newb here :)

[BoostHard05]

Not an MSP owner but i do have an interest in the cars and would like to learn a little more about them.

I currently own a 2005 saturn ION Redline.

Mods:

-ZZP 2.8" MPS
-Lucas 42's
-GM Stage 2 Belt
-CAI
-HP Tuners Custom Tune
-NGK BKR7E's
-Vibrant 4-2-1 Header
-Vibrant 3" Downpipe
-Vibrant 3" Hi-Flow Cat
-Cross Drilled/Slotted Rotors

Best time to date is a 14.6 @ 100mph here at 6200' above sea level, and that was with just the 2.8" pulley upgrade... ive since done quite a bit more as you can see from the mods list :) after i get my dyno tune and new tires next week im hopin to make around 250-260whp and break into the mid 13's with traction at this altitude.

here's some pics of the car.

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b381/intalect/2-21-08photoshoot006.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b381/intalect/2-21-08photoshoot004.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b381/intalect/2-21-08photoshoot005.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b381/intalect/2-21-08photoshoot008.jpg

I talked to a guy the other night that said that an MSP at 17psi would smoke me pretty good... i was always under the impression that the MSP's only dyno'd in the mid 100whp range stock so i came here to learn more about the car :) and what it is capable of.

[JDM Sam]

A tuned built one will smoke you. A tuned with moderate bolt-on would give you a good race. A near stock or untuned one will lose.

The MSP will shock you on the freeway runs where it has no traction issues.

[BoostHard05]

A tuned built one will smoke you. A tuned with moderate bolt-on would give you a good race. A near stock or untuned one will lose.

The MSP will shock you on the freeway runs where it has no traction issues.

What do you consider a "tuned built one" and would a bolt on MSP with a tune really make that much power? or is it thier weight that makes em quick?

I should be in the 250-260whp range up here after the new tune.

[JDM Sam]

Something like my old setup intake, front mount, exhaust, and Unichip retune @ 10 psi will give you a good race.

A tuned and built setup is one that has at minimum a built shortblock (forge rods and pistons) boosting 1 bar or more. A MSP that has the engine built and a larger turbo and tuned would eat you alive. Like the GT3071R I have now. :)

The turbo powerband is different from your supercharger powerband. Also, the gearing on the MSP is good for acceleration. The curb weight is about 2850, so I don't consider that a big advantage.

[mazdaspeedster3]

Want to race my MS3?

[Speed3.5]

Samn - finally got the GT30R in ??

Yeah , MSP can get quick very quick, Once block its build and boosting more then 1 bar it can take or be even with evos/sti (light mod) so that should give you a good estimate of what it can do.

[JDM Sam]

I ran down light modded Evos and Stis before I was built.

It's GT3071R. :)

[JDM Sam]

Want to race my MS3?

Are you talking to me or the other guy?

[mazdaspeedster3]

LOL... The redline. I have yet to see a fast enough (chasing down EVO's or STI's) MPS yet. Are you doing complete engine replacements, or just internals with different/upgraded Turbos?

[JDM Sam]

Look on youtube for my lil street race video. That was completely stock engine internals.

Built internals, tuning, and bolt on turbos.

[JDM Sam]

Yep and Mazdaspeed Protege's stock dyno around 150 whp 150 wtq.

To the Redline
Get some springs and drop it some b/c you are offroading 4x4.

[mazdaspeedster3]

150 WHP isnt going to get you far...

[Matrix]

Wow, the Ion Redline looks considerably better than the Cobalt SS.
Nice ride. (thumb)

Now drop it with some springs, because as JDMSam said, you look like you're getting ready to go 4x4 off-roading, LOL.

[BoostHard05]

Samn - finally got the GT30R in ??

Yeah , MSP can get quick very quick, Once block its build and boosting more then 1 bar it can take or be even with evos/sti (light mod) so that should give you a good estimate of what it can do.

Well i can run down STI's and EVO's now from a roll... Ive taken an MS6 from a dig a few times too... granted i have to play catch up but with just the pulley upgrade i had about 3 cars on the guy by 80mph.

[BoostHard05]

Yep and Mazdaspeed Protege's stock dyno around 150 whp 150 wtq.

To the Redline
Get some springs and drop it some b/c you are offroading 4x4.


Wow, the Ion Redline looks considerably better than the Cobalt SS.
Nice ride. (thumb)

Now drop it with some springs, because as JDMSam said, you look like you're getting ready to go 4x4 off-roading, LOL.

Yeah... i plan on doing a drop here pretty soon... gm really wasn't thinking straight when they did the suspension.

[JDM Sam]

150 WHP isnt going to get you far...
yeah it's not stock.

[nato]

Look on youtube for my lil street race video. That was completely stock engine internals.

Built internals, tuning, and bolt on turbos.

Can't find your youtube video...

[Matrix]

Can't find your youtube video...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7MhGUzY7Dk

[BoostHard05]

Want to race my MS3?

Considering the fact that you live in michigan and i live in colorado... that would be a little hard to accomplish...

besides... at the wheels im making right around what you make at the crank (assuming you are stock)... and im over 6200' above sea level :P sea level numbers would be pretty high.

[RallyeRedSi]

Want to race my MS3?
150 WHP isnt going to get you far...

when did MS3 owner start becoming like neon srt4 owners lol

[RallyeRedSi]

Considering the fact that you live in michigan and i live in colorado... that would be a little hard to accomplish...

besides... at the wheels im making right around what you make at the crank (assuming you are stock)... and im over 6200' above sea level :P sea level numbers would be pretty high.

Nice car but needs a drop

[BoostHard05]

when did MS3 owner start becoming like neon srt4 owners lol

When they realized that they are now at the top of the food chain when it comes to FWD performance cars and let it go to thier heads... im sure we will see the same attitude from the 08 Cobalt SS Turbo owners later this year.

[dstmsp03]

6200 ft and forced induction, altitude doesnt affect forced induction like NA.. sorry.. i ran 14.1 at 5800 and 14.05 at around 700..

[BoostHard05]

6200 ft and forced induction, altitude doesnt affect forced induction like NA.. sorry.. i ran 14.1 at 5800 and 14.05 at around 700..

LOL... altitude does affect forced induction... maybe not a turbo engine but it does affect a supercharged engine...

a turbo, weather it's internaly or externaly wastegated will adjust for altitude to make up for the loss in power that comes with an altitude change so turbo cars really arent affected as much...

a roots type supercharger doesn't compress air, it only acts as a pump and paddles it into the engine in pulses... considering the fact that a supercharger still relies on the engines available power to make more power, it loses power to altitude almost like that of an N/A motor, because the air is less dense up here and oxygen is scarce, the engine loses power, thus leaving less power to be used by the blower to make boost... hence why i lose 3psi from sea level to this altitude...

there's a reason why they call superchargers "Parasitic Power Adders" it's because the blower relies on the available power of the motor to make power.

with that said, yes... i still lose power to altitude, not as much as an N/A car, but still enough to make a difference (prolly close to half a second or slightly more)

next time, make sure you know what you are talking about before you try to correct someone.

[dstmsp03]

then your car must have been instanely weak or had something wrong before with track times like that.. considering my buddy has a redline and all he has is exhaust and intake and he posted a 14.4

[Matrix]

OH DEAR GOD.

Let's grow up and stop trying to get the last "jab" in.

BoostHard05: You have a badass car that looks very slick. Welcome to the forums. We hope you enjoy your stay.

Everybody's cars are different, variances in manufacturing causes fluctuation in engine performance from car to car. We all know this very well due to the different levels of boost stock MSP's have been known to have from the factory (ranging anywhere from 5 to 6.5psi). Add in weather, altitude, and maintenance variables, and everything gets tossed in the air. So let's refrain from using the "oh yeah, well my buddy's XXXXXXXX can do XXXXXXXX" arguments.

Thanks. (thumb)

[BoostHard05]

then your car must have been instanely weak or had something wrong before with track times like that.. considering my buddy has a redline and all he has is exhaust and intake and he posted a 14.4

Your buddy's redline is prolly also running at sea level, my 100mph trap speed shows for high 13's, sadly pueblo motorsports park has the shittiest track in the entire state of colorado, modded AWD cars have trouble hooking up there... my best 60' of the night was a 2.3, if i could have got it down to a 2.1 or 2.1 i could have seen high 13's easily.

[slo03.5msp]

The saturn is nice. It looks very nice it was well put together. I agree with sam that it needs to be dropped. All in all very nice car.

As far as our buddy in this thread with the ms3 anytime you wanna play with an msp that makes more to wheels than you do, Sam is pretty far away but if you wanna take a drive to chicago I'll be more than happy to make you feel bad.

[mazdaspeedwerx]

so is someone with a msp talking shit about your redline and you are trying to figure out if you can beat him?

[nato]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7MhGUzY7Dk

Thanks!

Hey JDM Sam, what mods did you have when you beat that STi?

[BoostHard05]

so is someone with a msp talking shit about your redline and you are trying to figure out if you can beat him?

kinda... the dude is kind of a ricer and was running his mouth about his friends MSP... i forgot about the MSP's but was very interested in them in the past when they first came out... the convo i had with ol dude reminded me of the cars so i figured i would sign up to learn some more about them...

as for wondering i can beat his buddy's MSP... lol, ive walked the car a couple of times with less mods than i have now...

[kamon8404]

I destroyed an ION redline a few months ago. I would be more than happy to go toe to toe with one again. Especially one not driven by a total tool.

Here is how the story went, I was at the gas station pumping gas. I hear a car revving its engine. I look up, and its a black ion redline. The driver gets out and was like my car will beat your cars ass, your turbo is the size of my fist. I was like well what did you do to it, he said don't worry about it (i imagine he only had an exhaust and intake). So, I was like okay well he probably had a lot done to it but he did call me out so i'm willing to see what he has. We get to the light, he is revving like a tard. I hold my rpms steady at 1800 or so rpm, just enough to get me going and not spin out of control. The light turns green. I pull on him like it wasn't even funny. I was seriously 3 cars on him and I wasn't totally dogging mine to death. We get to the next light light and his passenger said my exhaust had a nice smell.

[JDM Sam]

Injen CAI, Vibrant Performance downpipe back exhaust high flow cat version, Crossover Auto FMIC, Unichip retuned by me, 10 psi on a Greddy Profec B Spec 2. Stock internals, stock turbo, 93 pump gas, full interior, no other modifications to increase airflow or power.

[BoostHard05]

I destroyed an ION redline a few months ago. I would be more than happy to go toe to toe with one again. Especially one not driven by a total tool.

Here is how the story went, I was at the gas station pumping gas. I hear a car revving its engine. I look up, and its a black ion redline. The driver gets out and was like my car will beat your cars ass, your turbo is the size of my fist. I was like well what did you do to it, he said don't worry about it (i imagine he only had an exhaust and intake). So, I was like okay well he probably had a lot done to it but he did call me out so i'm willing to see what he has. We get to the light, he is revving like a tard. I hold my rpms steady at 1800 or so rpm, just enough to get me going and not spin out of control. The light turns green. I pull on him like it wasn't even funny. I was seriously 3 cars on him and I wasn't totally dogging mine to death. We get to the next light light and his passenger said my exhaust had a nice smell.

Strange... most CAI/EXH LSJ's make upwards of 220-230whp... the 2.4L sport ION comes with the redline's appearance package... either that or the guy really couldn't drive... assuming you're not too modded that is.

[dstmsp03]

Your buddy's redline is prolly also running at sea level, my 100mph trap speed shows for high 13's, sadly pueblo motorsports park has the shittiest track in the entire state of colorado, modded AWD cars have trouble hooking up there... my best 60' of the night was a 2.3, if i could have got it down to a 2.1 or 2.1 i could have seen high 13's easily.

no it was at 5800... same as mine.. sorry.. same track, same day, same race..

[BoostHard05]

no it was at 5800... same as mine.. sorry.. same track, same day, same race..

then he either has a very strong redline or he's modded... 14.4's are average times for stock redline's at sea level. there's been a couple of freak RL's that came out of the factory putting down 230+whp... he might have been lucky enough to get one of em.

[JDM Sam]

kinda... the dude IS a ricer and was running his mouth about his friends MSP... .
fixed.
the dude is a ricer for talking about a race he's not running. nice car keep up the modding.

[kamon8404]

Strange... most CAI/EXH LSJ's make upwards of 220-230whp... the 2.4L sport ION comes with the redline's appearance package... either that or the guy really couldn't drive... assuming you're not too modded that is.

I'm not to modded, SS AFC, 3" TBE, Aluminum piping (everything else doesn't add any hp). Stock:turbo, and intercooler. I will be destroying heads once i have all of the mods sitting in my closet installed. Lets go customs, daddy needs a fmic.

[starscream2k1]

OMFGWTFBBQ i'll beat all the cars out there with my friends ford tempo 2.4L OHV 3 gear in automagic w/ no torque converter.... ok maybe not, but still i wanna be a ricer too! :D

Nice car tho, i like it. However I think a real race is in the twisties! LOL

[sanblaster]

If they aren't on the track please remove the links.