Got any fitness people in here?

[S.A.MSP]

Just trying to find out some good info and share experiences.

Been lifting on and off since high school but for the past 2 months i've been going 6 days a week, Protein and No-Explode are a big part of my work outs, on monday I will be starting Schwarzenegger's workout routine, pretty stoked for it, trying my hardest to eat right and i'm getting there. I also do a spinning and ab class every mon, tue. and wed. And try and play 3 games of Squash twice a week. So I think i'm on my way to fitness success!

So what do you do to stay fit or share your lifting tips and such!

[poison]

I'm not sure what Arnold's lifting routine is, but I'll venture that it's not right for you. If you're not very fit, anything will get you results, for a while. The problem is, bodybuilders routines are for bodybuilders. People think 'if it works for him, and he's huge, it'll work for me. Well, they use seriouly high volume, and don't train for well-rounded, overall usable strength. They are using steroids and growth hormone, eating great diets, and sleeping 8-10 hours a night. They work out for asthetics, and many aren't as strong as they could be. What works for them, is overtraining for us, because we don't have steroids to help with recovery, or the luxury of eating $1500 worth of food/month, and sleeping 10 hours.

I hate to promote it, but honestly, for most people, crossfit will do more for them than anything else. www.crossfit.com . It'll give you real world usable strength, awesome endurance, keep you cut, and looking like a Greek Olympian, all in ~30 minutes a day, 4-5 days a week.

In general, I strongly believe weight workouts should be under 45 minutes, and based on bench press, deadlift, squats, pullups, dips, and rows. I prefer sets of 1-5.

Personally, I do judo 2 hour 3 times a week, which is pretty brutal, physically. i try to do 2 two minute weight workouts a week just to keep muscle mass/strength, as judo burns a ton of calories.


You can do better than No-Xplode. Millennium Sport Ragnarok is a better formula, and IMO Millennium Sport Cre02 is the best strength/endurance enhancer out there (though it won't provide the stimulant effect of No-Xplode).

http://www.nutraplanet.com/search?query=ragnarok

http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/cre-02-90-ec-tabs.html


www.fitday.com is an awesome free tool, whether you are bulking or cutting. 99% of us have no clue how much we eat, or how much we NEED to eat to acheive our goals. Do it for a month, and watch progress accelerate!


Post up your new workout!

[S.A.MSP]

This is what i'll be doing, and I will succeed, without steroids, I do take other pills to help

I will start with light-medium weight and work my way up, challenges for me in the gym will be taken on, not turned down, no one will tell me I can't do someting, NEVER rush through your workout, NEVER, I sleep 8-9hrs a night so my recovery is good, I love spending time in the gym and here in Brazil, you want to stay, woman every where!! lol But seriously, I'm gonna do it!

MON, WED, FRI
Chest:
Bench press - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Flat bench flies - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Incline bench press - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Cable crossovers - 6 sets, 10-12 reps
Dips - 5 sets, to failure
Dumbbell pullovers - 5 sets, 10-12 reps

Back:
Front wide-grip chin-ups - 6 sets, to failure
T-bar rows - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Seated pulley rows - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
One-arm dumbbell rows - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Straight-leg deadlifts - 6 sets, 15 reps

Legs:
Squats - 6 sets, 8-12 reps
Leg presses - 6 sets, 8-12 reps
Leg extensions - 6 sets, 12-15 reps
Leg curls - 6 sets, 10-12 reps
Barbell lunges - 5 sets, 15 reps

Calves:
Standing calf raises -10 sets, 10 reps
Seated calf raises - 8 sets, 15 reps
One-legged calf raises (holding dumbbells) - 6 sets,12 reps

Forearms:
Wrist curls (forearms on knees) - 4 sets, 10 reps
Reverse barbell curls - 4 sets, 8 reps
Wright roller machine - to failure

Abs:
Nonstop instinct training for 30 minutes
TUES, THURS, SAT
Biceps:
Barbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Seated dumbbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Dumbbell concentration curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps

Triceps:
Close-grip bench presses (for the all three heads) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Pushdowns (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Barbell French presses (interior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
One-arm dumbbell triceps extensions (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps

Shoulders:
Seated barbell presses - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Lateral raises (standing) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Rear-delt lateral raises - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Cable lateral raises - 5 sets, 10-12 reps

Calves and Forearms:
Same as Monday, Wednesday and Friday

Abs:
Same as Monday, Wednesday and Friday.

[jred321]

p90x is what i currently do :) http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123731787&highlight=p90x bodybuilding isn't really my thing but fitness and sports are so p90x is a good compromise. i've done plenty of time in the gym in the past and will in the future but i'm enjoying this workout and will probably keep doing it for a while after i'm done, esp since soccer, softball and mtn biking will take up a few nights/week during the summer.

also, that workout above sounds like a clusterfuck and also like you'll be in the gym for way too long. if i were in brazil i'd rather be running on the beach than in a gym

[S.A.MSP]

I'm in Sao Paulo man, no beach, the beach is about an hour away, the workout is legit and I have the time to spend so i'm gonna do it, I wanted to do P90X, looks intense, great way to stay fit, i'm just more into building strenth and bulking up right now you know.

[Devilspawn]

I agree with poison on some accounts... I've read some of Arnold's routines, and I'm not sure which one you are doing but most were like 15-20+ sets all to failure fro one body part, which everyone just can't do(actually most people just can't do it), and likely get stuck by overtraining...In the end though, you have to find what works for you by trial and error

protein is key though, I will agree with that, but I'm not too keen on the NOexplode and other nitric oxide supplements... I'm still not in full belief that you are getting any of nitric oxide's effects when lifting as I have studied nitric oxide for several years during grad school and now(there is a good article about it out there by David Barr on this very subject... (http://www.t-nation.com/ALSAuthor.do?p=Dav%20Barr) scroll to the bottom).

There are many points in the article that I agree with since I've been doing research on nitric oxide for several years. I believe most of the effects that you feel from these products are from the caffiene that's in them, which eventually you get used to or you have to up to dosage eventually to feel the same effects(again just my 2 cents). I would stick with creatine(which you can get pretty cheap nowadays) and protein for now, and eat lots of wholesome foods and cut back on the processed stuff.

I stick with the core exercises as Poison mention above and throw in some of the more targeted exercises like flies, and curls from time to time...


this is basically what I do... I try to lift 5 days a week, and cardio when I have time unless I'm cutting body fat, then I up my cardio to at least 3 times of week... I eat 6 meals a day of of protein enriched foods, and take a multivitamin, fish oil, flax oil, and creatine for supplementation along with protein shakes post workout and before bed and/or whenever I need a quick meal... I also started using vitargo which is just a fast absorbing carb recently, which I'm begining to really like post workout...

good luck...

I haven't use crossfit or fitday, but I heard fitday is great for keep tracking of what you eat, and I have debated opening an account...

[S.A.MSP]

well the routine is pasted above, it's really not a hard routine when watching the weight, my cardio is spinning which is totally kickass

[Devilspawn]

This is what i'll be doing, and I will succeed, without steroids, I do take other pills to help

I will start with light-medium weight and work my way up, challenges for me in the gym will be taken on, not turned down, no one will tell me I can't do someting, NEVER rush through your workout, NEVER, I sleep 8-9hrs a night so my recovery is good, I love spending time in the gym and here in Brazil, you want to stay, woman every where!! lol But seriously, I'm gonna do it!

MON, WED, FRI
Chest:
Bench press - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Flat bench flies - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Incline bench press - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Cable crossovers - 6 sets, 10-12 reps
Dips - 5 sets, to failure
Dumbbell pullovers - 5 sets, 10-12 reps

Back:
Front wide-grip chin-ups - 6 sets, to failure
T-bar rows - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Seated pulley rows - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
One-arm dumbbell rows - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Straight-leg deadlifts - 6 sets, 15 reps

Legs:
Squats - 6 sets, 8-12 reps
Leg presses - 6 sets, 8-12 reps
Leg extensions - 6 sets, 12-15 reps
Leg curls - 6 sets, 10-12 reps
Barbell lunges - 5 sets, 15 reps

Calves:
Standing calf raises -10 sets, 10 reps
Seated calf raises - 8 sets, 15 reps
One-legged calf raises (holding dumbbells) - 6 sets,12 reps

Forearms:
Wrist curls (forearms on knees) - 4 sets, 10 reps
Reverse barbell curls - 4 sets, 8 reps
Wright roller machine - to failure

Abs:
Nonstop instinct training for 30 minutes
TUES, THURS, SAT
Biceps:
Barbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Seated dumbbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Dumbbell concentration curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps

Triceps:
Close-grip bench presses (for the all three heads) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Pushdowns (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Barbell French presses (interior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
One-arm dumbbell triceps extensions (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps

Shoulders:
Seated barbell presses - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Lateral raises (standing) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Rear-delt lateral raises - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Cable lateral raises - 5 sets, 10-12 reps

Calves and Forearms:
Same as Monday, Wednesday and Friday

Abs:
Same as Monday, Wednesday and Friday.

this is very hard to understand... you do full body MWF?

[jred321]

i'm not a big fan of supplementing beyond a whey protein. in college i tried a few different things and for the most part i found them worthless.

[jred321]

I'm in Sao Paulo man, no beach, the beach is about an hour away
so move :)

[S.A.MSP]

It's not full body and what is hard to understand, it's easy man lol

[S.A.MSP]

so move :)

Nah, my work is in SP, need to be here, it's not bad, just no beach, short trip and i'm there though, any drive less than 3hrs is short for me

[jred321]

how long will those workouts take/day? 3 hours?

[Devilspawn]

I'm in Sao Paulo man, no beach, the beach is about an hour away, the workout is legit and I have the time to spend so i'm gonna do it, I wanted to do P90X, looks intense, great way to stay fit, i'm just more into building strenth and bulking up right now you know.

if this is the case you should definitely stick to the core movements such as squats, bench press deadlifts etc...

have you ever tried the 5x5 program... I heard it works great... I'm going to try it this summer as it only requires you to be in the gym 3 days a week, which leave more time for fun, but is a solid program from what I hear...

http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/

you can download everything you need for free including the excel spreadsheet to keep track of your prgress...

[Devilspawn]

It's not full body and what is hard to understand, it's easy man lol

you didn't divide anything up...

you put MWF
chest, back, legs, calves, forearms....

so to me that means you do all of those MWF... that's a full body workout 3 times a week...


????

your program stated above as I see screams overtraining...

I do a two day on, one day off split.. and sometimes 2 days off depending on the need of recovery...

so I normally do 2-1-2-1-2-2-repeat thing(bold are days lifting, unbold is days resting)

with each training day divided into body parts

so chest-back-rest-shoulders-legs-rest-abs/arms or abs/cardio-chest-rest-rest-and so on..

[Omar MSP]

the things im reading here are for people that want to be some crazy can't wipe your own ass kinda person...

i'd say, if you make it a regular routine 3 sets of this and that, that will make you pretty fit. above average. and keep your weights light, whats the point of lifting 300lbs if you can only lift it once or twice? repetitions are what work the muscle.

[S.A.MSP]

Tri's Bi's and shoulders are the other days, I know hey still get workout by doing back and chest but they are not focused upon, so not really full body, but might move upper legs to tues. thurs. and sat.

[S.A.MSP]

C'mon guys, i'm not gonna be lifting the worlds weight, cause I like wiping my own ass, but the routine, the workout is great and I want to try it, I will see if it works for me or not

And gym time is fun for me, I really enjoy it I have the time so I do it, I have lots of fun time after the gym too to play Squash, weekend at the beach, out at night and what not, I love working out, it's my hobby and enjoyment, I don't look at it as "ugh I HAVE to do this."

[Devilspawn]

the things im reading here are for people that want to be some crazy can't wipe your own ass kinda person...

i'd say, if you make it a regular routine 3 sets of this and that, that will make you pretty fit. above average. and keep your weights light, whats the point of lifting 300lbs if you can only lift it once or twice? repetitions are what work the muscle.

no one said anything about lifting 300 lbs once or twice... we all talked about about doing sets with reps not doing max outs... and p90x will definitely not get you huge to the point where you can't touch your toes and neither will anything I suggested... I do do three sets of this or that each workout, and I never go for weight that I can't do at least do 4 times...I don't even know what my max lift is on anything... I don't care...

my normal sets are 4x12,10,8, 6 or 4x10, 8, 6, 4 or 3x10... depending on how I want to switch it up...

you can wipe your own ass and have muscle and definition too without losing flexibility if you do everything right... stretching, yoga, plyometrics, sports along with solid weight training...

[S.A.MSP]

^^Exactly

[Devilspawn]

C'mon guys, i'm not gonna be lifting the worlds weight, cause I like wiping my own ass, but the routine, the workout is great and I want to try it, I will see if it works for me or not

And gym time is fun for me, I really enjoy it I have the time so I do it, I have lots of fun time after the gym too to play Squash, weekend at the beach, out at night and what not, I love working out, it's my hobby and enjoyment, I don't look at it as "ugh I HAVE to do this."

you gotta find what works for you man... if the above workout works for you then by all means stick with it...your body will tell you if it's working or not... not us... it worked for arnold, it might work for you too...

but if it doesn't... there are some suggestions above on things you might want to try...

keep it up man... I luv lifting too...

[Omar MSP]

my cousin is doing the p90x its working out for him

[jred321]

you can wipe your own ass and have muscle and definition too without losing flexibility if you do everything right... stretching, yoga, plyometrics, sports along with solid weight training...
p90x is fun and has all of those :) i did yoga last night. tonight is back, legs and abs. tomorrow is kenpo (or maybe a run if it's a nice day since it's the weekend). definitely not going to build bulk with it though. good definition and all around fitness is its focus


and i benched 300lbs 2 times once just to see if i could. what of it? :)

[Devilspawn]

my cousin is doing the p90x its working out for him

yeah it's working for jred(poster in this thread) too... I might try it eventually, but in no means do I want to lean out right now so it's not for me...

I wouldn't mind doing the yoga parts though now to increase flexibility

[S.A.MSP]

you gotta find what works for you man... if the above workout works for you then by all means stick with it...your body will tell you if it's working or not... not us... it worked for arnold, it might work for you too...

but if it doesn't... there are some suggestions above on things you might want to try...

keep it up man... I luv lifting too...

Yeah man that's what i'm trying to say, i'm starting that workout on monday in good faith that I will gain results, I crave working out, it's wierd lol, my dad works out with me and I push him and he bigger than I am, he needs to cut fat and gain muscle but he's a strong mo-fo, I think this workout will fuel my craving, my dad needs a different workout though, like P90X, something where you are rapidly moving about to keep your heart rate up.

Now I don't wanna brag but when I had a trainer back in '05 I maxed 800lbs on leg press while weighing in at 165lbs, would be really nice if I could do that again, I think these workouts will get me there with the help of meat and potatoes lol

[coololddude]

stick with weight-lifting for life. you will never regret it. you will run into tons of EXPERTS along the way. the truth is, weight training is great for working every major muscle in the body in a short time. every major sport includes weight training in their conditioning. (yes even Tiger Woods!!) back in the day the Germans were kicking the USA WOMENS swimming team. the team began lifting and kicked the West Germans butts. (in swimming you pot heads!!) forget the muscle-bound crap, athletes work out according to the sport. a 300lb. lift is ok for a linebacker. (actually, a bit on the weak side) best of luck in your journey.

[S.A.MSP]

Thank you sir, much appreciated :)

[poison]

This is what i'll be doing, and I will succeed, without steroids, I do take other pills to help

I will start with light-medium weight and work my way up, challenges for me in the gym will be taken on, not turned down, no one will tell me I can't do someting, NEVER rush through your workout, NEVER, I sleep 8-9hrs a night so my recovery is good, I love spending time in the gym and here in Brazil, you want to stay, woman every where!! lol But seriously, I'm gonna do it!

MON, WED, FRI
Chest:
Bench press - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Flat bench flies - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Incline bench press - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Cable crossovers - 6 sets, 10-12 reps
Dips - 5 sets, to failure
Dumbbell pullovers - 5 sets, 10-12 reps

Back:
Front wide-grip chin-ups - 6 sets, to failure
T-bar rows - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Seated pulley rows - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
One-arm dumbbell rows - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Straight-leg deadlifts - 6 sets, 15 reps

Legs:
Squats - 6 sets, 8-12 reps
Leg presses - 6 sets, 8-12 reps
Leg extensions - 6 sets, 12-15 reps
Leg curls - 6 sets, 10-12 reps
Barbell lunges - 5 sets, 15 reps

Calves:
Standing calf raises -10 sets, 10 reps
Seated calf raises - 8 sets, 15 reps
One-legged calf raises (holding dumbbells) - 6 sets,12 reps

Forearms:
Wrist curls (forearms on knees) - 4 sets, 10 reps
Reverse barbell curls - 4 sets, 8 reps
Wright roller machine - to failure

Abs:
Nonstop instinct training for 30 minutes
TUES, THURS, SAT
Biceps:
Barbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Seated dumbbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Dumbbell concentration curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps

Triceps:
Close-grip bench presses (for the all three heads) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Pushdowns (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Barbell French presses (interior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
One-arm dumbbell triceps extensions (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps

Shoulders:
Seated barbell presses - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Lateral raises (standing) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps
Rear-delt lateral raises - 5 sets, 6-10 reps
Cable lateral raises - 5 sets, 10-12 reps

Calves and Forearms:
Same as Monday, Wednesday and Friday

Abs:
Same as Monday, Wednesday and Friday.


Not to rain on your parade, but that's a crappy, inefficient way to your goal. Far too much motion with low payback, is what you're looking at. You could go twice as far with half the effort.



challenges for me in the gym will be taken on, not turned down, no one will tell me I can't do someting

I admire the sentiment, but it's misguided. Here's a challenge: take a 2kg dumbell in each hand. Walk up to a wall, sit into a squat position against the wall, and hold your arms out to the sides, straight at shoulder level. I guarantee you you won't last 10 minutes, not even close. There's a challenge, GO!


See? Some challenges are dumb, with no purpose. Sure, it hurts, and you'll be a sweating, quivering mass at the end, but you didn't acheive anything concrete, or stimulate your body in a purposful way. Taking my challenge as an example, the only thing it would do for you is make you better at squatting into a wall and holding 2kg dumbells up. Your workout will only make you better at...your workout, and barely that, because in order to be able to complete it, you'll be lifting little girl weights.

Cut the volume in 1/4, lift manly weights, and enjoy looking like this:

http://jayfan.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/013k.jpg

http://www.gymjones.com/knowledge.php?id=35

[poison]

C'mon guys, i'm not gonna be lifting the worlds weight, cause I like wiping my own ass, but the routine, the workout is great and I want to try it, I will see if it works for me or not

And gym time is fun for me, I really enjoy it I have the time so I do it, I have lots of fun time after the gym too to play Squash, weekend at the beach, out at night and what not, I love working out, it's my hobby and enjoyment, I don't look at it as "ugh I HAVE to do this."


You can choose a workout which fits your needs, and still have tons of fun. :)

As my powerlifting buddy says, "Less is usually more". THe OP is about to find this out. ;)lol


Enjoy the workouts, keep updating here!

[S.A.MSP]

So, like I said, I started the workout last night, took me almost 3 hours but it was solid and exciting as hell!!

My shoulders are weak, not gonna suger coat it, I hurt them back in HS so i'm taking it easy.

At the end of every exercise I put the weight x sets, the reps varied from 6-10.

MON, WED, FRI
Biceps:
Barbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (44lbs 6 sets)
Seated dumbbell curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (33lbs 6 sets)
Dumbbell concentration curls - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (22lbs x2, 28lbs x2, 33lbs x2)

Triceps:
Close-grip bench presses (for the all three heads) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (44lbs x2, 66lbs x3, 88lbs x1)
Pushdowns (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (77x2, 88x2, 99x2)
Barbell French presses (interior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (44x4, 62x2)
One-arm dumbbell triceps extensions (exterior head) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (22x6)

Shoulders:
Seated barbell presses - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (22x2, 36x2, 44x2)
Lateral raises (standing) - 6 sets, 6-10 reps (11x6)
Rear-delt lateral raises - 5 sets, 6-10 reps (11x6)
Cable lateral raises - 5 sets, 10-12 reps (11x5)

Calves:
Standing calf raises -10 sets, 10 reps (154x10)
Seated calf raises - 8 sets, 15 reps (77x8)
One-legged calf raises (holding dumbbells) - 6 sets,12 reps (skipped)

Forearms:
Wrist curls (forearms on knees) - 4 sets, 10 reps (20x4)
Reverse barbell curls - 4 sets, 8 reps (44x3, 51x1)
Wright roller machine - to failure (don’t have that)

Abs:
Nonstop instinct training for 30 minutes (ran out of time)

[poison]

:sigh: 3 hours, huh? Did you know that after 45-60 minutes of hard weight training, your cortisol levels spike like crazy? Cortisol is the enemy, in this context. It is a catabolic hormone, and prevents a positive nitrogen balance, prevents muscle synthesis, promotes fat storage, and lowers testosterone. Sound good? Correct, it's not.

Again, beating a dead horse, but the only reason these workouts exist is because the people doing them, bodybuilders, are using a pharmacy's worth of chemical help, over-riding cortisol, and boosting testosterone to supra-physical levels.

Good luck, dude.

[S.A.MSP]

Do you understand the concept of "Trying" the workout? Cause that's what i'm doing, you don't need to be a tool about it, I am taking testosterone boosters among other things. But I find it hilarious when poelple judge me without even knowing anything about me or my gym experience. I'm no stranger to the gym, I know for the most part what i'm doing, I don't kill myself in there, I took my time with the workout keeping my heart rate pumping so it wasn't a super hard workout, it was fun and i'll keep doing it till my body tells me otherwise, so we'll see.

I'm not saying you are wrong ok, you seem to have alot of knowledge but would you mind just being somewhat positive towards me please.

[nocoastgangster]

I just finished a thousand situps.

[S.A.MSP]

har har

[Devilspawn]

haven't been to the gym in almost 3 days now... damn allergies and headaches...


I feel so lost :)

[S.A.MSP]

Had spinning and ab class this morning, it was brutal!!!

[poison]

Do you understand the concept of "Trying" the workout? Cause that's what i'm doing, you don't need to be a tool about it, I am taking testosterone boosters among other things. But I find it hilarious when poelple judge me without even knowing anything about me or my gym experience. I'm no stranger to the gym, I know for the most part what i'm doing, I don't kill myself in there, I took my time with the workout keeping my heart rate pumping so it wasn't a super hard workout, it was fun and i'll keep doing it till my body tells me otherwise, so we'll see.

I'm not saying you are wrong ok, you seem to have alot of knowledge but would you mind just being somewhat positive towards me please.

Sorry, man. I just hate to see people waste their time. Many people try some 'killer workout' some pro showed them, or they read about in Muscular Development, and when they don't make progress, they leave they gym totally. Give up. Sad, because it's not that 'the gym isn't for them', they're using the wrong tool for the job. I know you aren't one of those, but still.

If it's radically different from your normal workout, and you do it for a short time, you might get some gains. I'll shut up now.

[S.A.MSP]

I won't be running away from the gym man, I def. appreciate your concern though ;)
I really do love the gym, i've tried many different routines and when I was in the best shape ever I was 18 and had a trainer only three times a week, so that worked great for me, right now I have a lot of time on my hands so I spend it at the gym, in fact, I should get ahold of the trainer I had back then and see if he remembers that routine so I could try it again if this doesn't pan out.

[SpooledupRacing]

Ok guys any good exercise I can do to promote weight loss and give me more energy.. I got a bad heart so lifting weights is not going to happen, I'm not rich enough for a gym membership but I need to start getting healthier and drop more lbs.

[coyfish]

Ok guys any good exercise I can do to promote weight loss and give me more energy.. I got a bad heart so lifting weights is not going to happen, I'm not rich enough for a gym membership but I need to start getting healthier and drop more lbs.

Eating frequent balanced meals will help keep your metabolism moving and keep your appetite down.

Without going to a gym your not giving yourself many options. Try walking / jogging/ biking / swimming.

Do some intervals or low intensity 45min-1hour workouts. Good for your heart and fat loss.

[SpeedMetal-7]

not a fitness buff,
in training for the military, considering i can shed the lbs...

i cut my eating habits, and i run 3mis / 3x a week, plus a little weight lifting

gotta drop to 200, trying to become a pararescue jumper

[SpooledupRacing]

cant do any running and I dont know how to swim...

I can do minimal weight lifting just nothing over the top.. I mean my job has me carrying 30-50lb items many times through out the day..
so dumbells or something like that I can add into the rep.

I'm not to worried about losing the weight I can do that on my own quite well but I would like to lose my stomach more then anything.. I dropped 30lbs a few months back and looked good and my stomach was much smaller however I want to lose the stomach and tone up.

[jred321]

getting fit without raising your heartrate too high is going to be tough. i'd talk to your dr

[SpeedMetal-7]

y cant you run? sports injury....

honestly,
your suppose to start walking for 10days and each week following pick up the pace til you find yourself jogging, than work on running....

i got my advice from a health nut i use to bang on the regular...

[SpooledupRacing]

I have a bad heart.. so running is out of the question.. it would over stress my heart to much.

another question.. do energy drinks do anything or the vitamins/minerals they provide help at all..

AMP, NOS, etc have Taurine, Guawana (sp) etc any benifit in drinking these?

[S.A.MSP]

nah, not for a workout

[SpooledupRacing]

Another question.. What is the target calprie intake, protien intake carb etc..

I'm 5'7" 165lbs

looking to get down to 140ish

was 185 back in Nov. made it down to 149 and then went back to fast food living GAH!

I used www.Fitday.com

as of right now (2:15pm EST) I am at:
666 calories
5.3G of fat
123.2g Carbs
32g protien

granted I did not have breakfast which I will start with tomorrow. my breakfast today was apple juice and 2 fat free fig newtons.

[S.A.MSP]

I think stick to Fitday man, if it worked in the past it'll work again!! :)

[coyfish]

You can walk, swim, or bike.

I don't think there is any benefit of drinking energy drinks. Many have caffeine or other stuff which may slightly boost metabolism but not significantly. I would say your better off drinking green tea with EeMg which also bumps your metabolism slightly. Im a triathlete and sometimes I drink a monster before my workouts but it makes me jittery and increases my HR.

I don't think there is anything bad about drinking the sugar / carb free energy drinks so you could try them although they are a bit pricey.

[SpooledupRacing]

I think stick to Fitday man, if it worked in the past it'll work again!! :)


just started fitday today.. my last diet was just me eating less, smaller portions and no fast food however I think I did not eat the RIGHT STUFF and maybe I could have done better with more protien etc.

[SpooledupRacing]

You can walk, swim, or bike.

I don't think there is any benefit of drinking energy drinks. Many have caffeine or other stuff which may slightly boost metabolism but not significantly. I would say your better off drinking green tea with EeMg which also bumps your metabolism slightly. Im a triathlete and sometimes I drink a monster before my workouts but it makes me jittery and increases my HR.

I don't think there is anything bad about drinking the sugar / carb free energy drinks so you could try them although they are a bit pricey.



SHHH..... cant swim.. I dont know how lol..

I plan to bike this summer.. buy a bike and get to it..

I dont know if there is a benifit I dont get the jitters however I am sure the added caffeene is not good for my heart.. mainly why I stopped drinking soda over 10 years ago. I just didnt want to polute my body with the caffeene etc.

ok taking the energy drinks off the shelf now

[jred321]

I have a bad heart.. so running is out of the question.. it would over stress my heart to much.
seriously ask your dr. your heart isn't something you want to mess with or something you want to take advice from people over the internet on who have no idea about your medical history. your dr will be able to give you some good ideas


another question.. do energy drinks do anything or the vitamins/minerals they provide help at all..

AMP, NOS, etc have Taurine, Guawana (sp) etc any benifit in drinking these?
the best fitness drink is water.

[coyfish]

Another question.. What is the target calprie intake, protien intake carb etc..

I'm 5'7" 165lbs

looking to get down to 140ish

was 185 back in Nov. made it down to 149 and then went back to fast food living GAH!

I used www.Fitday.com

as of right now (2:15pm EST) I am at:
666 calories
5.3G of fat
123.2g Carbs
32g protien

granted I did not have breakfast which I will start with tomorrow. my breakfast today was apple juice and 2 fat free fig newtons.


Counting calories is a PITA. Just watch the scale and weigh yourself every morning. Also eat healthier. You need more protein in your diet. Fig newtons in the morning isn't the best option :). Try and get a whole grain cereal low in bad sugar (high fructose corn syrup). Kashi makes good cereals that taste great. You could also do the Kashi whole grain waffles with sugar free / low cal syrup.

Calorie intake depends on you and your metabolism. Just find what it takes to lose 2-3 lbs a week by watching your scale. Try to eat frequently and make sure you eat breakfast. Gets your metabolism moving. Also try and drink less "empty calories" if you do. This includes juices, reg sodas, smoothies, etc. Skim milk and water is really all you need. You can get your vitamin / mineral from fruits / vegetables. No need to drink a concentrated apple juice "sugar shot."

Lastly try to ease up on the carbs before bedtime. Ideally you want your biggest carb meal to be early in the day. Basically its not a good idea to have pasta, potatoe, lots of bread, etc. after 7pmish if your trying to lose weight.

I did a bodybuilding show a couple years ago so I know a good deal about nutrition and now I do traithlons for fun. Let me know if you have any more q's and ill do my best to help.

[SpooledupRacing]

seriously ask your dr. your heart isn't something you want to mess with or something you want to take advice from people over the internet on who have no idea about your medical history. your dr will be able to give you some good ideas


the best fitness drink is water.


he has always told me walking is great for my heart (and sex) lol.. I dont have a family doctor only my cardiologist and I talk to him every few years..

[S.A.MSP]

Do the sex one! Great all body workout!! lol seriously though it is, but you have to make sure you do ALL the work!

[SpooledupRacing]

Counting calories is a PITA. Just watch the scale and weigh yourself every morning. Also eat healthier. You need more protein in your diet. Fig newtons in the morning isn't the best option :). Try and get a whole grain cereal low in bad sugar (high fructose corn syrup). Kashi makes good cereals that taste great. You could also do the Kashi whole grain waffles with sugar free / low cal syrup.

Calorie intake depends on you and your metabolism. Just find what it takes to lose 2-3 lbs a week by watching your scale. Try to eat frequently and make sure you eat breakfast. Gets your metabolism moving. Also try and drink less "empty calories" if you do. This includes juices, reg sodas, smoothies, etc. Skim milk and water is really all you need. You can get your vitamin / mineral from fruits / vegetables. No need to drink a concentrated apple juice "sugar shot."

Lastly try to ease up on the carbs before bedtime. Ideally you want your biggest carb meal to be early in the day. Basically its not a good idea to have pasta, potatoe, lots of bread, etc. after 7pmish if your trying to lose weight.

I did a bodybuilding show a couple years ago so I know a good deal about nutrition and now I do traithlons for fun. Let me know if you have any more q's and ill do my best to help.



Yeah Im not looking to "count" anything.. I am going to eat what I put in my mouth (good stuff of course) and then put them in the scale and see where I end up at the end of the day but I was curious to know a round about..

I was reading the following

2000 calories a day is about right if u are getting the right calories
50% of your daily makeup should be carbs
protien should be about 130g a day for my weight/body fat content
fat should be 30g or under a day for my weight/height/age

any of this sound right..

I was going to start walking (walk the dogs)
biking (nothing crazy just a nice pace ride every other day)
possibly do some cardio (like get a punching bag and work that for 30min every other day, opposite day of bike ride)

[coyfish]

Yep that sounds good. What you don't want is to start starving yourself. Your not that big (hard to tell w/out knowing your BF) but i think its safe to say eating better / more frequently and still eat enough to keep you satisfied will work for you. Mix that with some moderate cardio. Try to go for long bike rides if you can. They don't have to be intense by any means. Low intensity high duration excersizes burn a higher % of fat. Still good to push yourself as much as your heart allows so you can get cardiovascular benefit as well.

Dont forget about unsaturated fats as well. They are important. Olive oil is a good source. I toss a spoonfull into my rice or whatever every other day.

[SpooledupRacing]

Yep that sounds good. What you don't want is to start starving yourself. Your not that big (hard to tell w/out knowing your BF) but i think its safe to say eating better / more frequently and still eat enough to keep you satisfied will work for you. Mix that with some moderate cardio. Try to go for long bike rides if you can. They don't have to be intense by any means. Low intensity high duration excersizes burn a higher % of fat. Still good to push yourself as much as your heart allows so you can get cardiovascular benefit as well.

Dont forget about unsaturated fats as well. They are important. Olive oil is a good source. I toss a spoonfull into my rice or whatever every other day.


I believe my BF is about 26% I have to have it checked again.

I use olive oil when I cook.. its the only oil I will use.

As for breakfast I will get back to eggs, turkey bacon and a couple pieces of whole wheat toast.

I wont starve myself but I think I was doing that a touch the last time (maybe how I lost 30lbs in like 3 months).

[jred321]

go with egg whites instead of eggs :)


my breakfast of choice lately is oatmeal with chocolate protein powder mixed in and a piece of fruit. then either milk or water to wash it all down

[SpooledupRacing]

now I have heard that like 1 egg whites and 1 full egg a day for breakish if scramble

[jred321]

egg whites are much healthier. it's like all of the good stuff in an egg without any of the bad. people probably complain that they don't taste as good but i'm perfectly fine with them


from http://www.ochef.com/950.htm

The white of a large egg, or about 1-1/4 ounces, has 16 calories, 3 g of protein, 2 mg of calcium, 4 mg of phosphorus, 55 mg of sodium, 45 mg of potassium, the weensiest little bit of riboflavin, and no fat, cholesterol, or carbohydrates.
The yolk of that egg weighs about 2/3 of an ounce, and has 59 calories, 3 g of protein, 5 g of fat (2 of which are saturated), 212 mg of cholesterol, 23 mg of calcium, 81 mg of phosphorus, 7 mg of sodium, 16 mg of potassium, very small amounts of iron, thiamin, and riboflavin, and no carbohydrates.

[SpooledupRacing]

gottcha... so do u boil your eggs then and just eat the whites?

I like boiled egg whites and have no problem eating them at all.

[jred321]

i always scramble my eggs. when i eat egg whites i just buy one of the pre-separated cartons at the grocery store, measure out how many eggs i want and then cook it. i'm lazy. you could probably boil the egg then eat just the white. then you need to figure out what to do with the nerf ball that is left over

[SpooledupRacing]

I'll give the nerf ball to the dogs lol..

I was figuring I could toss the eggs in a pot to boil whil eI get dressed and cleaned up.
toss in a few pieces of turkey bacon and 2 pieces of toast and be good.

I also heard that peanut butter on whole wheat toast is good to.

[jred321]

real natural peanut butter is good for you. check the label before buying. normal peanut butter has a ton of sugar and salt. even a lot of the ones labeled "natural" have salt added. just give the label a look before buying and you'll be fine

[SpooledupRacing]

awsome.. will do..

[coyfish]

yolks are still good for you. Still no evidence that egg yolks lead to high "bad cholesterol." Everything in moderation though. When I was bodybuilding I ate like 8 hard boiled egg whites before bed which was gross. I cant touch a hard boiled egg anymore :). What I do is use 1 whole egg and 3 egg whites and scramble them. Throw that between 2 slices of whole grain bread and there ya go!

[SpooledupRacing]

awsome.. so I will go back and forth with hard boiled and scrambled..

Cant wait to start.. WOOT WOOT

[Devilspawn]

Counting calories is a PITA. Just watch the scale and weigh yourself every morning. Also eat healthier. You need more protein in your diet. Fig newtons in the morning isn't the best option :). Try and get a whole grain cereal low in bad sugar (high fructose corn syrup). Kashi makes good cereals that taste great. You could also do the Kashi whole grain waffles with sugar free / low cal syrup.

Calorie intake depends on you and your metabolism. Just find what it takes to lose 2-3 lbs a week by watching your scale. Try to eat frequently and make sure you eat breakfast. Gets your metabolism moving. Also try and drink less "empty calories" if you do. This includes juices, reg sodas, smoothies, etc. Skim milk and water is really all you need. You can get your vitamin / mineral from fruits / vegetables. No need to drink a concentrated apple juice "sugar shot."

Lastly try to ease up on the carbs before bedtime. Ideally you want your biggest carb meal to be early in the day. Basically its not a good idea to have pasta, potatoe, lots of bread, etc. after 7pmish if your trying to lose weight.

I did a bodybuilding show a couple years ago so I know a good deal about nutrition and now I do traithlons for fun. Let me know if you have any more q's and ill do my best to help.

+1

but what's in bold is an accepted myth I believe based on your activity level and requirements... your body doesn't know what time it is and doesn't care...as long as you keep your macros in check for your goals you can eat breads and stuff after 7pm...

5. Don’t eat after 7 p.m.: What do people on graveyard shifts do? There is no time for them to eat. Other countries eat after 7 p.m. everyday and they are half the size of Americans. Our bodies need energy. Most people say that it is bad to eat a big meal before going to bed. The bad part isn’t the meal it is the big part. We need to eat every 2-3 hours no matter what time of the day it is. Your body doesn’t know the difference between 10 p.m. and 10 a.m. Your body can burn 90% of your energy as fat while you are sleeping as long as we are not starving it before we go to bed.

from: http://www.liveleantoday.com/article.cfm?id=372
Diet Myth #1: Don't Eat After 7 p.m

Diet gurus warn us not to eat late in the evening. The logic seems to be that calories consumed at night are more likely to be stored as fat due to lack of activity. But what time you eat really has no bearing on how much weight you lose. Whether you snack early in the day or right before bed, the weight loss equation is still the same; if you consume more calories during the day than you burn with physical activity, you won't lose any weight.

Read more: Dieting Myths: Four Popular Diet Myths Exposed - http://diet-trends.suite101.com/article.cfm/dieting_myths#ixzz0C7aXZ8ED


CARB MYTH #2: EATING CARBS AT NIGHT MAKES YOU FAT
Many dieters restrict their carb intake at night, limiting them-selves to protein powder, poultry, fish and vegetables sometime after 5 p.m. The belief is that carbs eaten at night will unequivocally be stored as bodyfat, which is generally true, as insulin sensitivity decreases at night. But here's the problem: If you train after work at 7 p.m. and finish by 9, you must eat carbohydrates in your post-training meal to kick-start the muscle-building process. If you avoid carbohydrates you'll fail to support the growth process and, worse, it could increase your cortisol, a hormone that can lower testosterone levels and chew away muscle mass, causing a drop in your metabolic rate. That's the biggest concern, because when the metabolic rate declines, the body becomes really good at storing bodyfat.


MYTH BUSTER: Consume 50 grams of carbohydrates (in addition to protein) to kick-start the rebuilding process in the meal following your workout. If you don't gain bodyfat from eating that much, boost it to 70-80 grams.


from: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0801/is_9_66/ai_n14921214/

[jred321]

i agree with john. it's not when you eat but what you eat. the food that people usually eat after 7pm is not typically healthy. it's going to be dessert, chips, snacks, etc..., all of which will make you fat. when is the last time it was 9 and you said "i want a salad" or "some whole wheat pasta would be great right now." that just doesn't happen. so if you say don't eat after 7 it just simplifies things.

though i know there is research both ways so meh

[SpooledupRacing]

Once I sit down for "tv time" the only thing I normally will eat is water/skim milk and maybe some popcorn (not buttery normally salt and pepper popcorn)

[Devilspawn]

i always scramble my eggs. when i eat egg whites i just buy one of the pre-separated cartons at the grocery store, measure out how many eggs i want and then cook it. i'm lazy. you could probably boil the egg then eat just the white. then you need to figure out what to do with the nerf ball that is left over

yup... I buy the cartons as well as well as use an egg seperator and seperate the yolk from the egg whites and scramble... I normally do 2 whole eggs, 2 egg whites from real eggs(using egg seperator), and 1/2 cup of egg white from a carton... add some seasoning and scramble...

it comes out to about 2 yolks and about 7-8 egg whites total... I adjust this according to my needs... like if I'm cutting on calories... 1 whole egg and 4 egg whites... which would be 1 yolk and 5 egg whites...

[Devilspawn]

real natural peanut butter is good for you. check the label before buying. normal peanut butter has a ton of sugar and salt. even a lot of the ones labeled "natural" have salt added. just give the label a look before buying and you'll be fine


yeah natural peanut butter is great...

[SpooledupRacing]

you eat that many eggs every morning?

[Devilspawn]

you eat that many eggs every morning?

I eat that many eggs everyday... I wouldn't say I eat them every morning, but I make them every morning... I'm having them right now actually :)

I added some spinach in them today... it's a spinach egg white omelete with 2 yolks

[Devilspawn]

my first meal of the day is normally a protein shake with 1/2 to 1 cup of dry oats blended in... I adjust the amount of oats to how much carbs I will need or plan to eat that day... if I come up short or over I can always add or not add dry oats to another protein shake(post workout shake for example) later...

[coyfish]

But your body DOES know what time it is :). When you enter REM sleep your sympathetic nervous system takes over. Sleep is a pretty important and unique state vital to healthy body function. This goes for people with normal schedules (not people who work nightshifts etc.) I never said DON't eat carbs close to bedtime and I think people who eat no carbs after 5 is a little crazy. Thats the myth imo. Basically what you don't want is to have lasagna or pasta or something like that before bed. There is no rule to what does and does not turn to fat. Its unique to every individual. It just makes sense to eat more when you expend more energy and eat less when you don't . . . I get your point about people who workout late at night. They will have to eat a big meal an hour or so afterwards.

That is the whole reasoning behind eating smaller frequent meals throughout the day. Nowadays there are theories / studies backing up pretty much every aspect of nutrition but I try and live my life as balanced as possible in every aspect. It hasn't steared me wrong yet !

[Devilspawn]

But your body DOES know what time it is :). When you enter REM sleep your sympathetic nervous system takes over. Sleep is a pretty important and unique state vital to healthy body function. This goes for people with normal schedules (not people who work nightshifts etc.) I never said DON't eat carbs close to bedtime and I think people who eat no carbs after 5 is a little crazy. Thats the myth imo. Basically what you don't want is to have lasagna or pasta or something like that before bed. There is no rule to what does and does not turn to fat. Its unique to every individual. It just makes sense to eat more when you expend more energy and eat less when you don't . . . I get your point about people who workout late at night. They will have to eat a big meal an hour or so afterwards.

That is the whole reasoning behind eating smaller frequent meals throughout the day. Nowadays there are theories / studies backing up pretty much every aspect of nutrition but I try and live my life as balanced as possible in every aspect. It hasn't steared me wrong yet !

I agree...

I just didn't want him to think that he shouldn't have potatoes, bread or pasta after 7pm if that's not what fits him is what I was getting at... if you need this stuff after 7pm you do... I mentioned nothing about bedtime because not all bedtimes is the same and agreed of course that wouldn't apply to people who work late or workout late. Your body definitely knows REM sleep, and sleep is one of the most important states for gaining or losing weight, but telling someone to generally not eat certain carbs after 7pm is sort of misleading.. that's all that I was getting at...I do agree though that you should ease of up the carbs before bedtime... by then you should have gotten mostly what you need that day anyways unless you workout, eat, then go right to bed :)

I'm sure you know more about this than I and especially with respect that you've actually trained and prepared for competitions in which you were on both side of the fence in respect to gain and losing body fat/weight...

like I said.. I just didn't want him to take the 7pm thing too strictly

[SpooledupRacing]

Thx guys ALOT.. and yes I understood the meaning of 7pm (i.e. not that close to bead time)

Time for dinner tomorrow I start on my new regimine

[poison]

About eating before bed: most foods elicit an insulin response, carbs especially. Insulin nearly completely prevents the release of growth hormone. This is bad, especially as we hit our 30's and 40's, as GH is a potent anabolic, anti-aging hormone, the levels of which drop dramatically as we age.

If your schedule allows, don't eat anything for two hours before bed.

[SpooledupRacing]

OK so this is what I did this morning..

1 cup of instant plain oatmeal.. eat

scrambled eggs:
2 whole eggs 1 egg white
5 spinach leaves (washed)
small handfull of white onion
fresh cracked pepper, fresh cracked sea salt

1 piece of marble rye toast with natural peanut butter

1 8oz glass of skim milk.

[S.A.MSP]

Without any sarcasm what-so-ever! I just wanna say thanks to the people who doubted me, it seriously made me push myself even harder. I got a physical evaluation done on wednesday and i've made some great improvements!

4 or so months ago I weighed 175lbs with 13. something% body fat, as of wednesday I weighed in at 187lbs with 11.85% body fat, 55 sit-ups in 1min and 60 push-ups in 1min :)

I'm very happy with my results, I will stick with this routine for a while since i'm seeing results.

[coyfish]

whatever works for you! grats man.

[Devilspawn]

congrats man... keep it up!

[S.A.MSP]

Thanks guys, progress always feels great :)

[poison]

Without any sarcasm what-so-ever! I just wanna say thanks to the people who doubted me, it seriously made me push myself even harder. I got a physical evaluation done on wednesday and i've made some great improvements!

4 or so months ago I weighed 175lbs with 13. something% body fat, as of wednesday I weighed in at 187lbs with 11.85% body fat, 55 sit-ups in 1min and 60 push-ups in 1min :)

I'm very happy with my results, I will stick with this routine for a while since i'm seeing results.

Always happy to help! :D

[S.A.MSP]

New update here, up to 193lbs now and did 8 reps of 946lbs on leg press, the most I have ever done! Pic of proof:

http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k179/hot_stufdude56/DSC01374.jpg

[Devilspawn]

nice...

I have no idea how you people can do insane weight on the leg press... I did 3x8 at 270+ the sled on leg press today after squats and single leg leg presses and I was done...

[poison]

Looking healthy, man!

[S.A.MSP]

thanks guys, weirdly i've always had strong legs, must be from my track running days

[Devilspawn]

thanks guys, weirdly i've always had strong legs, must be from my track running days

I guess soccer in high school did nothing for me :( :)

my legs are sore... feels nice!

[jred321]

pressing on the machine has always been easy for me too. don't know why, maybe track/soccer/biking/skiing over the years. however i avoid that machine as i find squats far more valuable

[S.A.MSP]

But using both squats and leg press together works really well, I use both but my lower back is kinda jacked up so squats hurt.

New note though, 1012lbs leg press today ;) wasn't room for any more weight lol

[coyfish]

Make sure your using proper form :). Its better to put less weight and go for the full range of motion than to add 5000 pounds but go 2 inches up and down. Not saying you are but just throwing it out there.

[S.A.MSP]

Oh yea no, for sure, bad form = injuries

[Devilspawn]

But using both squats and leg press together works really well, I use both but my lower back is kinda jacked up so squats hurt.

New note though, 1012lbs leg press today ;) wasn't room for any more weight lol

haha... you need those 100lb plates now... someone(jerk :)) left one on each side yesterday and I had to pull those fuckers off before I started my lifts... I was going to leave them on, but I wanted to start with single leg leg presses first... bastids!

[Devilspawn]

Make sure your using proper form :). Its better to put less weight and go for the full range of motion than to add 5000 pounds but go 2 inches up and down. Not saying you are but just throwing it out there.

I've seen people pile on weight and do that... I just shake my head...

[S.A.MSP]

haha... you need those 100lb plates now... someone(jerk :)) left one on each side yesterday and I had to pull those fuckers off before I started my lifts... I was going to leave them on, but I wanted to start with single leg leg presses first... bastids!

No kidding, I used up all the 20kg plates and had throw up four 15kg plates

[Devilspawn]

how am I going to survive a week off from the gym... this is gonna hurt :) hehe

[S.A.MSP]

same here, i'm heading state side on monday and won't be back till the 19th, doubt I'll get in any gym time

[Devilspawn]

I'm shocked that this site might actually be real:

http://www.bigguts.com/?

http://www.bigguts.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3337

http://www.bigguts.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3193

[js_protege_03dx]

all i do to stay in shape is eat lean meats and veggies and wrestle
but then again im still in high school
and plus it helps me maintain my weight

[S.A.MSP]

WTF! so damn nasty, I don't get it, do they like the fact an early death?

[red95_240sx]

is it true that after u stop taking the creatine and training, you loose some of ur weight and mass?

[Devilspawn]

is it true that after u stop taking the creatine and training, you loose some of ur weight and mass?

I believe this to be true mostly weight wise... you lose some water weight initially and some of this can be from you muscles which will make them appear smaller... I wouldn't say your mass goes away really...

if think you lost some muscle size... a week or so in the gym after you stop normally brings that size back I believe. with a proper diet

this is just my assessment of it.. I'm actually taking it now...

[S.A.MSP]

Weighing in at 190lbs with 7% BF for the MF'n win!!!! So happy about it!! Also upped the leg press to 1170lbs, then hurt my ACL a bit, i'm limpin but it feels a bit better now, all my weights are way up from when I started, I have great definition and I'm sleeping really well, still on the Arnold program, ran out of testosterone and GH support pills though but the weight and strenth did not go down, now I only use Supercharge Xtreme N.O. pre workout and Isopure Zero Carb Protein after, eating right is key too, I'm on the road alot now so Subway is my friend!! lol

[coyfish]

I eat double meat footlong clubs for snack :). Grats on your progress ! Im dropping weight (not good) like a mofo with all the cardio im doing. I can't eat enough and its pissing me off /:.

[red95_240sx]

i just wish i had somewhere to go over the summer

[CHICO2003]

As a trainer, the lack of good form I see is by far my biggest pet-peeve. It's pretty easy to discern whether someone simply doesn't know any better (newbs) or if they're trying to stroke their ego by 'lifting' more than anyone else. It really is quite pathetic. I saw one guy earlier doing leg presses with every plate possible AND his buddy sitting on top of the deck! lol This would be insanely impressive if he actually came halfway close to good form. Instead, he probably moved the rack about 2 inches... all the while pushing on his knees. No wonder the guy had absolutely no mass or definition.

I'm a bit late to this thread so I'm sure it's been said already but... it can't possibly be said enough. Proper form is the key. Sure, you'll see bodybuilders doing half-reps or even putting their bodies into some of the reps. There are specific reasons for this and, considering where they are in terms of their mass, these types of techniques can actually be beneficial. But they do more harm than good for the other 99.9% of the population. With the amount of toolboxes that go to my gym... it might as well be called Home Depot. These DB's need to check their egos at the door.

...end rant

Back on topic. For those with at least a moderate level of experience in the gym... and are looking for that extra edge, 'Plasma Jet' by Gaspari is no joke. Unlike the caffeine-laced pre-workout various NO products on the market... this stuff is the real deal. I've tried them all and this stuff is by far the best on the market. You'll see veins you didn't even know existed. The 'pump' it gives you is second to none... without the nervous jitters of the wannabe speed powder crap.

Another similar type of product is 'Morph' by Isatori. It's pretty new and I've yet to test it out (need to go through my cycle of PJ first) but I've heard a lot of good things.

Last thing I'll mention are drop sets. If all you're looking to do is put on mass... this type of regimen might not be for you. That said, if you're looking to get the most out of your workout and are looking to have more of a balanced physique... it's probably worth a shot. Definitely more of an 'advanced' type of workout so it's probably not for all. The concept's pretty simple. You start with a weight you can achieve failure (both positive and negative if you've got a spotter) at around 6 reps. (essentially the weight you'd do anyway) Then... IMMEDIATELY strip it down a notch. There's no exact %... and, of course, it's all relative to the exercise you're performing. Nonetheless, you strip it down and do it all over again.

Tues & Friday I do legs. To give you an idea... I'll put 4 plates on each side of the bar and squat 8 reps. I'll then strip it down to 3 and do 6-8 reps. (this is usually the hardet set within a set for some reason) Then I'll bust out 12-15 reps with 2 plates and go for a crazy burn with 30 reps with just 1. It's pretty brutal... legs AND lungs are burning. Unlike typical sets where you'll rest for a minute... 3-5 min is more like it. If you're working out with someone else... their set is your rest. I do these in sets of 3 and it's really taken my gains to a new level.

Obviously it can be applied to virtually any exercise. I find this type of workout especially good for days in which I may not have a spotter as it'll at least enable you to break down the muscle fiber completely (to failure) on some of the lesser weighed sets.

The last thing I'll mention (for real this time) is probably the easiest thing any of us can do... yet, for some reason, is usually neglected. Granted, this mostly applies to the newbs I train so I might be off with my assumption. Nevertheless... feeding your muscles high quality protein (preferably in a shake format) well within 30 minutes of finishing your workout is VITAL to your success. Not doing so basically means you just wasted your time. Just like that last rep you're able to squeeze out of a set... providing your muscles with the protein it needs to start the rebuilding process is critical to achieving muscle hypertrophy. Remember guys... 1 gram per 1lb of body weight as a minimum. Your body will need about 3 hours to digest roughly 40 grams so space it out of the course of a day accordingly. Different types of proteins offer different types of benefits. Whey enters the system quickly and is best used as a before/after workout protein. Conversely, casein is a slow digester and is ideal towards the end of your day (so it'll feed your muscles while you sleep).

[blueprotegelx]

Chico,
I've got a question for you. I started working out again a few weeks ago. I have been lifting since my freshman year in high school in 2000. As I started doing squats again I think I may have injured myself possibly due to improper technique. The bar did not have a pad on it which is I believe is also the problem. When doing squats, I do 15 calf raises, 15 squats, and 15 lunges all at the same time with relatively low weight since I just started. When doing squats and calf raises i kind of lifted the bar off my shoulders at the same time. Later that night I had bruising throughout my upper trapezius where the bar layed. For the last two weeks I have had tremendous pain. At first I thought it may have been a strained muscle, the other day it started pulsating and I think it may be a pinched nerve now. Any advice? I have been taking Ibuprofen and trying to massage area

[red95_240sx]

As a trainer, the lack of good form I see is by far my biggest pet-peeve. It's pretty easy to discern whether someone simply doesn't know any better (newbs) or if they're trying to stroke their ego by 'lifting' more than anyone else. It really is quite pathetic. I saw one guy earlier doing leg presses with every plate possible AND his buddy sitting on top of the deck! lol This would be insanely impressive if he actually came halfway close to good form. Instead, he probably moved the rack about 2 inches... all the while pushing on his knees. No wonder the guy had absolutely no mass or definition.

I'm a bit late to this thread so I'm sure it's been said already but... it can't possibly be said enough. Proper form is the key. Sure, you'll see bodybuilders doing half-reps or even putting their bodies into some of the reps. There are specific reasons for this and, considering where they are in terms of their mass, these types of techniques can actually be beneficial. But they do more harm than good for the other 99.9% of the population. With the amount of toolboxes that go to my gym... it might as well be called Home Depot. These DB's need to check their egos at the door.

...end rant

Back on topic. For those with at least a moderate level of experience in the gym... and are looking for that extra edge, 'Plasma Jet' by Gaspari is no joke. Unlike the caffeine-laced pre-workout various NO products on the market... this stuff is the real deal. I've tried them all and this stuff is by far the best on the market. You'll see veins you didn't even know existed. The 'pump' it gives you is second to none... without the nervous jitters of the wannabe speed powder crap.

Another similar type of product is 'Morph' by Isatori. It's pretty new and I've yet to test it out (need to go through my cycle of PJ first) but I've heard a lot of good things.

Last thing I'll mention are drop sets. If all you're looking to do is put on mass... this type of regimen might not be for you. That said, if you're looking to get the most out of your workout and are looking to have more of a balanced physique... it's probably worth a shot. Definitely more of an 'advanced' type of workout so it's probably not for all. The concept's pretty simple. You start with a weight you can achieve failure (both positive and negative if you've got a spotter) at around 6 reps. (essentially the weight you'd do anyway) Then... IMMEDIATELY strip it down a notch. There's no exact %... and, of course, it's all relative to the exercise you're performing. Nonetheless, you strip it down and do it all over again.

Tues & Friday I do legs. To give you an idea... I'll put 4 plates on each side of the bar and squat 8 reps. I'll then strip it down to 3 and do 6-8 reps. (this is usually the hardet set within a set for some reason) Then I'll bust out 12-15 reps with 2 plates and go for a crazy burn with 30 reps with just 1. It's pretty brutal... legs AND lungs are burning. Unlike typical sets where you'll rest for a minute... 3-5 min is more like it. If you're working out with someone else... their set is your rest. I do these in sets of 3 and it's really taken my gains to a new level.

Obviously it can be applied to virtually any exercise. I find this type of workout especially good for days in which I may not have a spotter as it'll at least enable you to break down the muscle fiber completely (to failure) on some of the lesser weighed sets.

The last thing I'll mention (for real this time) is probably the easiest thing any of us can do... yet, for some reason, is usually neglected. Granted, this mostly applies to the newbs I train so I might be off with my assumption. Nevertheless... feeding your muscles high quality protein (preferably in a shake format) well within 30 minutes of finishing your workout isVITAL to your success. Not doing so basically means you just wasted your time. Just like that last rep you're able to squeeze out of a set... providing your muscles with the protein it needs to start the rebuilding process is critical to achieving muscle hypertrophy. Remember guys... 1 gram per 1lb of body weight as a minimum. Your body will need about 3 hours to digest roughly 40 grams so space it out of the course of a day accordingly. Different types of proteins offer different types of benefits. Whey enters the system quickly and is best used as a before/after workout protein. Conversely, casein is a slow digester and is ideal towards the end of your day (so it'll feed your muscles while you sleep).


really?(squinty)

[coyfish]

No not really. Its good to get that protein in within 30 minutes but don't think you wont get results if you dont. I used to never drink protein shakes because they tend to upset my stomach (until I realised i was lactose intolerant lol). I was just as jacked then as I am now. I think protein shakes are most important in cutting phases. When your trying to put mass on you can eat enough to get the proper balance of nutrients you need. Of course this is relative to your goals. There is a point where you will have to take supplements to achieve certain goals.

[red95_240sx]

yeah. ive worked out without protein two semesters in college on and off depending on my work, and im much more defined. tho im not visually bigger under clothes. chest and arms are slightly bigger. Ive decided not to take any protein after hearing once u stop, u drop in mass. i plan to eat well and contine lifting when school starts back.

but who knows i might take a few.

[coyfish]

You won't lose mass unless you don't eat properly. Protein is important but it is still a SUPPLEMENT which many don't understand. You will lose mass once you stop taking creatine though, even if you cycle it.

[red95_240sx]

most proteins have creatine in them

[S.A.MSP]

I eat double meat footlong clubs for snack :). Grats on your progress ! Im dropping weight (not good) like a mofo with all the cardio im doing. I can't eat enough and its pissing me off /:.

Thanks alot man, yeah I dropped 3 pounds but damn, one sub and a protein shake and I'll be at 193 again, at the moment I'm not taking any weight gainers but I would like to get back on my Testosterone and GH support formula's, I really felt good while I was on them, I must say I'm not in the gym 6 days a week anymore either due to being on the road so much but the breaks in between really feel needed, I do love going to the gym after work though, it just calms me down you know!

[red95_240sx]

does that GNC weight gainer formula work? If i were to take any of it, would it spread out evenly over my entire body or what?

[S.A.MSP]

I can't really comment on that one man but I did use Isopure Whey and it settled pretty evenly, anything that goes into my body I don't mind paying a bit more for the right stuff. Not saying the GNC stuff is wrong but I don't know, I like buying the little more expensive stuff because I always see results

[CHICO2003]

Chico,
I've got a question for you. I started working out again a few weeks ago. I have been lifting since my freshman year in high school in 2000. As I started doing squats again I think I may have injured myself possibly due to improper technique. The bar did not have a pad on it which is I believe is also the problem. When doing squats, I do 15 calf raises, 15 squats, and 15 lunges all at the same time with relatively low weight since I just started. When doing squats and calf raises i kind of lifted the bar off my shoulders at the same time. Later that night I had bruising throughout my upper trapezius where the bar layed. For the last two weeks I have had tremendous pain. At first I thought it may have been a strained muscle, the other day it started pulsating and I think it may be a pinched nerve now. Any advice? I have been taking Ibuprofen and trying to massage area

Based on that information, there's really no way to accurately diagnose what might have occured. Like you said, however, the fact that the bar was lacking a pad certainly didn't help matters. Plenty of 'body-builder/power-lifter' types will squat a massive amount of weight without a pad. The combination of their massive traps along with the 'numbing' of some of the critical nerves in that area (after so many years of lifting) allows them to do so. But none of us (should) fall into this category. There's no shame in using a pad. (for the bar at least haha)

Though anything is possible, it's highly unlikely that you have a pinched nerve. This phrase has become the common 'explanation' for so many things it seems. A pinched nerve is pretty serious. If you're experiencing any numbness or shooting pain (especially down your back and into your... I'll say it... ass) then you very well could have one. Otherwise, it sounds like you simply bruised or pulled a muscle. Other than what you're already doing for the pain... treating it with some heat wraps and doing some stretching... there's not much else you can do but wait it out. A good chiropractor can assess your spine and determine if you have any suplexations... (laymen's terms... spinal column's out of wack) this can easily be fixed with an adjustment. Everyone should get this done on a regular basis anyway so perhaps it's a blessing in disguise that this happened...

As for proper form... since there are a lot of different stances (some of whih enable a greater range of movement) I don't want to say there's just one proper form to adhere to. The general rule of thumb is to lower the bar til your thighs are as close to paralell to the floor as you can get. If you're just beginning, use a smith machine. Depending on how flexible you are (primarily in the ankle region) you might want to try putting your feet a bit more forward to achieve this. Bottom line: It's not about the weight... but the pump and burn. My legs scream the loudest when I'm blasting out low weight high rep sets. Form over weight every day of the week.

[CHICO2003]

No not really. Its good to get that protein in within 30 minutes but don't think you wont get results if you dont. I used to never drink protein shakes because they tend to upset my stomach (until I realised i was lactose intolerant lol). I was just as jacked then as I am now. I think protein shakes are most important in cutting phases. When your trying to put mass on you can eat enough to get the proper balance of nutrients you need. Of course this is relative to your goals. There is a point where you will have to take supplements to achieve certain goals.

With all due respect... the fact that you were 'just as jaked' when you didn't drink protein shakes are you are now really isn't a very scientific way of proving your point. On the other hand... SCIENCE tells us that replenishing your system with protein within 30 min of your workout is VITAL to muscle growth. Hopefully I don't have to convince anyone of the benefit of protein. Along with other things like BCAAs... it's quite literally the building block of muscle. The idea of working out is to build down that muscle tissue. The more stress you cause... the more you break it down, the more it can potentially rebuild itself stronger than ever. Obviously that stress will be at its peak during/after a good workout. Not providing those muscles with the protein they need to rebuild as quickly as possible is the best way to flush all your hard work down the drain.

Like I said... it's the easiest thing for people to do yet... is often the most neglected. If you're not already downing 30-40 grams of protein after your workout... you're missing the boat.

[red95_240sx]

No not really. Its good to get that protein in within 30 minutes but don't think you wont get results if you dont. I used to never drink protein shakes because they tend to upset my stomach (until I realised i was lactose intolerant lol). I was just as jacked then as I am now. I think protein shakes are most important in cutting phases. When your trying to put mass on you can eat enough to get the proper balance of nutrients you need. Of course this is relative to your goals. There is a point where you will have to take supplements to achieve certain goals.

thats what i believe

[CHICO2003]

does that GNC weight gainer formula work? If i were to take any of it, would it spread out evenly over my entire body or what?


Weight-gainers usually work as advertised. Thing is... what kind of weight are you looking to pack on? I'm assuming you're a hard-gainer. In order to pack on some pounds you're going to have to (obviously) ingest a greater amount of calories. Weight-gainers allow you to do this in a quick and easy way (shake) but will often have some undesribale side effects. (ie. the shits... bloated/gassy feeling... potentially increase fat %)

If you're not willing or able to increase your calorie count by the appropriate # with more food... this might not be a bad way to go. Just be sure to space the shakes out. The prevailing logic seems to be to simply down the shake as quickly as possible. Unless you're the Hulk, your body isn't designed to digest that amount of calories so quickly.

[blueprotegelx]

I completely agree with you on the less weight and higher reps in which case is what I do, especially when performing my supersets. I am by far not a beginner, but I have always used the Smith Machine, or on occassion or I'll use dumbbells and do squats and walking lunges. I know it's not a pinched nerve, I was just coming up with all possible scenarios. I also went out and got a stiffer pillow as well. Seemed to help out to some degree as well, as my other one there was no support so when I got up in the morning my neck was completely stiff and if i tried to move it, there was just tremendous pain throughout the levator scapulae muscles. Pain has decreased, although there is still some within the deltoid region. Hopefully time proceeds quicker and my muscles will heal.

I have no worries about using the pad for the bar, always have! just so happens this one time there wasn't one, i asked about the two that are usually there and they said that they were thrown away b/c they were shredded and new ones were on the way. I haven't done the Smith Machine since so that I don't bruise the muscles furthermore.

[CHICO2003]

right on... whether or not the 'good pads' will be available is always a crap shoot at my gym. That's why I bought one for myself... you might wanna think about doing the same.

[jred321]

one of the gyms i went to had both pads and one of these http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/betteru50.htm i greatly preferred the manta ray thing for squats over a pad even though it is a hardish plastic. it does a much better job of distributing the weight

[CHICO2003]

I've used that before... definitely top-notch. It made it a bit more difficult to do my drop sets though. that's really the only thing I didn't like... if all you're doing is one set and then resting... this is the one to use.

[Nuffflavor]

Just trying to find out some good info and share experiences.

Been lifting on and off since high school but for the past 2 months i've been going 6 days a week, Protein and No-Explode are a big part of my work outs, on monday I will be starting Schwarzenegger's workout routine, pretty stoked for it, trying my hardest to eat right and i'm getting there. I also do a spinning and ab class every mon, tue. and wed. And try and play 3 games of Squash twice a week. So I think i'm on my way to fitness success!

So what do you do to stay fit or share your lifting tips and such!

If you like NO-Explode, you try NO SHOTGUN by VPX (beer)

[Devilspawn]

If you like NO-Explode, you try NO SHOTGUN by VPX (beer)

haha... doing gaspari sizeon, plasmajet, and superpump250 right now...

liking it a lot along with some other goodies

[Wildfyre]

I'm trying to get back into lifting/dieting right. I got into lifting in high school then got serious about it during college. At my peak, I was 196lbs, but I believe a decent amount of it (5 lbs or so) was a lot of water weight as I was on creatine mono during the time. I'm 6'3" and ectomorphic, so I'm a hard-gainer. I was eating just over 4000 calories when I got all my meals in. It was hard, but I did it. I saw good results but I kept hurting myself in the gym (usually pulled muscles and a very sore lower back) because I was an idiot. I didn't stretch enough and usually didn't bother with warm up sets. I know better now, but my shoulders have ALWAYS been weak and my hamstrings are always tight. Past 3 years I sit at a desk for 12 hours a day (work) then often times sit back at a desk at home. It's terrible for my hams and I'm too lazy to stretch multiple times a day for more than a few days/week. My shoulders used to pop out of the socket for half a second during things like bench...I'd be injured for about a week after those. I don't know why, but it's very hard for me to maintain the "shoulders back and low" form.

Anyway, I'm 24 in 2 months and decided I need to get back into fitness. During my offtime, I dropped as low as 173lbs. My ideal weight is 195-205. I'd prefer the later. My calorie intake must have been abysmal due to my inactivity. I HAVE to go to the gym regularly to increase my appetite - my metabolism has 2 moods: Fast, or rediculously fast, haha. I just joined fitday website after reading this thread just now...looks very good for tracking! Excited to see the proof of my progress as I go along.

Current supplements: Multivitamin, Fish Oil, Whey Protein, Weight Gainer when needed (usually breakfast if i'm out of 'regular' food). I have creatine in my cupboard but haven't used it for over a year...it's probably expired =\.

Right now, I just completed a one-week full body work out:
Day 1: Chest/Tris.
Day 2: Rest.
Day 3: Back/Biceps
Day 4: Rest.
Day 5: Lower Body.
Day 6: Rest
*repeat*
right now I kinda sneak my abs/core into one of the upper body days. I want to get to a point where I'm doing LIGHT cardio (too much and I can't gain weight) and abs on my rest days. I always do my programs for about 3 months then change it. I've tried a lot of different programs over the years and have at least some experience with almost all types of lifting.

I noticed that my form on squats is...odd. I've been lifting for years and consider myself intermediate - problem is in my back I think. As I'm going down, my body forces itself to the left side just a hair. Always happens. When I push back up it adjusts back to straight. I need to start going back to the chiro, but it's so dang expensive after a few sessions =(

Anyone have advice for the shoulder problems? I recently added rotator cuff exercises to my routine and try to keep my shoulders back as much as possible when using them (ie bench, dips, row, etc). I used to do a lot of dumbell military presses but they might have only hurt me over time since my shoulders were already weak - I basically ditched them for the rotator cuff and compounds that include my shoulders. Good idea/bad?

[Devilspawn]

good luck man... you have all the supplements you need to get back into it...

the creatine is most likely fine... it doesn't really expire if stored properly I believe...

take it slow, eat right, get your 7-78 hours of sleep, and stay motivated... your workout split is very similar to mine right now and I really like it a lot...

I like fitday, but I don't use it... I just use an excel spreadsheet when I feel like really being strict about what I eat...

try doing squats without any weight or just the bar or on a wall with a swiss ball to see if you can correct your form.... then start adding weight...

shoulder? stretch and keep them warm...make sure you warm up for a good ten minutes (shoulder dislocation exercises, rotations with light weights(front to back and back to front) and rotator cuff movements with light weights))... if you still feel pain and discomfort try a joint supplement and go to the Dr. to get it checked out... don't wanna mess with shoulder problems and make it worse...

[CHICO2003]

how many hours before working out are you taking the plasmajet? I find 3 hours to be ideal...

[Devilspawn]

how many hours before working out are you taking the plasmajet? I find 3 hours to be ideal...

I haven't gone below 2hrs... normally it's about 2- 2.5 and I feel pretty good on it...

this is granted that I take superpump 15-20 minutes before I lift (so 1.5-1.75 after plasmajet) and then sip sizeon during and finish it afterwards...

it feels good and I only work out every other day MWFSunTThSat...repeat... because of the plasmajet

[Devilspawn]

taking the plasmajet pills right now actually...

[coyfish]

Worked out chest today. I was studying for the past 2 days nonstop so I didn't get to eat much. I lost around 5 lbs of water weight but wanted to workout anyway. Ironically I hit a new personal best. Maxed for one rep at 285lbs. I weighed 164 during the workout and im normally around 168. 5"10, 8% BF. No supplements except pure protein powder and good music :).

[Devilspawn]

Worked out chest today. I was studying for the past 2 days nonstop so I didn't get to eat much. I lost around 5 lbs of water weight but wanted to workout anyway. Ironically I hit a new personal best. Maxed for one rep at 285lbs. I weighed 164 during the workout and im normally around 168. 5"10, 8% BF. No supplements except pure protein powder and good music :).

nice man... keep it up... I'm going off of everything after this stack besides protein powder/bcaa's/multi...maybe some ZMA at night, but that basically goes with the multi category...

[Devilspawn]

whoever liked NO-explode... it's on "sale" for the next 23 hours:

http://www.prosource.net/content/articles/Daily-Green-Light-Special/

[Nuffflavor]

haha... doing gaspari sizeon, plasmajet, and superpump250 right now...

liking it a lot along with some other goodies


Plasmajet uh? Whats the skinny on that? Is it an energy booster like superpump250?

[Devilspawn]

Plasmajet uh? Whats the skinny on that? Is it an energy booster like superpump250?


basically a nitric oxide supplement... I've always been very skeptical of them since I actually did/do nitric oxide research...

normally it's my view that's its the stimulants in them that make you "think" it's working... This is the first one that I actually feel a longing effect... I could go on about it, but it appears that gaspari got something right in it, that makes it work as intended... first nitric oxide product that I've actually liked...

since they are both considered nitric oxide products, I need to take it without superpump once though to see if I like the results with it alone since superpump also contains some of the same type of ingredients along with caffiene(so I'm like double dosing on some ingredients per se when I take them both on workout days)... eventually I'll try them both stand alone to see how they both do on their own... but together so far, I'm really enjoying them...

Sizeon I could do without, but I have a coupe samples of Sizeon Version 2 that I'm going to try eventually... I don't expect anything different really, but the fact that Sizeon has ZMA in it though is nice... but I take that normally in pill form before bed anyways...

[Nuffflavor]

basically a nitric oxide supplement... I've always been very skeptical of them since I actually did/do nitric oxide research...

normally it's my view that's its the stimulants in them that make you "think" it's working... This is the first one that I actually feel a longing effect... I could go on about it, but it appears that gaspari got something right in it, that makes it work as intended... first nitric oxide product that I've actually liked...

since thety are both considered nitric oxide products, I need to take it without superpump once though to see if I like the results with it alone since superpump also contains some of the same type of ingredients along with caffiene(so I'm like double dosing on some ingredients per se when I take them both on workout days)... eventually I'll try them both stand alone to see how they both do on their on... but together so far, I'm really enjoying them...

Sizeon I could do without, but I have a coupe samples of Sizeon Version 2 that I'm going to try eventually... I don't expect anything different really, but the fact that Sizeon has ZMA in it though is nice... but I take that normally in pill form before bed anyways...


Hmmm. Ok. Yeah good point!

Now I remember the No Explode, and now, No Shotgun has that ingredient inside. It is a double dose. Some time ya get tired of the shake/mix powered drinks though. I will have to get this stuff on my next supplement purchase. I have been only filling the scoop half way with No Shotgun, so when I try this PlasmaJet I will maybe drop the No Shotgun to 1/4 scoop.

Good Info.. Thanks

[coyfish]

nice man... keep it up... I'm going off of everything after this stack besides protein powder/bcaa's/multi...maybe some ZMA at night, but that basically goes with the multi category...

Thanks man. I tried creatine for about a month. I feel it really didn't do anything for me so I stopped. Im happy with how I am now so I guess im just not motivated to try anything or spend money lol. I haven't gained strength in years though even though I hit my personal chest best last workout. Pushing out all that stress I guess :).

Friend of mine who works out with me started taking creatine. Hes definately getting stronger but then again he is bulking so . . .

[CHICO2003]

I haven't gone below 2hrs... normally it's about 2- 2.5 and I feel pretty good on it...

this is granted that I take superpump 15-20 minutes before I lift (so 1.5-1.75 after plasmajet) and then sip sizeon during and finish it afterwards...

it feels good and I only work out every other day MWFSunTThSat...repeat... because of the plasmajet


sounds like we're on similar supplements. Just curious... why are you taking SP 15-20 min before your workout? I find the effect to be greater if taken 40-60 min prior. Not to mention... that gives you time for the infamous superdump. but I digress...

[CHICO2003]

Plasmajet uh? Whats the skinny on that? Is it an energy booster like superpump250?

Already been addressed but I'll put my .02 in.

Supplements like SP are mostly stimulants. Since they don't provide label info, it took some digging... but each scoop contains roughly as much caffeine as a cup of coffee (120mg) Some products contain more than others but you get the idea... I generally only take one scoop so I don't consider it to be that big of a deal. I know some guys that down 2-3 though. When you consider the coffee equivalent... no wonder they're jacked out of their skulls at the gym!

PJ on the other hand is a completely different animal. Having taken it alone on many occasions, there is a distinct difference between the two. While the products above get you fired up and somewhat more vascular... PJ has very little effect on one's motivation level but a profound effect on one's vascularity. This is why it's ideal to combine the 2. What good is vascularity if you can't get your ass off the couch?

[Nuffflavor]

Already been addressed but I'll put my .02 in.

Supplements like SP are mostly stimulants. Since they don't provide label info, it took some digging... but each scoop contains roughly as much caffeine as a cup of coffee (120mg) Some products contain more than others but you get the idea... I generally only take one scoop so I don't consider it to be that big of a deal. I know some guys that down 2-3 though. When you consider the coffee equivalent... no wonder they're jacked out of their skulls at the gym!

PJ on the other hand is a completely different animal. Having taken it alone on many occasions, there is a distinct difference between the two. While the products above get you fired up and somewhat more vascular... PJ has very little effect on one's motivation level but a profound effect on one's vascularity. This is why it's ideal to combine the 2. What good is vascularity if you can't get your ass off the couch?


Got it (skinny on PJ), but now I am thinking about the double dosage / increased amount of Nitric Oxide I will be ingesting IF I take a full scoop of NO Shotgun & PJ. So, I was thinking about decreasing the NO Shotgun amount.

Yeah, I know a guy who takes 2-3 scoops of that stuff. I tried it twice (to make sure of the effects were correct) and felt like my senses were overload to the point where my body just felt HOT with no energy rush (screwy).

LOL "What good is vascularity if you can't get your ass off the couch?"

[Devilspawn]

sounds like we're on similar supplements. Just curious... why are you taking SP 15-20 min before your workout? I find the effect to be greater if taken 40-60 min prior. Not to mention... that gives you time for the infamous superdump. but I digress...


I have not gotten any of the so called superdumps and I've been on it for 3 weeks...

I like the 20-30 minute range before my workout for superpump... it fits my eating schedule as well...

I do get a rush 30 minutes into my workout, 60 minutes after superpump, but I'm into it by then, pushing weight and sipping on sizeon too... feels good...

[coyfish]

How big are you devil??? Height / weight / bf ??

[Devilspawn]

How big are you devil??? Height / weight / bf ??

5'11"ish/185/bf: no idea

I got up to 194 last july... got sick and dropped down to 175ish in 1.5 weeks... gained ~10lbs slowly since then...

if I had to take a educated guess I would say I'm about 15% or so, but I really have no idea... I'd like to say that it's dropping but I haven't done cardio like I should in about 2 weeks, but have been carb cycling of sorts on this stack...

[Nuffflavor]

5'11"ish/185/bf: no idea

I got up to 194 last july... got sick and dropped down to 175ish in 1.5 weeks... gained ~10lbs slowly since then...

if I had to take a educated guess I would say I'm about 15% or so, but I really have no idea... I'd like to say that it's dropping but I haven't done cardio like I should in about 2 weeks, but have been carb cycling of sorts on this stack...

I hate to say it, but your ratios don't sound right. 5'11" with 194 pounds does not sound like a 15%. Unless you have a 40” something or higher waist line. @ 175ish you should be pretty lean @ that height.

I'm 5'9" and weight in at 201 pounds and my Command said I was 13% with a 16 1/4" neck and 33" waist line. The Navy does a BMI by measuring neck VS waist, but I really do not like that method because you can have a 18" Turkey neck with a 45" waist, and still get 20% measurement.

I say try one of the methods cause even at 194 pounds @ your height should not come up to 15%. Shoot! your just a inch from 6', and almost all the friends I know at that height are lean in the high 190s / low 200s.

[Devilspawn]

I hate to say it, but your ratios don't sound right. 5'11" with 194 pounds does not sound like a 15%. Unless you have a 40” something or higher waist line. @ 175ish you should be pretty lean @ that height.

I'm 5'9" and weight in at 201 pounds and my Command said I was 13% with a 16 1/4" neck and 33" waist line. The Navy does a BMI by measuring neck VS waist, but I really do not like that method because you can have a Turkey neck with a 45" waist, and still get 20% measurement.

I say try one of the methods cause even at 194 pounds @ your height should not come up to 15%.

my waist is about 33 I think( I wear 34 jeans with boxers and boxer briefs underneath comfortably(yes, I said boxer and boxer briefs together)).. I like my jeans to fit big and wide around the legs so I wear 34/34... my shoulders are about 44 or 46 or something and I pretty sure my neck is 16 1/2... I know I have to buy athletic cut suits to make the pants fit and take them in...found this out the hard way the last time I bought I suit, he measure my chest and gave me a suit and it didn't fit at all... he said let me measure your shoulders instead and had to go up a size(athletic cut) to get it to fit

if you mean I'm lower than 15% I have no problem with that :)

but yeah, I'm 5'11" and 185 right now...whatever that come out to with BF... no idea...

[Nuffflavor]

my waist is about 33 I think( I wear 34 jeans with boxers and boxer briefs underneath comfortably(yes, I said boxer and boxer briefs together)).. I like my jeans to fit big and wide around the legs so I wear 34/34... my shoulders are about 44 or 46 or something and I pretty sure my neck is 16 1/2... I know I have to buy athletic cut suits to make the pants fit and take them in...found this out the hard way the last time I bought I suit, he measure my chest and gave me a suit and it didn't fit at all... he said let me measure your shoulders instead and had to go up a size(athletic cut) to get it to fit

if you mean I'm lower than 15% I have no problem with that :)

but yeah, I'm 5'11" and 185 right now...whatever that come out to with BF... no idea...


LOL. Yeah dude sounds LOWER. 34 jeans is LEAN. U aint no 15%! Don't short change yourself!

[coyfish]

I hate to say it, but your ratios don't sound right. 5'11" with 194 pounds does not sound like a 15%. Unless you have a 40” something or higher waist line. @ 175ish you should be pretty lean @ that height.

I'm 5'9" and weight in at 201 pounds and my Command said I was 13% with a 16 1/4" neck and 33" waist line. The Navy does a BMI by measuring neck VS waist, but I really do not like that method because you can have a 18" Turkey neck with a 45" waist, and still get 20% measurement.

I say try one of the methods cause even at 194 pounds @ your height should not come up to 15%. Shoot! your just a inch from 6', and almost all the friends I know at that height are lean in the high 190s / low 200s.

I don't like that method either. People store weight in different areas. I have been as low as 4.9% BF when I did my competition. I still had the same waste as I do now. I have a big booty :).

I would think in the navy they would be doing hydrostatic or caliper testing . . . Actually I did a lab in college where we had to calculate our BF's. We used this handheld device that you held with your outstretched arms horizontally in front of you. I was sceptical but the thing was remarkably accurate. Was within .5% of my actual BF that I calculated with calipers.

[Devilspawn]

how many hours before working out are you taking the plasmajet? I find 3 hours to be ideal...


sounds like we're on similar supplements. Just curious... why are you taking SP 15-20 min before your workout? I find the effect to be greater if taken 40-60 min prior. Not to mention... that gives you time for the infamous superdump. but I digress...

tried plasmajet today in the 2.5-3hr before workout range and superpump about 45 minutes before workout... I liked it very much... going to try it again that way on saturday...

thanks for the tip...

[coyfish]

Hey devil. Do you mind posting a "typical" weekly routine for you???

Im sure you switch things up like I do but just post something you do often. Im out of ideas when it comes to exersizes. Like to try new things but Ive done like every exersize lol.

I think im going to start doing full body workouts for the next month and a half or so. Workout full body without rests for 45 min 3X a week. Thats something that I have never tried before. A buddy of mine who trains for a living and has done multiple bodybuilding contests and he told me that he did that type of workout for a while.

[Devilspawn]

Hey devil. Do you mind posting a "typical" weekly routine for you???

Im sure you switch things up like I do but just post something you do often. Im out of ideas when it comes to exersizes. Like to try new things but Ive done like every exercise lol.

I think im going to start doing full body workouts for the next month and a half or so. Workout full body without rests for 45 min 3X a week. Thats something that I have never tried before. A buddy of mine who trains for a living and has done multiple bodybuilding contests and he told me that he did that type of workout for a while.

I'll try to make this as short as possible... I changed my routine 3 weeks ago when I started this new stack... I'm doing a modified advanced training program outlined in the gaspari "science and muscle" mag since I'm doing several of the products in the stack... because I'm taking plasmajet I'm trying to work out every other day on days that I take it... so Mon/Wed/Fri/Sun/Tues/Thurs/Sat repeat... if schedule doesn't permit then I will do two, but no more than 3 days in row, if I do 2 in row I take a day off and if I do 3 in a row, I take 2 days off.. then start the cycle again...Example: I worked out yesterday, and will work out today and tomorrow because I can't workout sunday and monday(football and stuff)... so yesterday, today and tomorrow is 3 days in a row, with sunday and monday off, then start the cycle again on tuesday...

so if my schedule stayed consistent: these are all working sets and don't include at least a one set warm up

Mon: DAY 1: CHEST AND TRICEPS AND ABS or CHEST AND TRICEPS AND CALVES(See Calf Workout) dependent on the week and feel

CHEST – 1.5 to 2 minute rest in between all chest exercises
• Incline Dumbell or Barbell Press: 4 sets- 1X12, 1X10, 1X8, 1X15
(Pyramid up 1st sets heavy with a lighter final set for more reps)
• Incline Dumbell Fly: 3 sets of 10-12
• Flat Bench, Dumbell or Barbell: 3 sets of 6-8
• Dips: 4 sets to failure
* I've been sticking to this but I sometimes do cable flies instead of dumbbell flies or Decline DBs instead of Flat bench...

TRICEPS – 30 second rest in between all triceps sets
• Cable Triceps Pushdowns(rope or bar): 1X12, 1X10, 1X8, 1X6
• Lying Tricep Skull Crushers or Close Grip Bench: 1X15, 1X12, 1X10, 1X8
• Over Head Triceps Extensions: 3 sets of 10-12

ABDOMINALS – 30 seconds rest in between sets
• Abs Crunches: 3 sets of 20-25 reps
• Knee Raises: 3 sets of 20-25
*I only do abs if I feel like it otherwise I do them on a cardio day or any other day

Tues: DAY 2: Rest Day: sometimes just cardio

Wed: DAY 3: LEGS AND CALVES or LEGS AND BACK (see back workout) dependent on the week
LEGS – 1.5 to 2 minutes rest between all sets
• Leg Extensions: 4 sets of 15
• 45 Degree Leg Press: 4 sets of 15
• Hack Squats: 4 sets of 15 or SQUATS: 4 sets of 20; 3 sets of 8 or 4 sets of 12-15
• Walking Lunges: 3 sets of some distance or failure
• Lying Leg Curls: 4 sets of 15
• Stiff Legged Dead Lifts: 3 sets of 12

CALVES – 30 seconds rest in between sets
• Standing Calve Raises or Toe Raises on Incline Leg Press:
4 sets of 15-25
• Seated Calve Raises: 4 sets of 15-25

if it's a leg/back day I transition between the two with dead lifts... go from dead lifts to back workout...

Thurs: DAY 4: Rest Day: sometimes just cardio

Fri: DAY 5: SHOULDERS, BICEPS AND ABS
SHOULDERS/SHRUGS – 30-60 seconds rest in between sets
• Seated Front or Back Barbell Press or Front Dumbell Press: 4-5 sets of 12,10,8,6,10
(Pyramid up 1st sets heavy with a lighter final set for more reps)
• Front lateral Raises with Dumbell or Barbell: 3 sets of 10-12
• Seated or Standing Side Laterals: 4 sets of 10
• Standing Upright Wide Grip Raises, Barbell or Dumbell: 3 sets of 10
or One Arm Side Laterals: 3 sets of 12-15 reps
• Bent Over Side Laterals: 3 sets of 10-12

• Shrugs with Dumbell or Barbell: 4 sets of 10-12(sometimes done on back day instead)

BICEPS – 30 seconds rest in between sets
• Standing Dumbell Curls or Hammer Curls: 3 sets of 10
• Seated Preacher Curls: 3 sets of 10
• 21’s Barbell Curls, Normal Standing Curls, Concentration Curls or Cable Curls: 3 sets of 10-12
• Reverse Barbell Curl: 3 sets of 12

ABDOMINALS – Repeat Abdominal workout from Day 1

Sat: DAY 5: Rest Day: sometimes just cardio

Sun: DAY 6: BACK AND CALVES

BACK – 1 to 1.5 seconds rest in between sets
• Front Pull Ups or Cable Lat Pull Downs: 4 sets of 10-12 reps
• Seated Cable Rows: 3 sets of 10
• Bend Over Barbell Rows: 3 sets of 10-12
• Deadlifts: 4 sets of 12-10-8-10 reps

CALVES – See Calf workout

Mon: DAY 7: Rest day

Tues: DAY 8: Repeat starting with Chest day or Leg day (if leg day I leave out calves and add another leg exercise like an FST7 type exercise 7x7 at the end of the workout or abs)

most of this is taken right out of the mag with modifications...

at any point I'll switch a barbell movement for a dumbbell movement or a Hammer Strength Movement and vice versa to switch it up from week to week... Example: instead of doing flat bench as my 3rd exercise on chest day sometimes I will do H.S. seated Decline press or H.S. Seated Wide chest

Sometimes I do like 15-20 minutes of low intensity cardio after a workout...

rest cardio days is HIIT...


wow... that ended up being pretty long...

I log everything...

[Nuffflavor]

I don't like that method either. People store weight in different areas. I have been as low as 4.9% BF when I did my competition. I still had the same waste as I do now. I have a big booty :).

I would think in the navy they would be doing hydrostatic or caliper testing . . . Actually I did a lab in college where we had to calculate our BF's. We used this handheld device that you held with your outstretched arms horizontally in front of you. I was sceptical but the thing was remarkably accurate. Was within .5% of my actual BF that I calculated with calipers.

Yeah, hydrostatic is the best. 4.9% Klord thats pretty low. I am shooting to get and stay maybe around 9-11%. I can't maintain no single digits... donuts do taste good ya know (lol2)

DevilSpawn.... according to the Navy, I plugged in your measurements and came up with 10-11%.

[Devilspawn]

Yeah, hydrostatic is the best. 4.9% Klord thats pretty low. I am shooting to get and stay maybe around 9-11%. I can't maintain no single digits... donuts do taste good ya know (lol2)

DevilSpawn.... according to the Navy, I plugged in your measurements and came up with 10-11%.

I serious doubt that calculation then...wow...

I can't see my abs unless it's in the morning and when I'm flexed them really hard and I can't see the muscle definition that I think I should see to be close enough to say I'm anywhere near 10-11%...

very interesting...

I suppose I'm skinny fat with shoulders... :)

I should just get measured and stop all the guessing...

I just don't want to know and then feel fat... :)

[coyfish]

Thanks for posting that Devil. Our routines are pretty similar. I guess ive been working out so long it gets tedious. But I still love it.

This is my current workout.

Mon - chest / abs

Chest: I go one week all dumbell and the next week all barbell. Flat to incline to decline. Usually I do 4 sets each. Aim for 12-10-8-6 reps Then I alternate between incline / flat dumbell flies, machine flies, or cable crosses. Sometimes I throw push ups in there but I don't really do chest dips. Don't feel it in my chest very much. Kind of a weird strain for me.

Wed - Upper back / shoulders
A "typical" workout for me includes bent over dumbell rows. Arnold presses. Smith machine overhead press. Wide or close grip pull ups. Seated rows. Lateral raises, front raises, 45 degree angle raises (lol between lateral and in front of you). Shrugs and trap exersizes. (dont know name but the one where you bring the bar up to your chin pulling the bar up.)

Friday - Arms / abs

No point in describing these. Arm exersizes are too generic. Bi curls, skull crushers at different inclines, overhead extension, kick backs, close grip bench, rope pull downs, etc.

Sat or Sun - Legs / lower back

Deadlifts and back raises. Squats, lunges, wall sits, ham curls, quad extensions, leg press, calves.

More or less a "typical" workout for me. I cycle between lifting heavy for strengh and lifting lighter with dropsets and such for stamina. Usually do each for a month and a half or so.

[coyfish]

Finished a 5 week cycle of HIT training. Man that shit is hard. Feel like ive gotten a bit stronger (same weight) which is good. But seems like I have lost a little definition. Anyway its hard to really maximize that style of training when you go solo. You really need to have a partner "training" you. Especially in a public gym where you sometimes need to wait on others.

Glad to be going back to my normal traditional style for 5 weeks though.

[CHICO2003]

HIT Training huh? Don't you mean HI Training? Or just plain HIT? haha j/k

So for 5 weeks all you did was one rep max to failure on every exercise? That's pretty nuts. Yeah, you'd definitely need a spotter for that!

Personally, I'm not really much of a fan of that approach. 3-4 reps is about the lowest range I'll go. But I suppose there is some value in shocking your muscles with a 1RM every once in a while. Just be glad you didn't injure yourself. I can't tell you how many people I've trained that have fallen into this trap. Especially nowadays with it being so cold. A proper warmup is essential. especially if you're doing 1RM workouts

[coyfish]

HIT Training huh? Don't you mean HI Training? Or just plain HIT? haha j/k

So for 5 weeks all you did was one rep max to failure on every exercise? That's pretty nuts. Yeah, you'd definitely need a spotter for that!

Personally, I'm not really much of a fan of that approach. 3-4 reps is about the lowest range I'll go. But I suppose there is some value in shocking your muscles with a 1RM every once in a while. Just be glad you didn't injure yourself. I can't tell you how many people I've trained that have fallen into this trap. Especially nowadays with it being so cold. A proper warmup is essential. especially if you're doing 1RM workouts


Haha yeah I was thinking about that when I was typing. No its not a 1 rep max failure. The basic principle is to exhaust everytype of muscle fiber in a very short time period (under 25min workout). Everything is about control so you have constant muscle tension. No jerky lifts or anything. Just nice and slow 3 seconds up and 4-5 seconds down. So what I did was started out lifting heavy. For example I weight 165 lbs (8%BF)(5"10) so I put 225 on bench and did as many as I could (8-9). Then you drop the weight and exhaust your slow twitch fibers by repping it out. You can also mix isotonic holds and negatives. Yes you do push yourself very hard which is why good warmup / stretching is a good idea. Its also meant for more experienced lifters.

Was a very good strength builder. My max went up from about 270 to 285 just on bench and I didn't gain any weight (not my goal).

[Devilspawn]

just got back in the gym from a sickness layoff... hadn't worked out since before xmas... feels good to be back, but man do I feel weak... all my lifts went down...today will be my third workout since mid December...

what was good was I got back and everyone was like where the hell have you been. At least I know people are used to seeing me there :) that's a good thing...

back to the grind!

[Scott]

Got a question for you guys doing all the weight training and supplements.

Are you guys doing this more for bulk, tone, or just to stay healthy? I'm starting a bicycle routine. It's partially just to stay healthy, but I'd also like to thin out and tone up a little bit. I'm about 6'3" and 195#, not too out of shape, but lack a lot of real muscle definition.

Would I benefit from doing some weight training as well? How about supplements? Are they really needed in my case? I have a big jug of Creatine Monohydrate that I got from my folks (my mom has a lot of bad health problems, and got it to help her build muscle in order to walk without a cane/walker. But she hates the taste of the stuff). I'm a diabetic, and I've heard conflicting things about being diabetic and taking creatine (I'm a non-medicated type 2 if that matters. I control my blood sugar with proper diet). I usually bring some butterscotch or gatorade with me on longer (25+ mile) bike rides, just in case my sugar dips down. But I wanted to know how the creatine would affect this.

Thanks!

[coyfish]

Of course you would :). Im a triathlete as well as an avid weightlifter. I lift because it makes me feel good inside and out. I do triathlons because I love cardio and the heart is the most important muscle you can work in your body. Nobody dies from a weak pectoral.

That being said lifting is a good idea for anyone looking to lose weight. Especially if you haven't lifted in a long time (or ever) you will make muscular gains very quickly. Muscle burns fat so you will be burning more calories. Unless you really take lifting to the extreme and become very large it won't inhibit you in any way.



I personally am not a fan of creatine or too many supplements. I achieved great results (5"10, 168, 8% BF) with just hard work and protein. Creatine is a "natural" supplement but anything in excess is bad for you and frankly when you take creatine you are overloading your body. Which is why you need to cycle it. Some people benefit more than others.

The only supplement I take is 1 protein shake after my workouts. With a proper diet you can get all the protein you need. Unless you are an extreme bodybuilder, I see no reason to take supplements aside from basic protein.

Good luck

[Devilspawn]

of course you would :). Im a triathlete as well as an avid weightlifter. I lift because it makes me feel good inside and out. I do triathlons because i love cardio and the heart is the most important muscle you can work in your body. Nobody dies from a weak pectoral.

That being said lifting is a good idea for anyone looking to lose weight. Especially if you haven't lifted in a long time (or ever) you will make muscular gains very quickly. Muscle burns fat so you will be burning more calories. Unless you really take lifting to the extreme and become very large it won't inhibit you in any way.



I personally am not a fan of creatine or too many supplements. I achieved great results (5"10, 168, 8% bf) with just hard work and protein. Creatine is a "natural" supplement but anything in excess is bad for you and frankly when you take creatine you are overloading your body. Which is why you need to cycle it. Some people benefit more than others.

The only supplement i take is 1 protein shake after my workouts. With a proper diet you can get all the protein you need. Unless you are an extreme bodybuilder, i see no reason to take supplements aside from basic protein.

Good luck

+1

[Scott]

Cool, thanks for the info. I did a lot of weight training in high school (state competition-level swimming), but I have gotten lazy in the 10 years since graduation. Now, I'm finally getting back into rhythm, and it feels great. It doesn't hurt that the weather is perfect for cycling right now (the high today through friday is in the 60's, lows in the 40's). I'm trying to get adapted to it now, so when the brutal Florida summers arrive, I won't slack off as much.

Does the same line of thinking apply to a fully-grown adult as it did during my teenage years...lower weight and higher reps for weight loss and muscle tone? Then higher weight with less reps for muscle mass? Or is that all more of a myth?

[Devilspawn]

Cool, thanks for the info. I did a lot of weight training in high school (state competition-level swimming), but I have gotten lazy in the 10 years since graduation. Now, I'm finally getting back into rhythm, and it feels great. It doesn't hurt that the weather is perfect for cycling right now (the high today through friday is in the 60's, lows in the 40's). I'm trying to get adapted to it now, so when the brutal Florida summers arrive, I won't slack off as much.

Does the same line of thinking apply to a fully-grown adult as it did during my teenage years...lower weight and higher reps for weight loss and muscle tone? Then higher weight with less reps for muscle mass? Or is that all more of a myth?

find what works for you... you can lose "weight" or gain "muscle mass" doing it either way and in combination... you need to find what works for you...

[coyfish]

Cool, thanks for the info. I did a lot of weight training in high school (state competition-level swimming), but I have gotten lazy in the 10 years since graduation. Now, I'm finally getting back into rhythm, and it feels great. It doesn't hurt that the weather is perfect for cycling right now (the high today through friday is in the 60's, lows in the 40's). I'm trying to get adapted to it now, so when the brutal Florida summers arrive, I won't slack off as much.

Does the same line of thinking apply to a fully-grown adult as it did during my teenage years...lower weight and higher reps for weight loss and muscle tone? Then higher weight with less reps for muscle mass? Or is that all more of a myth?

Thats a myth more or less. "Tone" is nothing more than muscle with low BF. So you are right its good for calorie burning since doing high reps is more taxing (calorically speaking) than lower reps. People often do high rep lower weight workouts while cutting because it allows them to burn calories in the gym while avoiding breaking down their muscles too badly. When you are in caloric deficit you aren't supplying the necessary nutrition for muscle to rebuild as it was. In other words (except in certain circumstances) you won't gain muscle mass unless you eat enough. One of those circumstances is if you haven't worked out in a while. You will get significantly stronger quickly but you will reach a plateu in that regard pretty soon. So definately train for strength imo. The muscle you gain will help burn calories.


As you get older your body takes more time to recover. Im only 22 so I can't say I know what this feels like but you should start with full body workouts 2 times a week. Keep the intensity where you feel comfortable. As you gain confidence push yourself more and more until you are working out with maximum intensity each workout. You can then start isolating muscle gruops to certain days and do individual muscle isolation exersizes.


When you are younger you can get away with about anything but injury is no fun so be safe!

[Devilspawn]

if anyone needs protein powder... this site is having a great deal right now with free shipping...

15lbs of isolate or blend for ~$60:

http://www.allthewhey.com/whpris.html

[CHICO2003]

Damn... that is a good deal. I must be missing something though... It says $144

[Devilspawn]

Damn... that is a good deal. I must be missing something though... It says $144

damn... sale over...must have just been a one day thing

I got 30 lbs of whey for $120...

[S.A.MSP]

What up everyone! Been a long time and I hope everyone is doing well and being healthy!!

Update on my lifting!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LLyuuEQsE8&feature=relmfu


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZoDBtVZXEo&feature=relmfu

[HKPRO5]

I need to get back into the gym. Ever since I got out of the Marines I have been slacking. While I was in Okinawa, I competed in two bodybuilding competitions. So I was pretty serious. But now I just work and sleep. kinda hard lol. But once my bills are paid off first thing im doing is getting a gym membership!

[S.A.MSP]

Right on man!! I'm having a tough time getting to gym at the moment here in Zimbabwe. The gyms close at 8pm, I only get home at 6 after an hour drive. By that time I'm exhausted. The gym also isn't really close to me but, I am moving tomorrow and I'll be right around the corner :) Can't wait!

[speedracr79]

Well i just started the P90X a couple days ago and man i was sore after the first day. i use to be in really good shape during and after highschool played basketball and worked out everyday then i finally settled down with my now wife and well it all went to shit. My shape i mean well i still have a shape its just more like a pear now. Diabetis runs in the family so im trying to avoid that plus i want more energy to play with my kids and i really miss playing basketball. I just got tired of being overweight and finally decided to do something about it.

[Breeegz]

a wise man once said, "Exercise is important, but Nutrition is essential because you can't out-train a shitty diet."

p90x should do you good, but you should pair it up with eating healthy. These people have it about right IMHO.. http://whole9life.com/category/whole-30/

[Devilspawn]

a wise man once said, "Exercise is important, but Nutrition is essential because you can't out-train a shitty diet."

p90x should do you good, but you should pair it up with eating healthy. These people have it about right IMHO.. http://whole9life.com/category/whole-30/

bold=+1

so paleo essentially...


there is nothing wrong with the foods they claim you shouldn't eat besides maybe "maybe" the artificial sweeteners... I've read pros and cons to this diet and I'm entirely on the fence about this as it's essentially a modified keto diet that lets you eat fruit...

IMO there is nothing wrong with rice, oatmeal, grains, milk, etc and there is no scientific evidence that the inclusion of these types of foods are bad for "modern" man when used in a "healthy" diet regimen that's not biased in some way to support or not support the paleo diet...

find a "healthy" diet that you enjoy and stick to it if it give you the results you want I say or eat "unhealthy" and live happy if you wish too...

[Breeegz]

Excess sugar and the Artificial Sweeteners are probably the worst offenders because they shift your perception of sweet tasting foods, everything will taste dull without a little sweet added. I take it a little further by eliminating grains and legumes, I've cut back on my dairy a lot, but since I'm lactose tolerant I keep milk around because I like the taste. That's not saying that I never slip, I take it to about 80-90% which allows me to eat healthy and still enjoy ice cream cake on my birthday and not feel guilty about it (I feel like I want to sleep about 45 minutes after a bunch of carbs like that, but I don't feel guilty)

Modified Keto... maybe, but it's not necessarily by design. It's like accidental low-carb, just because the food eliminated is mostly carbs. I haven't seen anyone recommend specific macro nutrient ratios. Kurt Harris of http://www.archevore.com/get-started/ chooses to eat rice and potatoes because they are starches without many of the problematic ingredients that Whole9 talks about. He's more concerned about vegetable and seed oils affecting out O-3 and O-6 ratio among other things, but doesn't call out for a specific ratio.

So about as many different bloggers and authors that write about the Paleo diet, you'll find that there are about as many takes on the Paleo Diet. I'm in the camp that there is no one diet for everyone, and that there is enough difference between any two people that you have to find out what works for you. Try eliminating the commonly accepted neolithic foods for a period of time then add them back in one at a time to see if they change how you feel.

[Devilspawn]

warning long post... inb4 tl/dr

I preference my comments with this disclaimer: I'm an overall active individual so my views are based my experiences with diet and what I can eat and what I think others should be able to eat if your active and like I am... if you're not then my comments may not apply to your views or the way you eat...

with that said...

I'm all for a discussion about diets... so I'm first going to say that I agree with 95% of what you say in reference to a "paleo type" diet to which I like to call it if you don't follow every guideline... I have found that people get very bent out of shape over what�s Paleo and what isn�t..

I follow a similar diet meaning I eat veggies, fruit, steak, chicken, fish, nuts etc, but like you I can handle milk just fine and don't see the point to eliminate it from my diet if it has no adverse effects on me...I also have my cake and sweets every now and then as well as grains sometimes...

so wouldn't a modified keto diet be an accidental low carb?... keto essentially is low carb... accidental low carb is still low carb...

Like Kurt I totally agree that rice for one and maybe potatoes are fine to eat if you wish to stay on a modified paleo diet...

I don't agree with Kurt in:
1. Counting...You do need to count/weigh and know what you're eating unless you just don't care... you can't eat whatever amounts you want on any type of diet dependent on you goals(fat loss/weight loss/weight gain/muscle gain)... simple calories in vs calories out means you have to know if you have a specific goal with reference to body composition or at least have a good estimate which is still counting...

I find it funny that he tells you not to count anything then gives g/day and % of macros you should have... you can't get these numbers unless you count... I do understand and agree that itr normally work as you tend to cut several hundred calories by eliminating certain foods therefore people generally start losing weight without counting exactly

2. Meal frequency has been "debunked" already in several findings.... 6 small meals/day is no better than 3 or 1 meal a day if it works for you...2 or 3 is not best for everyone and he shouldn't make that generalization and tell people they shouldn't snack.

3. I really don't want to comment on the oils things...the "health" benefits imo from using oils out ways me wanting to cut them out of my diet because caveman didn't have the tools to extract them like we do today... with that said... I sometimes use coconut oil and I sometimes use seed oils dependent on the taste I prefer at the time...

so I'm also "in the camp that there is no one diet for everyone, and that there is enough difference between any two people that you have to find out what works for you." Everyone is different and are affected by food differently so you have to experiment and see what works for you personally.

good post Breegz... I've read several paleo site/blogs and had never seen that one... I like reading/listening to views on diet and I'm not sure if I've found one that I'm totally committed to yet...

[Breeegz]

Thanks for the props. I've been doing a lot of reading this past year just to get to where I'm at now.


so wouldn't a modified keto diet be an accidental low carb?... keto essentially is low carb... accidental low carb is still low carb...

If you wanted to eat the Paleo diet and go into Ketosis, you can. What are Ketosis' level of carbs, less than 30g a day? (IIRC) I don't count my carbs, so I couldn't tell you where I'm at, but I can assure you, it's more than 30g a day. I don't think you can accidently eat less than 30g of carbs a day (everyday), but you might drop below that in certain circumstances eating the Paleo diet. Out of the blogs I follow, only Mark Sisson of Marksdailyapple has a carb reccomendation and he recommends between 100g-ish. He's not advocating that you stick with this, it's just a ballpark, but it's well above Keto levels (and well below USDA recommendations).

I call what I "do" the Paleo Diet even though I don't really like the label, but it's mainstream enough that people will recognize it so I use it. Since I started by reading Robb Wolf's book and get information from people that associate themselves with the Paleo Diet, I might as well accept the label, right? Besides "eating real foods", I reject the lipid hypothesis (fat causes heart disease), the "Calories in vs. Calories Out" formula (3500 calories = 1 pound of fat loss), and think that increased sonsumption of sugar (insulin resistance) is causing many of the modern diseases.

Here is a couple more Paleo-ish blogs if you haven't seen them;

http://jackkruse.com/
http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/ -ish
http://fuelasrx.blogspot.com/2011/07/gluten-intolerance-celiac-disease-and.html -Written by a R.D. friend of mine

And if you have 90 minutes, you should watch Dr Lustig talk about sugar and fructose consumption.
http://youtu.be/dBnniua6-oM


tl:dr I think we agree on most points.

[Devilspawn]

Thanks for the props. I've been doing a lot of reading this past year just to get to where I'm at now.



If you wanted to eat the Paleo diet and go into Ketosis, you can. What are Ketosis' level of carbs, less than 30g a day? (IIRC) I don't count my carbs, so I couldn't tell you where I'm at, but I can assure you, it's more than 30g a day. I don't think you can accidently eat less than 30g of carbs a day (everyday), but you might drop below that in certain circumstances eating the Paleo diet. Out of the blogs I follow, only Mark Sisson of Marksdailyapple has a carb reccomendation and he recommends between 100g-ish. He's not advocating that you stick with this, it's just a ballpark, but it's well above Keto levels (and well below USDA recommendations).

I call what I "do" the Paleo Diet even though I don't really like the label, but it's mainstream enough that people will recognize it so I use it. Since I started by reading Robb Wolf's book and get information from people that associate themselves with the Paleo Diet, I might as well accept the label, right? Besides "eating real foods", I reject the lipid hypothesis (fat causes heart disease), the "Calories in vs. Calories Out" formula (3500 calories = 1 pound of fat loss), and think that increased sonsumption of sugar (insulin resistance) is causing many of the modern diseases.

Here is a couple more Paleo-ish blogs if you haven't seen them;

http://jackkruse.com/
http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/ -ish
http://fuelasrx.blogspot.com/2011/07/gluten-intolerance-celiac-disease-and.html -Written by a R.D. friend of mine

And if you have 90 minutes, you should watch Dr Lustig talk about sugar and fructose consumption.
http://youtu.be/dBnniua6-oM


tl:dr I think we agree on most points.

good post... I will look at those sites and watch the video... Thanks!

After reading about the paleo diet I like it and have incorporated some of its principles in my diet...some of the recipes I've found on paleo sites look and sound awesome...

I'm all for eating meats, veggies and fruits mostly now, but I won't go so far as to go out of my way to get grass fed everything and cut out certain grains that I enjoy and don't cause me issues...

I've started eating a lot more fruit lately, and I can actually say I enjoy eating fruit for once....

[Breeegz]

EverydayPaleo.com

Sarah makes bomb dishes.. her book rocks as well.

I don't (can't afford) grass fed meats for all of my meat. I try to, and think it's important, but it's not something I can afford right now.