Turbo Miata, or Supercharged Miata

[s0n1cm0nk3y]

first of all, I am not looking to start a flame war, so all those who start arguements on this thread, please, just get a life.

okay, basically I have fallen in love with my miata, but I also realize there is a need for more power. I rode passenger in a supercharged miata at an scca race and I must admit, i was astounded. Such a little car going that quick was interesting. Ive been a ~400whp gsx eclipse, but I can't recall having nearly the thrill that I did in that little miata.

With that in mind, I draw my attention to a supercharged setup in regards to personal experience. I know the drawbacks and the worries of parasitic loss. The power on tap was enough to overthrow those worries. Also this car is my daily driver, so being in CO, i need something that will not fudge me over in the snow (im looking to push lower 200's to the wheels).

With the snow in mind, I realize the drawback to the turbocharged setup. Yes power is there, and that roller coaster launch feeling is by all means thrilling, but I fear the sudden torque might screw me over in the snow.

What do you guys think? Response from those with FI setups and living in snowy climates (to which they drive in) are a definite plus.

Also for those with turbo miatas and the 1.8 engine, when do you start to spool and when do you hit full boost?

[JDM-P5]

I have a turbo'd miata...love it.

[s0n1cm0nk3y]

lol, I love my car N/A so far. but faster will be fun, when do you start to spool and what engine do you have? im looking for spools starting at 3k or so and finishing within 1k.

[mp3-79bronco]

if this matters, i have a 50 trim on my protege and it spools right at 3k and pushes 6psi before 4

[s0n1cm0nk3y]

lol, i really should change my avatar. The protege motor is a slight bit different though. 2.0 vs 1.8 and if i remember correctly, a bit more torque in the low end. the info helps, but to what degree i am not sure. :(

[JDM-P5]

I have a 91 1.6 with a GReddy kit installed.
I'm not a good starting point for you since it's completely different motors + I have a slew of mods (fmic/hard pipes/downpipe/catback/bigger injectors/fuel regulator/rx7 fuel pump etc.
I'd say around 3k I hit boost. Set to 10psi, but what fun is having a miata that loves to get wound up if you're gonna shift early (one of my habits shortly after I had blown the motor)? When I had the car in Turkey, I drifted the piss outta her. Tracked her. Terrorized pedestrians....see my sig...lol...you get the jist of it.

[kcbhiw]

Snow grip and boost will also be quite dependant on what tires and differential you have in the car. The torsen LSD that is supplied with some of them is a good unit, but it may not be up to par for snow use as it will slip if a wheel is completely unloaded. A clutch type may be worthy. Some 2nd Gen RX7's had one that can be used with the Miata and can be had relatively inexpensively.

[JDM-P5]

He's the expert.

Kev details on the rex diff...

[s0n1cm0nk3y]

im curious as what would be considered safe boost. Whether i go supercharged or turbo charged, I will be tossing in an intercooler, Im just curious as to what our block can handle. I heard its the cousin to the 323 gtx fe3t

[kcbhiw]

im curious as what would be considered safe boost. Whether i go supercharged or turbo charged, I will be tossing in an intercooler, Im just curious as to what our block can handle. I heard its the cousin to the 323 gtx fe3t

The BP can handle quite a bit. Though, "safe boost" is strictly subjective. What turbo/intercooler/piping arangment/etc. will be installed? Get the proper equipment such as engine managment, WBEGO, knock detection, and tune the car on a dyno. Such is really the only way to really define what's safe or not.

Subjectively, 10-12 PSI should be fine as long as you supply enough fuel. The 99 engine has a pretty good CR at 9.5:1 so listen for detonation.

[s0n1cm0nk3y]

if anything i will most likely buy a flying miata setup. and forgive me but CR? as in compression ratio?

[kcbhiw]

if anything i will most likely buy a flying miata setup. and forgive me but CR? as in compression ratio?

That's correct.

[Dparks7]

i was having the same question but with the 1.6? is that a stronger block stock?

[magnamx5]

i was having the same question but with the 1.6? is that a stronger block stock?

same block essentialy but most people flock to the 1,8 dont ask me why both are very strong have forged cranks and run the same rods. man this forum is dead. i gues MT.net stole alot of you all away.

[Bassmachine]

The 1.6 and 1.8 can run 12 psi all day without a problem. And ive seen miatas with gt25 hotside and gt28 cool side and impeller and they will spool as soon as 2400 rpm depending on which exhaust mani you use. Honestly you can buy a FM kit but your paying for convenience you can make a decent one yourself for 1500(not including fuel and timing management). Turbo is the way to go if you want numbers if you want insta boost go with a SC from jackson racing you can even get the carb legal kit if your affraid you wont pass inspection. 99 motors btw has good low end so dont worry about your boost threshold. Honestly i think the protege engine is junk compared to the miata engine but thats just me..

Edit: 1.6 block is the long block so yes its considered "stronger" but when you need to factor that in your already in the forged internal area so a new block would be needed regardless.

[disturbedfan121]

Edit: 1.6 block is the long block so yes its considered "stronger" but when you need to factor that in your already in the forged internal area so a new block would be needed regardless.

do you know what you're talking about? lol

the term "long block" is used when buying/selling engines. It means its comes with the head, exhaust mani, and most accessories.

the 1.8 is a stronger motor period. it will make more power, more torque and make it faster than the 1.6 can. this goes for stock to stock, or built to built. comparing a stock motor to a built motor just can't be done.

THERE IS NO REPLACEMENT FOR DISPLACEMENT

[Lawrence C]

For me it'll depend on how i'll use the power.

For autox i'd say s/c so you don't have to deal with the boost lag.

I'm a big fan of turbos overall since you can also keep the same gas mileage once you're not boosting unlike s/c.

[MSMjohn]

I like turbochargers there seems to be an endless amount of upgrades you can do to make it faster if you want more acceleration. Where as superchargers seems to be fixed at one horsepower. With a turbo you always have the feeling that my car could be faster. That is what I liked about my Mazdaspeed mx5 when I bought it. As the years went by I did horsepower upgrades here & there & it felt like I had a different car with every little new upgrade. I think one of the thrills of owning a turboed car is the anticipation of the next upgrade.

[CorkSport]

Why not both! There is a cold side SC kit out there combined with a huge compressor you could have quick boost off the line and massive top end power.

-Derrick

[Sn0wbird]

The 1.6 and 1.8 can run 12 psi all day without a problem. And ive seen miatas with gt25 hotside and gt28 cool side and impeller and they will spool as soon as 2400 rpm depending on which exhaust mani you use. Honestly you can buy a FM kit but your paying for convenience you can make a decent one yourself for 1500(not including fuel and timing management). Turbo is the way to go if you want numbers if you want insta boost go with a SC from jackson racing you can even get the carb legal kit if your affraid you wont pass inspection. 99 motors btw has good low end so dont worry about your boost threshold. Honestly i think the protege engine is junk compared to the miata engine but thats just me..



Could anyone flesh out the bolded shorthand of this post?

Which exhaust manifold is better or best and how does that choice affect time to spool up?

gt25 hotside and gt28 cool side and impeller: I assume he's talking before and after an inter-cooler, but "gt25..."?

What does an FM kit consist of and how would you assemble one yourself.... especially fuel and timing management?

[StealthWyvern]

he is talking about a hybrid turbo

[JamesCH]

he is talking about a hybrid turbo

A T3/T4 basically. I am running one of those right now.

I'd go turbo, for the many reasons already outlined. If you're worried about too much power in the snow... dial down the boost, or even disconnect the waste gate actuator so that you basically can't boost. Also as mentioned, get great snows and a good LSD and you'll do okay.

[KrGsMrNKusinagi]

The only supercharger I would consider would be the MP62 kit with an intercooler option.

That one company put down 288 wheel power with a built bottom end with it.. The base setup gives you close to 180 wheel power and you can upgrade from there. The guy putting down 230 ran a low 13 at 109 mph with the mp62 kit in a 1.8

[RacingMazda.com]

Done correctly I have see much higher boost on also larger turbos. so do it right either way.