Gas Question??????

[WonderMike]

Just wanted to see what you guys were running in your MS3....I always run high test but my question for yall is what brand do yall run I was running BP but they have switched over to the E10 or 10% ethonol...so its getting harder to find "pure gas" anymore so thought I would ask what yall were running

[ndedomin]

I usually go for shell v-power or mobil super+ unleaded. Both are 93 Octane and have served me well.

[BOOSTR]

Just about every station will have that sticker on the pumps soon. Its part of the cornification of America. I've been using Sunoco as they have the best price in my area. I don't like the idea of E10 blends but what are you going to do?

[Rotus]

You should only run 91 octane or better in a turbo car. The higher the octane, the more resistant the gas is to pre-ignition from the high temps of high compression.

As far as the amount of ethanol in the gas, e10 is safe to use.

[CWPspeed3]

My guess is BP may do e10 in regular and midgrade but their Ultimate shouldnt have any. I could be wrong but it must say on the pump if it does have any ethanol in the gas. Personally I'd stay away from any e10 gas, it wont damage the car but it sure as hell doesnt help it.

[phantom6294]

Generally, if I have a choice... I fill up using Exxon/Mobil -- it just so happens I have two Exxons that are convenient to many of the places I run errands to. That said, I will fill up with Shell, BP/Amoco, Chevron (probably in that order, who knows). I refuse to use Citgo gas, Race way, or fill up at a no-name brand gas station. It may completely irrational, but that's just the way I am. Obviously, I always fill up with 'premium' which is 93 Octane in my area.

[Rotus]

Generally, if I have a choice... I fill up using Exxon/Mobil -- it just so happens I have two Exxons that are convenient to many of the places I run errands to. That said, I will fill up with Shell, BP/Amoco, Chevron (probably in that order, who knows). I refuse to use Citgo gas, Race way, or fill up at a no-name brand gas station. It may completely irrational, but that's just the way I am. Obviously, I always fill up with 'premium' which is 93 Octane in my area.

All gas companies buy from each other, that's well known. Chevron is the only one of the big ones that checks the quality of the gas they buy from other companies to make sure it meets their standards.

[CWPspeed3]

As long as you stick with any tier one gas company you should be fine, Shell has pissed me off in the pass so I dont use them, Mobile is usually the most expensive, I wish we had chevron stations in my area, I like Speedway but BP/Amoco has their "ultimate" which is the best gas around and I have a station right by my work that is the cheapest gas around, matched with my BP card I get 5% off all ultimate gas. I dont support Citgo/Valero so as irrational as it may be it works for me.

[BOOSTR]

Gas is gas. Some companies just have more successful marketing strategies and irrationally loyal customer bases.
And all grades will be blended with the E10 if the pump has the sticker. It comes out of the tank truck that way.

[opt_ms3]

I try to only use Sunoco fuel. They sell higher octane gas (94+) at some of their big locations around the Philly area where I used to live. Back around home, some of the stations have 94 as their Ultra, but I have not been able to find it at any stations in the NE. I've heard they are starting to phase it out. I dunno, I like their fuel the best; I've heard that their oil doesn't come from the middle east, but I could be wrong. All I know is that Exxon/Mobile and Shell/Texaco have been responsible for some serious issues in Africa, and Citgo is a Venezuela-owned corporation who hates the United States. (gun)[/rant]

[camrycev6]

Gas is gas. Some companies just have more successful marketing strategies and irrationally loyal customer bases.
And all grades will be blended with the E10 if the pump has the sticker. It comes out of the tank truck that way.

Exactly. The same gas companies distribute to Exxon, Royal Farms, Seven Eleven, etc., Just get 91 or better.

[mazdaspeedster3]

I usually go for shell v-power or mobil super+ unleaded. Both are 93 Octane and have served me well.

+1

[mazdaspeedster3]

valero, that dictacting arse! DONT BUY THAT GAS!

[awsmp5]

not to bust your loyalty balls, but my former boss worked at a local refinery back a decade or so ago (i believe he said it was a sunoco one) and guess what?
shell, citgo, no label, amoco(at the time), and of course sunoco trucks would all come and go to fill up their trucks...
soo... it's exactly the same shit + or - additives that each company decides to put in.

so what do i use now? the cheapest high octane gas i run into (cabpatch)

[CWPspeed3]

The gas may come from the same refineries but its where the money and profit go in the end which is what make some people buy one place or another. Also gas stations will sell gas to each other too so if you try and boycott a Shell station and the Speedway across the street gets all the business when they run low Shell will sell them their gas. The only one that comes from a different source is Amoco Ultimate, that has dedicated lines. According to all the discovery channel specials I've seen over the years anyway on oil refineries and OPEC.

[WonderMike]

(2thumbs)
The gas may come from the same refineries but its where the money and profit go in the end which is what make some people buy one place or another. Also gas stations will sell gas to each other too so if you try and boycott a Shell station and the Speedway across the street gets all the business when they run low Shell will sell them their gas. The only one that comes from a different source is Amoco Ultimate, that has dedicated lines. According to all the discovery channel specials I've seen over the years anyway on oil refineries and OPEC.

[WonderMike]

did not realize that this would be two pages......anyway I am trying to stay away from e10 I know the car will run it just the performance and other problems it causes

[micronesia]

How bad is 89? (For MS3) (I know the website says 91)

Obviously 87 is no good...

[CWPspeed3]

How bad is 89? (For MS3) (I know the website says 91)

Obviously 87 is no good...

Probably not going to kill your car but for the extra .10 a gallon just get premium its only an extra $1.45 a tank.

[BOOSTR]

"My gas isn't better for your car; it's just more expensive."
Oil companies spend lots of money explaining why their gas is better than the competition's. Chevron's gas, for example, is fortified with "Techron," and Amoco Ultimate is supposed to save the planet along with your engine. But today more than ever, one gallon of gas is as good as the next.
True, additives help to clean your engine, but what the companies don't tell you is that all gas does so. Since 1994 the government has required that detergents be added to all gasoline to help prevent fuel injectors from clogging. State and local regulators keep a close watch to make sure those standards are met; in Florida inspectors checked 45,000 samples last year to ensure the state's gas supply was up to snuff, and 99% of the time it was. "There's little difference between brand-name gas and any other," says AAA spokesperson Geoff Sundstrom.
What's more, your local Chevron station may sell gas refined by Shell or Exxon Mobil. Suppliers share pipelines, so they all use the same fuel. And the difference between the most expensive brand-name gas and the lowliest gallon of no-brand fuel? Often just a quart of detergent added to an 8,000-gallon tanker truck.

Source: SmartMoney.

[camrycev6]

How bad is 89? (For MS3) (I know the website says 91)

Obviously 87 is no good...

Uh-oh... Well, please read my post below where I ran two full tanks of 89 through my MS3. After you read it, decide for yourself. As you will see, the discussion got pretty "lively" at times.

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123714495

[micronesia]

Uh-oh... Well, please read my post below where I ran two full tanks of 89 through my MS3. After you read it, decide for yourself. As you will see, the discussion got pretty "lively" at times.

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123714495
Oh thanks! Yeah I see their point that there's no reason to go cheap on gas with a car like this, but I also think they are wrong for giving you a hard time when you were doing it for purely scientific inquiry, and had done enough research to feel fairly confident that you wouldn't destroy your car from 2-3 tanks of 89.

BTW, why does everyone say you have to put 93 when the mazdausa website says you only need 91?

[CWPspeed3]

Oh thanks! Yeah I see their point that there's no reason to go cheap on gas with a car like this, but I also think they are wrong for giving you a hard time when you were doing it for purely scientific inquiry, and had done enough research to feel fairly confident that you wouldn't destroy your car from 2-3 tanks of 89.

BTW, why does everyone say you have to put 93 when the mazdausa website says you only need 91?

I think for doing an experiment its good to know that its not going to blow your car up or cause major problems after a couple fillups but if your just doing it to be cheap and only run 89 its not the best idea.

Depending on what part of the country/world you are in some places only offer 91 as their premium, others offer 93 as premium. In Michigan they have 93 and sunoco has 94 as their premium+

[camrycev6]

Oh thanks! Yeah I see their point that there's no reason to go cheap on gas with a car like this, but I also think they are wrong for giving you a hard time when you were doing it for purely scientific inquiry, and had done enough research to feel fairly confident that you wouldn't destroy your car from 2-3 tanks of 89.

BTW, why does everyone say you have to put 93 when the mazdausa website says you only need 91?

You are welcome. As you can see from the post, it didn't hurt my car at all.

As far as why people insist on 93, I don't know why they say that. I have always maintained 91 is perfectly fine. (Per the manual.) It simply isn't available most places around here.

[hilmar2k]

I wish I could find some non-E10 gasoline. Unfortunately, in NY, E10 has been the standard for years.

[MikeHTally]

93 octane from Sam's or Costco, usually Sam's

[Russm]

Good Day
In SE Wisconsin we have 93 octane + 10% Ethonal, plus it is reformulated for Emmission, my 08 Speed still went 13.50's @ 105 MPH (MSCAI&MSCBE) so from what I have read on the boards this bad gas isn't working so BAD, 27 MPG city/hwy!

[DAC17]

I've always found that Shell V-power is very good gas. Look at toptiergas.com for other brands that meet the higher standards. BTW, all gas is the same, but each company has a slightly different additive package, which is what makes the difference.

[peter.sellers]

I usually use Chevron 93 (with it's magic techron :). Also remember that the hose and the plumbing from the fill up point to the the bottom where the gas is stored at the gas station hold close to 1.5 gallons. So you might think that you got 10g of 93 gas, but its really 8.5g of 93 and 1.5g of whatever the guy before you used.

Of course this is only true at those stations that have a common hose and for all grades.

I learned this as a biker; to never fill the teeny 4.5g bike tank until you have only 0.5g remaining.....

[FrequentFlyer]

I get gas on a US Air Force base. Price is usually a few cents cheaper and I get to pump it myself, which is worth another few cents a gallon to me. :) Here in NJ, it's "unlawful" to pump your own gas, as if it takes an enormous amount of brainpower and skill. I don't know what kind of gas it is, but the car seems to run fine on it for $3.59 a gallon (93 octane).

[Huligan]

While in the states, Shell v-power when possible... when in Mexico, however, Pemex Premium (nervous)

[dan1101]

I've been running 89 occasionally, especially when gas was up around $4.00 per gallon. No ill effects noted, and I was paying attention.

I keep a mileage log that I can type up if anybody is interested. Miles per tank, gallons added, octane, MPG. Mileage for me is roughly the same with 89 and 93. I've been getting around 350 miles per tank.

I generally fill up with Exxon, sometimes Shell.

[GoFast]

gas is just like oil. which ones the best? in reality it all comes from the same rough oil barrel, its whats done to it that makes any gas any better/worse

[camrycev6]

gas is just like oil. which ones the best? in reality it all comes from the same rough oil barrel, its whats done to it that makes any gas any better/worse

I think that is oversimplifying things a bit. Yes, from a hydrocarbon quality perspective that is true. But the ratio of heptane to octane, as well as additives (or lack thereof) play important roles as well.

[micronesia]

If you are filling up above a third, I don't see why you can't alternate between 89 and 93 to average out the octane to a reasonable number.

[FrequentFlyer]

I've been running 89 occasionally, especially when gas was up around $4.00 per gallon. No ill effects noted, and I was paying attention.

I keep a mileage log that I can type up if anybody is interested. Miles per tank, gallons added, octane, MPG. Mileage for me is roughly the same with 89 and 93. I've been getting around 350 miles per tank.

I generally fill up with Exxon, sometimes Shell.

I go through 6, sometimes 7 tanks a month with my commuting and I don't even attempt to run 89 occasionally to save money. Even if I did 3 tanks of 93 and 3 tanks of 89, I'm looking at about $8 a month savings. Not really worth it IMO.

[cmescoot]

Id Love to find a conversion kit for our speed3's for E85! That stuff is super clean and is 105 octane...Not to mention its cheaper than premium gas here.

[FrequentFlyer]

The only way to get the most out of E85 is to design a motor to only run on E85 and not be a "flex" motor because it is not as efficient run in a gasoline.

[pdqgp]

no thanks. E85 is the devil and is directly related to the cause in food prices going up. not to mention it's far more inefficient to run. they need to begin seriously considering the bio-fuel from algae and then we'll be able to see a serious price drop. however that won't happen as the powers in control don't want low prices or profits.


Id Love to find a conversion kit for our speed3's for E85! That stuff is super clean and is 105 octane...Not to mention its cheaper than premium gas here.

[MikeHTally]

E-85 is a hoax. Much less power than gasoline and FAR more expensive to produce.

[cucamelsmd15]

E-85 is a hoax. Much less power than gasoline and FAR more expensive to produce.

Um, wat?

105 octane, cooling effects of alcohol, and the fact that you can dump tons of boost/timing into a car running e85 says your wrong. A good tune with e85 will generally get you 20-30hp or more over 93 assuming you have the fuel system to support it.

[azturbo3d]

Shell V-Power :) every now and then I add a secret ingredient when no one's watching...

[camrycev6]

I had to fill up with 89 the other day because all of the stations were out of 93. I was like WTF? Oh well, at least from some previous tests I did with 89, I know it won't hurt my car just to run a tank through.

[MikeHTally]

Um, wat?

105 octane, cooling effects of alcohol, and the fact that you can dump tons of boost/timing into a car running e85 says your wrong. A good tune with e85 will generally get you 20-30hp or more over 93 assuming you have the fuel system to support it.

You might want to do some homework -- ethanol has far less energy than gasoline, and costs WAY more to produce. The alcohol destroys fuel lines (unless they're designed to resist the corrosive properties). It takes something like 11,000 gallons of water to produce a gallon of E85, and guess how it gets to the station? DIESEL. The list goes on and on. E85 is a fraud.

[cucamelsmd15]

You might want to do some homework -- ethanol has far less energy than gasoline, and costs WAY more to produce. The alcohol destroys fuel lines (unless they're designed to resist the corrosive properties). It takes something like 11,000 gallons of water to produce a gallon of E85, and guess how it gets to the station? DIESEL. The list goes on and on. E85 is a fraud.

Actually, its you who might want to do some homework.

E85 is about 30% volumetrically less efficient. I never denied that, in fact, I stated it plainly when I made my statement about the fuel system. Secondly, unless youre driving a car from the 80's, you dont have to worry about your fuel lines.

Now, if you want to start arguing that its 105 octane, and that a good tune on e85 wont net you 20-30hp more than on 93, be my guest. Ive seen the results first hand, Ive done it. But, I see youve already bought into the "e85 is the devil" BS that people love to spew, so I wont bother explaining why youre wrong.

[MikeHTally]

Actually, its you who might want to do some homework.

E85 is about 30% volumetrically less efficient. I never denied that, in fact, I stated it plainly when I made my statement about the fuel system. Secondly, unless youre driving a car from the 80's, you dont have to worry about your fuel lines.

Now, if you want to start arguing that its 105 octane, and that a good tune on e85 wont net you 20-30hp more than on 93, be my guest. Ive seen the results first hand, Ive done it. But, I see youve already bought into the "e85 is the devil" BS that people love to spew, so I wont bother explaining why youre wrong.
Whatever. Octane is not power. Keep believing.

[builthatch]

Actually, its you who might want to do some homework.

E85 is about 30% volumetrically less efficient. I never denied that, in fact, I stated it plainly when I made my statement about the fuel system. Secondly, unless youre driving a car from the 80's, you dont have to worry about your fuel lines.

Now, if you want to start arguing that its 105 octane, and that a good tune on e85 wont net you 20-30hp more than on 93, be my guest. Ive seen the results first hand, Ive done it. But, I see youve already bought into the "e85 is the devil" BS that people love to spew, so I wont bother explaining why youre wrong.

Jeff Evans, from Evans Tuning, who is in many people's eyes (count me in) one of the country's premier tuners, sings the praises of e85 tunes. it's very common amongst the high hp turbo guys, has been for a year or two.

there was an old thread running on h-t for a while about e85, i need to find it.

EDIT: here it is http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread/1812349

[cucamelsmd15]

Whatever. Octane is not power. Keep believing.

LOL

Obviously youre too ignorant to know what octane means, so we will just leave it at that.

[MikeHTally]

LOL

Obviously youre too ignorant to know what octane means, so we will just leave it at that.
Octane is the fuel's resistance to burning. Dumbass.

[cucamelsmd15]

Octane is the fuel's resistance to burning. Dumbass.

(rofl2)(rofl2)(rofl2)(rofl2)(rofl2)(rofl2)

No, dumbass, octane is the fuels resistance to spontaneous combustion and knocking, not its resistance to burning. 87 burns the same as 93 when its lit by a spark, dumbass. Stated differently, 93 has a higher activation energy than 87, hence its greater resistance to knock, and wide use in high compression engines.

[builthatch]

if i was a mod, i'd come in here and tell everyone that they better chill out with the name calling, etc or else sanctions will be dealt.

but i'm not a mod, and you all don't care what i say hahahaha

[slo4now]

Amoco 93 mixed with Torco Race Fuel Additve Concentrate.
Gives me 100 octane all the time.