]

not too shabby for mazdaspeed pricing. i'm interested in the look as well.

[speed6r]

not too shabby for mazdaspeed pricing. i'm interested in the look as well.

The dealer should get them in today I'll have to take some before and after pics. i'll keep u guys up to date!

[USAFVMI08]

Wait...Mazdaspeed springs? I thought that the ones that were on WERE Mazdaspeed springs... If not, then what are there?

[mazdaspeedster3]

I dont have a 6 but that was my understanding as well. Mazda didnt make lowering springs for the MS6, those are lowering springs for a reg 6 that will be the same as a MS6. You are getting the exact same springs put on your car that you already have...

[justanothermp5]

dam...that sucks if thats actually what he did

[TX Speed 6]

I don't know if they're the same springs the car already came with but those were definately made for the regular 6, not the MS6, so they might be stiffer and lower for a reg. 6, but you might not notice too much of a difference, if any, on the MS6.

[mazdaspeedster3]

Tunersteve can set this straight. He went with H&R because Mazda DOES NOT make lowering springs for the speed6. If you get Mazdaspeed springs for a 6 they are the OEM springs already on the Mazdaspeed 6. They will lower a reg 6 1.2/1.5 I beleive but do nothing for a MS6. Same as a Mazda3 putting OEM mazdaspeed3 springs on, lowered.

[chiefmg]

Mazdaspeed springs are meant for the regular 6. I don't think the spring rates even match the stock ones for the Speed6. For sure the drop will be greater due to the greater weight of a Speed6. Sorry to say this but your car isn't going to handle very well. If your dealer told you these were made for your car, he is an idiot.

[chiefmg]

There is a sticky in this section about lowering options. Everyone with questions about mods for their car should always look for stickies first, there is a lot of hard-earned info in them and it can save you a lot of time, money and effort.

[tunersteve]

Your only MS6-SPECIFIC spring options are the H&Rs and the RPM Street/Sport. A lot of other companies will say they work, but they are just the 6 springs.

As previously stated, there is a thread about the options available.

[speed6r]

the springs are on back order I'll keep you guy's posted! but who ever posted that they dont make Mazdaspeed lowering springs for a Masdspeed6 was right they must be for the reg 6. I'm gonna put em on anyway. worst case senario the dealer HAS to take them back lol! They sold me the wrong springs lol!

[Raynman]

If you get Mazdaspeed springs for a 6 they are the OEM springs already on the Mazdaspeed 6. They will lower a reg 6 1.2/1.5 I beleive but do nothing for a MS6. Same as a Mazda3 putting OEM mazdaspeed3 springs on, lowered.

Umm...no.

OEM Mazdaspeed6 springs have a totally different part number than Mazdaspeed accessory springs. In fact, mounting OEM MS6 springs on the regular 6 will retain the stock height, except with a 20-30% stiffer spring rate. Heck, some say that the car rides higher because of the higher spring rates.

[JOSER_SPEED6]

the springs are on back order I'll keep you guy's posted! but who ever posted that they dont make Mazdaspeed lowering springs for a Masdspeed6 was right they must be for the reg 6. I'm gonna put em on anyway. worst case senario the dealer HAS to take them back lol! They sold me the wrong springs lol!

I know this was posted a few weeks ago but I have Mazdaspeed springs..from my understanding is that they were meant for the V6, they do fit it and it rides fine but it is lower than what the specs say they are, which I'm assuming is cause of the extra weight. I can't complain and I have no handling problems at all.

[Raynman]

^ Welcome to infinite spring rate. Prepare to bottom out. That's like fitting 6i lowering springs on the 6s. Ask me how my bumpstops fared while I had Tanabe NF210's. Same thing.

[speed6r]

It took the dealer about a week to get the springs, and it took me about a week to find the time to bring my car in, Finally there done! Here is a quick pick i took with my IPhone.
http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee288/HighSun_Murder/photo.jpg

The pic sucks but I love the Drop! no Rubbing no Bottoming out, and It corners Amazingly! Installed, springs and all, It only cost me $500. The parts are warranty-able and my Manufacture's Warranty is not affected!
SCORE!

[tunersteve]

I'm interested to see how these hold up and if you bottom out at all with the added weight.

[speed6r]

Honestly It drives great! very smooth no banging no Bottoming out ect. I would definatly reccomend them. I'm sure if i loaded 4-5 people in there I may have some issues, but that never happens. I usually have 1 maybe two other heads in my car.

[Raynman]

I'm interested to see how these hold up and if you bottom out at all with the added weight.

Well, it's certainly not a performance setup. If anything, it's a downgrade.

[triplejumper18]

FAIL

Way to downgrade your performance car.

Should have gone with the 6i springs for an even farther drop.

(hand)

[speed6r]

Thanks for the encouraging words fellas. I don't see how putting mazdaspeed springs on is a downgrade in performance, Sounds like a bunch of haters to me.

(fu)

[tunersteve]

Thanks for the encouraging words fellas. I don't see how putting mazdaspeed springs on is a downgrade in performance, Sounds like a bunch of haters to me.

(fu)

Let's not start a pissing match here. I think people were just trying to look out for you since the springs were known to not work well for the MS6 due to its weight. If you like them, that's fine. Don't get pissy about people trying to help you, regardless of their tone. Not everyone will sugar coat it.

And I gotta say, for $500, that's a lot of cash for springs. Hell, the AutoEXE ones are cheaper than that.

[Raynman]

Thanks for the encouraging words fellas. I don't see how putting mazdaspeed springs on is a downgrade in performance, Sounds like a bunch of haters to me.

(fu)

If you're looking for encouragement, look somewhere else. I don't encourage bad suspension engineering.

It's quite apparent that you don't see why what you did is a bad idea, so let me educate you:

This is a photo showing front shock travel for the Mazdaspeed6 (left), 6s (center), and a Koni shock (right).
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f200/rdrazek/car%20components/im002336.jpg

Note a couple of things: The MS6 shock travel length is actually less than the regular 6 travel.

So, the MS6 has about 5.5" of travel to start with. But, recall that there's a bump stop in place. The bump stop occupies 3" of height, so that leaves you with 2.5" of travel. Based on the heavier weight of the MS6, your suspension drop will not be 1.5". But rather, it will be closer to 2". Subtract that from 2.5" and you'll only have 0.5" of front shock travel.

5.5" travel - 3" (bumpstop) = 2.5" suspension travel - 2.0" drop height = 0.5" final suspension travel.


0.5" travel is not necessarily bad, if you have increased spring rate to counter suspension compression. But, the problem is that you're actually below the spring rate to prevent that from happening.

If we use a 6s spring as a baseline for spring design for the Mazdaspeed6, it would be:

25-30% stiffer to account for the added weight of the MS6.
For a drop of 1.5-2.0", I would be looking at another 20-30% spring rate increase to prevent bottoming out.


The Mazdaspeed spring for the V6, only does one of the above - leaving you with an undersprung setup.

When it all settles, you'll be left with little or no suspension travel on a softer suspension setup - recipe for bottoming out.

Suspension travel is king. If you don't have room to travel, the suspension is not working.

And, I haven't even begun to address the differences between the sedan springs and the hatchback springs! God help you, if you have the sedan springs.

That's not hating. That's just plain and simple Engineering 101.

Feel free to counter my argument with the same amount detail and explanation.

[tunersteve]

Excellent post Raynman! Very informative and it gets the point across.

I've seen MS6's with improper spring setups and it's not pretty. Eibach Sportlines are not a good mix with our cars.

[gotallofthem]

Alright, I'm a bit confused here, I was reading the posts that were written, and some of the posts say that, "Mazdaspeed" does not make any lowering springs for the MS6.
But on teh Mazdausa.com website, it shows some lowering springs for the 06-07 MS6 that lowers the car by 37mm.

So how come people are saying that they dont make springs, I'm confused here.
I called the parts the department to confirm this, they said that there are 2 different parts numbers listed in their system, one for the 6cyl , and one for the MS6.
It's 2 different part numbers for 2 different parts.

These springs are listed at 300 bucks. So you got them installed for 500 buks (part and labor). I cant remember what my service center said, Im not sure if they said 540 for the labor, or they ment 540 for parts and labor.

[tunersteve]

Going straight to Mazda and looking at their MS accessories, you'll find this link (http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/speedDisplayAccessoryDetail.action?endModelYear=20 08&speedAccessoryId=35&carLineCode=MZ6&categoryId=4&startModelYear=2004) offers the springs for the 3.0 & MS6. GRMS-8M-H14 is the part #. They show it posted twice listed two different ways, but they are the same part # for both.

Basically, the MS springs are Eibach rebadges IIRC, and if you cross-reference Eibach's suspension options for the 6 and MS6, you'll find out that the V6 and MS6 springs are indeed the same part # as well for Eibach.

If you're truly looking for a MS6 only spring setup that will be stiffer than the stock MS6 springs, look at the AutoEXE, RPM Street/Sport, or H&R springs.

[speed6r]

Alright, I'm a bit confused here, I was reading the posts that were written, and some of the posts say that, "Mazdaspeed" does not make any lowering springs for the MS6.
But on teh Mazdausa.com website, it shows some lowering springs for the 06-07 MS6 that lowers the car by 37mm.

So how come people are saying that they dont make springs, I'm confused here.
I called the parts the department to confirm this, they said that there are 2 different parts numbers listed in their system, one for the 6cyl , and one for the MS6.
It's 2 different part numbers for 2 different parts.

These springs are listed at 300 bucks. So you got them installed for 500 buks (part and labor). I cant remember what my service center said, Im not sure if they said 540 for the labor, or they ment 540 for parts and labor.

Interesting! This conflicts with the majority of, "know-it-all's" on this forum. lol!

[TX Speed 6]

I called the parts the department to confirm this, they said that there are 2 different parts numbers listed in their system, one for the 6cyl , and one for the MS6.
It's 2 different part numbers for 2 different parts.


What are the part numbers they gave you?

[Knox Joe]

Going straight to Mazda and looking at their MS accessories, you'll find this link (http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/speedDisplayAccessoryDetail.action?endModelYear=20 08&speedAccessoryId=35&carLineCode=MZ6&categoryId=4&startModelYear=2004) offers the springs for the 3.0 & MS6. GRMS-8M-H14 is the part #. They show it posted twice listed two different ways, but they are the same part # for both.

Basically, the MS springs are Eibach rebadges IIRC, and if you cross-reference Eibach's suspension options for the 6 and MS6, you'll find out that the V6 and MS6 springs are indeed the same part # as well for Eibach.

If you're truly looking for a MS6 only spring setup that will be stiffer than the stock MS6 springs, look at the AutoEXE, RPM Street/Sport, or H&R springs.
Interesting! This conflicts with the majority of, "know-it-all's" on this forum. lol!

(uhm)

Survival of the fittest. I say let stupid people make stupid mistakes.

[tunersteve]

I try to provide people with information based on things I may have researched. Since I just did a spring install, I looked at all possible options and read reviews, pricing, etc. If you don't want to listen, go for it. Don't come on here and bitch when something isn't right and it was told to you from the get-go. Sometimes the 'know-it-alls' actually aren't talking out their ass.

[speed6r]

(uhm)

Survival of the fittest. I say let stupid people make stupid mistakes.

well said i agree!

[speed6r]

I try to provide people with information based on things I may have researched. Since I just did a spring install, I looked at all possible options and read reviews, pricing, etc. If you don't want to listen, go for it. Don't come on here and bitch when something isn't right and it was told to you from the get-go. Sometimes the 'know-it-alls' actually aren't talking out their ass.

Who said something was wrong?

[mazdaspeedster3]

Thanks for the encouraging words fellas. I don't see how putting mazdaspeed springs on is a downgrade in performance, Sounds like a bunch of haters to me.

(fu)

Did you get them on the car yet?

[Killer]

If you're looking for encouragement, look somewhere else. I don't encourage bad suspension engineering.

It's quite apparent that you don't see why what you did is a bad idea, so let me educate you:

This is a photo showing front shock travel for the Mazdaspeed6 (left), 6s (center), and a Koni shock (right).
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f200/rdrazek/car%20components/im002336.jpg

Note a couple of things: The MS6 shock travel length is actually less than the regular 6 travel.

So, the MS6 has about 5.5" of travel to start with. But, recall that there's a bump stop in place. The bump stop occupies 3" of height, so that leaves you with 2.5" of travel. Based on the heavier weight of the MS6, your suspension drop will not be 1.5". But rather, it will be closer to 2". Subtract that from 2.5" and you'll only have 0.5" of front shock travel.

5.5" travel - 3" (bumpstop) = 2.5" suspension travel - 2.0" drop height = 0.5" final suspension travel.


0.5" travel is not necessarily bad, if you have increased spring rate to counter suspension compression. But, the problem is that you're actually below the spring rate to prevent that from happening.

If we use a 6s spring as a baseline for spring design for the Mazdaspeed6, it would be:

25-30% stiffer to account for the added weight of the MS6.
For a drop of 1.5-2.0", I would be looking at another 20-30% spring rate increase to prevent bottoming out.


The Mazdaspeed spring for the V6, only does one of the above - leaving you with an undersprung setup.

When it all settles, you'll be left with little or no suspension travel on a softer suspension setup - recipe for bottoming out.

Suspension travel is king. If you don't have room to travel, the suspension is not working.

And, I haven't even begun to address the differences between the sedan springs and the hatchback springs! God help you, if you have the sedan springs.

That's not hating. That's just plain and simple Engineering 101.

Feel free to counter my argument with the same amount detail and explanation.

Awesome post. Thanks! :)

[speed6r]

Here are a few new pics:

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee288/HighSun_Murder/photo2-1.jpg

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee288/HighSun_Murder/photo2.jpg

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee288/HighSun_Murder/photo-1.jpg

[Raynman]

Interesting! This conflicts with the majority of, "know-it-all's" on this forum. lol!

Umm...actually no. First of all, your setup hasn't settled yet. Give it a few weeks and you'll see your drop come up to be significantly more than 1.5". The first photo you took with your iPhone was 6/23. You've only had one week with it. Give it time.

Do your homework on part numbers GRMS-8M-H14 and -H15 (wagon/hatch) have always been springs for the regular 6. Only recently did the website change, and even that isn't conclusive: Read the part where it says "Mazda6s sedan V6 only."

http://www.msprotege.com/members/Raynman/mazdaspeed.jpg

But really, even if the website did say it's for the Mazdaspeed6 it doesn't necessarily mean that it's automatically correct. It boils down to physics. Ask any performance suspension engineer and they'll tell you the fundamentals of lowering:

- Lower to a desired height.
- Increase the spring rate rate to prevent bottoming out.
- Match the dampening rates of the shocks to keep the setup collected (I'll get to this later).

H14 is 30% stiffer than the OEM Mazda6 springs. The Mazdaspeed6 OEM suspension is about 25% stiffer than the Mazda6's. Both percentages line up - In other words, you just dropped your suspension without increasing your spring rates.

For your sake, I hope you have H15 springs. What's even worse, is that regular Mazda6 owners complain that H14 gives uneven lowering heights. There are plenty of reports out there of H14 lowering more on the rear, meaning the H14 spring rates are insufficient. H15 springs which are designed for the wagon and the hatch (which are heavier in the rear), give a much better even drop and better balance.

If you do have H14 springs, you have a Mazdaspeed6 that is lowered and not just undersprung - it's even more undersprung in the rear which will wreak havoc on balance on a car that's heavier in the rear because of the AWD components back there.

That's why plenty of Mazda6 owners (myself included) actually use H15 be it sedan, wagon or hatch to get an even drop and to get a good setup. Even better when we (myself included) pair the H15's with Mazdaspeed6 OEM shocks. This is why the 25-30% range is such a key range for V6 Mazda6's: 1.5" drop, 30% spring rate increase, 25% dampening rate increase from the OEM MS6 shocks. This fulfills the fundamentals I mentioned, and it's a hoot to drive around.

But in any event, show me mathematically how a drop greater than 1.5" with no spring rate increase can't possible lead to bottoming out. I'm still waiting.

[mazdaspeedster3]

I am not driving a speed 6 but I have heard more than enough (off forum) MS6 springs dont upgrade from Mazda. You can drop but wont add any performance value... With that I would question anyone telling me otherwise until I could prove what I wanted to know. Love for Mazda period, no one wants to see anyone fail, only succeed.

[tunersteve]

Raynman, not to thread jack entirely, but have you heard of anyone running Tokico blue shocks/struts on a lowered MS6, and if so, what kind of increased damping do those provide?

Second, if those won't be a worthwhile addition to my setup (H&R springs), which shocks/struts would you recommend?

[neox.286]

remember, part numbers doesn't dictate quality of performance

just because something says a big brand name like Eibach, or Corksport, or Full-Race (all of which do produce quality parts) doesn't mean that it is the best option

and if you read the post that raynman posted about the travel lengths you would realize that even if the website says it's for both (which it doesn't) that doesn't mean that it'll work for both...the strut assemblies are too different for the v6 6 springs to work on the ms6 properly


it only 'feels' stiffer because the strut assembly doesn't have any room to travel downward



here it is in layman's terms:
when you turn, the outside strut/spring expands and the inside strut/spring retracts...if the inside strut/spring cannot retract then the outside strut/spring cannot expand because the frame of the car does not flex...not only are you putting a lot of strain on the strut when you turn hard and completely retract you are also putting a lot of pressure on the inner valves of the strut itself...the car 'turns stiffer', but doesn't necessarily pitch the car into the turn in a very effective way, probably worse than the factory springs actually

it's your car, do what you want, but the members here do know what they are talking about and the only reason we mention this stuff is because the community would like to see our rare cars be fixed up right...we are not saying you are a dumbass, we are giving advice, if you don't want to take it that's fine =)

[Raynman]

Raynman, not to thread jack entirely, but have you heard of anyone running Tokico blue shocks/struts on a lowered MS6, and if so, what kind of increased damping do those provide?

Second, if those won't be a worthwhile addition to my setup (H&R springs), which shocks/struts would you recommend?

No, I haven't met anyone running Toks on a MS6 and I think the reason is because there is no part# for the Speed6:

http://www.hitachi-hap-la.com/tokicogasshocks/app/Mazda.html

I suppose you can't go wrong with Koni yellows, being that you can adjust them to the proper rate. I'll admit that I'm not current on the Mazdaspeed6 stuff, so perhaps a MS6 guy will chime in on what works well with the H&R's.

[tunersteve]

No, I haven't met anyone running Toks on a MS6 and I think the reason is because there is no part# for the Speed6:

http://www.hitachi-hap-la.com/tokicogasshocks/app/Mazda.html

I suppose you can't go wrong with Koni yellows, being that you can adjust them to the proper rate. I'll admit that I'm not current on the Mazdaspeed6 stuff, so perhaps a MS6 guy will chime in on what works well with the H&R's.

Yeah, I saw that those are for the 6, not the MS6, but I was wondering if the spring rate was higher than what the OEM MS6 shocks provide. I'll start a new thread to discuss that.