A little weight problem...

[camrycev6]

... So I was driving to DC last night to go to the Nationals game. (Yes...I had free tickets, otherwise I wouldn't bother.)

It was myself, my girlfriend, and two buddies. I was amazed at how sluggish the car felt when trying to accelerate or pass, but then I thought about it... I had an extra 625 (apprx) pounds in the car! That is a lot of mass to move...

It was so much nicer when I got in the car this morning and reconfirmed that all my MS3 needed was a diet!

[CnoTataymo]

How was the weather? If it was warm, it could have been the TMIC heatsoaking or not pulling in cool enough air. Other then that, around 625 lbs extra is a lot.

[camrycev6]

It had been raining off and on, but it wasn't really warm out. About 55 degrees.

[NRRfrogmanP5]

how do u like the stadium...sorry to jack ur thread.

[Circle9]

Haha, just try carrying around 3 extra people in an Si - Oh yea! 139 lb'ft of torque!! (argh)

[camrycev6]

how do u like the stadium...sorry to jack ur thread.

That stadium was amazing. Honestly, the best I have ever been too. We had box seats, and it is more like going to a hotel with a baseball game going on out your front door.

[camrycev6]

Haha, just try carrying around 3 extra people in an Si - Oh yea! 139 lb'ft of torque!! (argh)

Good point... I can only imagine! Speaking of SI's, I did have an older SI try to race me the other day... I didn't bite. I just accelerated (hard) to normal speeds (ahead of him of course....) then he passed me at a ridiculous speed seconds later. I guess that made him feel like he "won."

[NCZ13]

try having a p5 and 4 people in your car lol.

[camrycev6]

try having a p5 and 4 people in your car lol.

I can only imagine.... It reminds me of the days when turning off the AC was important if you wanted extra power. I know I probably don't need too, but I still turn off the AC if I want to accelerate hard in my MS3. My old boss told me to get a Vette, and you won't have to worry about running the AC....

[Kain]

In and of itself, the new Nats stadium is great. It feels like a theme park that happens to have a baseball game happening at the same time. No, it doesn't have that shrine feeling like Wrigley or the old Yankee stadium, and the location is terrible (Anacostia? Really?), but it's a fun place to hang out to watch baseball. Beats the hell out of RFK.

[Wagonbacker9]

I can only imagine.... It reminds me of the days when turning off the AC was important if you wanted extra power. I know I probably don't need too, but I still turn off the AC if I want to accelerate hard in my MS3. My old boss told me to get a Vette, and you won't have to worry about running the AC....
or passing a gas station... ever. lol

[camrycev6]

In and of itself, the new Nats stadium is great. It feels like a theme park that happens to have a baseball game happening at the same time. No, it doesn't have that shrine feeling like Wrigley or the old Yankee stadium, and the location is terrible (Anacostia? Really?), but it's a fun place to hang out to watch baseball. Beats the hell out of RFK.

Well said Kain.

[camrycev6]

or passing a gas station... ever. lol

The Vette's overall EPA rating is only 1 less MPG than a MS3....

[opt_ms3]

citizens bank park ftw

[camrycev6]

citizens bank park ftw

Never been... How new / nice is it?

[Wagonbacker9]

The Vette's overall EPA rating is only 1 less MPG than a MS3....
depends which one you're talkin about... but point taken.

[opt_ms3]

Never been... How new / nice is it?

I think this is the 5th season its been used. beautiful park, I wish I could go more often

[MicaSp33d]

did you down shift?

i had 5 people in my car (including me) going up hill (pomona 10 east for socal people) and didn't have much of a problem going 100+, yea it works harder to get there with that much weight, but you appreciate that torque.

let me tell you my bros GTI mkv or my moms fx35 wouldn't be able to do it as well with 1 less person.

[camrycev6]

did you down shift?

i had 5 people in my car (including me) going up hill (pomona 10 east for socal people) and didn't have much of a problem going 100+, yea it works harder to get there with that much weight, but you appreciate that torque.

let me tell you my bros GTI mkv or my moms fx35 wouldn't be able to do it as well with 1 less person.

Yes... several times from several speeds. I did a 6 to 5th (several times), 5th to 4th (a couple), and one 4th to 3rd. All were noticibly more sluggish.

[camrycev6]

depends which one you're talkin about... but point taken.

Not giving you a hard time... I was just curious so I compared the 2009 base Vette versus the 2009 MS3 GT. It is amazing that we couldn't do better when we are more than 140 HP short of the Vette.

[Circle9]

Keep in mind that a Vette has some super long gearing I think its the Z06 that can do 65 mph in 1st, I may be wrong though. My dad has one, he gets around 20 mpg's and he drives like an old man. He can do 65 mph in 6th gear only doing about 1400 rpms.

[squidmotion]

i don't like the extra lbs. that my friends might add.... but i do like the way my car looks lower..... :)

[Circle9]

I get depressed when I have to drive people around in my car. They tend to dirty it all up and put scuffs everywhere.

I never put scuffs on my door panels, but a few eeks ago I take 3-4 people to the airport, they all get out and every goddamn single one of them scuffed my doors!! (bang) (chair)(argh)

Not having a family is a wise decision for me.

[camrycev6]

I get depressed when I have to drive people around in my car. They tend to dirty it all up and put scuffs everywhere.

I never put scuffs on my door panels, but a few eeks ago I take 3-4 people to the airport, they all get out and every goddamn single one of them scuffed my doors!! (bang) (chair)(argh)

Not having a family is a wise decision for me.

Really? I carry people around all the time... I don't have problems with that. What are they opening the doors with their feet?

[Sport6]

... So I was driving to DC last night to go to the Nationals game. (Yes...I had free tickets, otherwise I wouldn't bother.)

It was myself, my girlfriend, and two buddies. I was amazed at how sluggish the car felt when trying to accelerate or pass, but then I thought about it... I had an extra 625 (apprx) pounds in the car! That is a lot of mass to move...

It was so much nicer when I got in the car this morning and reconfirmed that all my MS3 needed was a diet!

Keep in mind that it still is a 4 cylinder, and out of boost it will be pretty sluggish. It will take an extra few seconds to get get going because of the weight.

Getting a vette would solve those problems only because it has 1 extra seat.. but ya it will be able to pick up and go better even if that 1 friend weighed 625 lbs. It has weigh more torque down low because it doesn't to boost to get it.

[camrycev6]

Keep in mind that it still is a 4 cylinder, and out of boost it will be pretty sluggish. It will take an extra few seconds to get get going because of the weight.

Getting a vette would solve those problems only because it has 1 extra seat.. but ya it will be able to pick up and go better even if that 1 friend weighed 625 lbs. It has weigh more torque down low because it doesn't to boost to get it.

It takes a moment to get into boost without people in the car. I am not saying this wasn't expected... I am just surprised how much a difference 625 pounds makes. It was like driving my old N/A Mazda 3.

[240ka]

I notice how much slower my car is with even one person in it. That's why I don't like anyone getting in my car if I want to drive fast ha.

Now with my system installed, the tires seem to spin easily having to pull that extra weight in the trunk. I want to find a circular piece of stiroform to put in place of my spare and take the spare out

[Wagonbacker9]

I notice how much slower my car is with even one person in it. That's why I don't like anyone getting in my car if I want to drive fast ha.

Now with my system installed, the tires seem to spin easily having to pull that extra weight in the trunk. I want to find a circular piece of stiroform to put in place of my spare and take the spare out
I'm gonna laugh when you come on telling the story of how you blew a tire the day of/day after you removed your spare... I know thats what would happen to me..

[240ka]

yeah, i keep thinking thats going to happen too ha

[Wurf]

The Vette's overall EPA rating is only 1 less MPG than a MS3....
And it seats how many?

[kickniteasy]

I know exactly what you mean.....because of a long story I had to drive around with a dormroom full of stuff for a week, as soon as I unloaded her it felt like I had installed a turbo! haha

[SubieKiller3]

Haha, just try carrying around 3 extra people in an Si - Oh yea! 139 lb'ft of torque!! (argh)
try it in a b16 si, 111 lb'ft of torque

[Circle9]

I do like those 99-01 Si's though, I'd like to get one in mint condition and make it a turbo project.

[MikeHTally]

... when turning off the AC was important if you wanted extra power. I know I probably don't need too, but I still turn off the AC if ...You definitely don't need to. Even my Ram and 300C turn the compressor off when I flat-foot the loud pedal.

[meicalnissyen]

The Vette's overall EPA rating is only 1 less MPG than a MS3....

Thats cuz the Vette is a poorly tuned V8 gashog made in america.......hey, wait a minute, has there been a shift in the natural order?(puke)

[bani]

... So I was driving to DC last night to go to the Nationals game. (Yes...I had free tickets, otherwise I wouldn't bother.)

It was myself, my girlfriend, and two buddies. I was amazed at how sluggish the car felt when trying to accelerate or pass, but then I thought about it... I had an extra 625 (apprx) pounds in the car! That is a lot of mass to move...

It was so much nicer when I got in the car this morning and reconfirmed that all my MS3 needed was a diet!

that is roughly how driving an ms6 feels. if you ever wondered.

[oaklandopen]

You definitely don't need to. Even my Ram and 300C turn the compressor off when I flat-foot the loud pedal.

yea it's any car...WOT and the AC compressor is dissengaged.

[Circle9]

Car companies need to come up with an AC system that doesn't hog so much power, I swear it steals 20-30 hp from my car every time its on!

[camrycev6]

yea it's any car...WOT and the AC compressor is dissengaged.

True. Newer cars do that. When I had it out Saturday, I could feel the air get warmer when I was really on the gas.

[Jasnall]

Ya i noticed a difference even when my 120lbs sister is in the seat, put 3 people in! Forget it, it feels so slow lol.

And I don't really notice any power diference with the AC on, nor does it effect my mileage that much. Still holding an average of 25mpg

[Circle9]

Averaging 27 mpg's here!

[MSMS3]

Acceleration in any vehicle is mostly a matter of the horsepower to weight ratio. Changes in weight affect lighter vehicles more than heavy ones because the ratio will change more in the lighter one.

As a general rule of thumb for drag racers in cars in the 3000-3500 lb range, each 100 pounds of weight will add one tenth of a second (about one car length) to the quarter mile time.

But add 100 pounds to a 6000 pound full size 4x4 SUV and it will have a much lower effect on performance. Add 100 pounds to a motorcycle and it will absolutely kill its performance.

Put 5 or 6 (say an extra 800 pounds, minimum) people in a MS3 and all of a sudden you are a full eight car lengths slower at WOT in the quarter.

[MicaSp33d]

also depends on how a car is tuned. SUVs and trucks torque ranges are very low. Even cars with the same engine but in a different type of car such as a g35 and fx35, the fx35 torque comes in sooner to help accelerate with the added weight but dies in the top end. Same 3.5VQ engine, just tuned differently.

[Wagonbacker9]

also depends on how a car is tuned. SUVs and trucks torque ranges are very low. Even cars with the same engine but in a different type of car such as a g35 and fx35, the fx35 torque comes in sooner to help accelerate with the added weight but dies in the top end. Same 3.5VQ engine, just tuned differently.

Just how "the same" those engines are varies. Is an engine the "same" if theres a different cam in it? Similar example is the KA24... used both in the Nissan trucks and 240SX of appropriate years... but if you swapped one for the other... you wouldn't recognize it as being the same engine. Even if you're not changing physical parts, todays ECUs can be retuned to basically shape the power curve however you see fit (within obvious limits of course)...

however, we've now strayed significantly from the OP's point.

[MicaSp33d]

Just how "the same" those engines are varies. Is an engine the "same" if theres a different cam in it? Similar example is the KA24... used both in the Nissan trucks and 240SX of appropriate years... but if you swapped one for the other... you wouldn't recognize it as being the same engine. Even if you're not changing physical parts, todays ECUs can be retuned to basically shape the power curve however you see fit (within obvious limits of course)...

however, we've now strayed significantly from the OP's point.

same motor platform sounds like a the same motor to me, just changes in cam timing and ecu tuning.

lol .. yea we are straying from the op topic

[tiagotiago]

Strange...I've driven both on highways and on mountain roads with 4 passengers in the car and really didn't feel that the car became sluggish. Now, I'm not gonna say it felt the same because that would just be an ugly fanboyish lie, but I shure as hell didn't feel it became sluggish.

Then again, on neither occasions did I really try to push the car, I was just squeezing the throttle just enough to keep me entertained/concentrated while leaving a big margin for error (mmm mountain road..drool). Maybe after almost 10 months of driving the car I still don't get used to all the torque :)

[camrycev6]

Strange...I've driven both on highways and on mountain roads with 4 passengers in the car and really didn't feel that the car became sluggish. Now, I'm not gonna say it felt the same because that would just be an ugly fanboyish lie, but I shure as hell didn't feel it became sluggish.

Then again, on neither occasions did I really try to push the car, I was just squeezing the throttle just enough to keep me entertained/concentrated while leaving a big margin for error (mmm mountain road..drool). Maybe after almost 10 months of driving the car I still don't get used to all the torque :)

I was trying to push the car.... perhaps that was the difference. Because I can tell you, she doesn't like to be pushed when full! (And doesn't cooperate.)