cobb access port question

[sleeper3]

I've been trying to figure this out, but maybe one of you dudes will know... does the access port do perform logging functions like the dashhawk does? I know it can displace vehicle information while driving, but does it actually have the ability to log the information and then upload to a computer later with graphs and stuff?

[aaronc7]

I'm pretty sure it does not have data logging like the dashhawk..will only display realtime data while it's hooked up.

[sleeper3]

that is PURE poop.

[hilmar2k]

From Cobb's website:


» Not just an "ECU reflash" - AccessPORT features enhancements such as data monitors, reading DTCs, performance monitors and more.

[sleeper3]

monitors, not loggers. did you miss the part where I said that I had looked around to see if I could find out? I want to know if it has logging capability.

[Je5ter]

How about, where the hell is it?!?!?

[squabbin]

How about, where the hell is it?!?!?

Yeah I'm wondering the same thing...

[hilmar2k]

monitors, not loggers. did you miss the part where I said that I had looked around to see if I could find out? I want to know if it has logging capability.

I made the assumption that monitors=loggers. How else would one monitor?

[numbnuts22715]

I asked Josh about this. No it doesn't log, just display. The dashhawk can work alongside it though

[hilmar2k]

I asked Josh about this. No it doesn't log, just display. The dashhawk can work alongside it though

Guess my assumption was a bad one....as they tend to be.

[sleeper3]

I made the assumption that monitors=loggers. How else would one monitor?

by watching it as one is driving?

[sleeper3]

I asked Josh about this. No it doesn't log, just display. The dashhawk can work alongside it though

not along side it, unless you have one of those obdII splitters, I am guessing... that sucks, now I am going to have to buy a dashhawk AND an access port.

[Shane5425]

well, get the dash hawk, because i still dont see the AP out. ... they keep pushing it back..

[sleeper3]

yeah maybe I will get one with my bush money...

[AutoXRacer]

Keep waiting...

Everyone is putting the MS3 tuning solution on the back burner...
Superchips which has a similar product as the AP said they will work on the MS3 after they finish with the CX7 and the regular 3...

:wtf::bs:

[Erich]

Posted on the Cobb forum by a Cobb rep. this morning:

"There is no specific release date, but it should be shipping the end of this week or early next week."

[sleeper3]

Keep waiting...

Everyone is putting the MS3 tuning solution on the back burner...
Superchips which has a similar product as the AP said they will work on the MS3 after they finish with the CX7 and the regular 3...

:wtf::bs:

superchips are wayyyyyy cheaper too. plus they will probably log data. I had a superchip on my truck. it cost me like 350 I think.

[sleeper3]

Posted on the Cobb forum by a Cobb rep. this morning:

"There is no specific release date, but it should be shipping the end of this week or early next week."

they've been saying that same quote for how long?

[numbnuts22715]

not along side it, unless you have one of those obdII splitters, I am guessing... that sucks, now I am going to have to buy a dashhawk AND an access port.

How is that?

You don't have to leave the AP plugged in.
If you want to view it, why have both plugged in if theyre doing exactly the same thing?

What I meant by my statement was this,
If you want to have the accesport to flash your ecu, you can do that. After it's flashed, remove it. Plug in your dashhawk. View/log to your hearts content.

By the way, it was annoucned today by Josh and Billy Brooks, that they plan to ship the accessport at the end of this week or early next.

Also, about superchips.
How willt hey cater to people with mods? This is one quetion Ive never seen answered.

[Erich]

they've been saying that same quote for how long?

They have never said releasing this week or next, so I am cautiously optimistic. This has also been confirmed by Josh on the other forum BTW.

[numbnuts22715]

they've been saying that same quote for how long?

Since today.

It's never been this week or next. It's always been "hoppefully we'll ship it at the end of the month" or whatever like that.

[sleeper3]

How is that?

You don't have to leave the AP plugged in.
If you want to view it, why have both plugged in if theyre doing exactly the same thing?

What I meant by my statement was this,
If you want to have the accesport to flash your ecu, you can do that. After it's flashed, remove it. Plug in your dashhawk. View/log to your hearts content.

By the way, it was annoucned today by Josh and Billy Brooks, that they plan to ship the accessport at the end of this week or early next.

Also, about superchips.
How willt hey cater to people with mods? This is one quetion Ive never seen answered.


my mistake, I thought that when you said "side by side" you meant "side by side," when clearly you meant something else?

cobb has been announcing when they were going to ship their AP for quite some time now. I believe it when I see it.

I'm pretty sure you can tune with a superchip. if you can tune, who cares if they're catering to people with mods.

[sleeper3]

They have never said releasing this week or next, so I am cautiously optimistic. This has also been confirmed by Josh on the other forum BTW.

we'll see.

[sleeper3]

Since today.

It's never been this week or next. It's always been "hoppefully we'll ship it at the end of the month" or whatever like that.

so you think that because their guesses as to when it will be released have moved to the not so distant future that they're more accurate?

I'll believe it when I see it.

[numbnuts22715]

I actually do.
When you plan something farther in advance there's more of a chance that something will go wrong. The beta testing has gone quite well, so there's no reason for it not to come out.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this.

[sleeper3]

there is no disagreement, I'm just saying that I will believe their little reflash is out when I see people making threads with pictures of it in their hands. then after people have it for a while, and love it, I'll buy one!

[SharkDiver]

Josh from cobb also said they will release some dyno #s in the next day or 2..

[MS3077]

Josh from cobb also said they will release some dyno #s in the next day or 2..

HA-ha, love your avator!

[SharkDiver]

HA-ha, love your avator!

:)

[JoseloSpeed3]

Sweet I'm excited about this cobb app...... how much is it thought?

[Shane5425]

695.. i think..

[4thStroke]

Shane is right, $695. I think I saw one place who had it listed for $690 when I was looking for my Subie, they might get you on shipping, though.

[numbnuts22715]

695.

[sleeper3]

10 hp? that's $70 per hp until they release the tuning solution.

freaking lol. I'd rather have the standback or the xede.

[chacon101]

I would rather get the TMIC for the money. Eh.

It's still too early to tell of course. I thought they were going to fix the throttle plate issue.

[Super Unique]

I just feel I have to say this. What is the basis for the $695 these guys are charging for this stuff? I understand their need to be in business and make a profit, but there comes a point with an ecu reprogramming where it crosses the line between reasonable tweak into major investment, when it doesn't have to be that much money. There is a lot of competition in the ECU programming market and this simply isn't competitive with other vendors.

No matter who makes the maps or what stages they are, how nice they play with the rest of your bolt ons etc... it's still playing with fire in the long run.

[sleeper3]

the throttle plate "issue" might be there as a safety matter. everyone knows that our DI fuel pumps sometimes have trouble keeping up... at extremely high rpms, maybe they are closing the throttle plate slightly to prevent the mixture from leaning out too much and damaging the engine. MAYBE. maybe they just don't want us to have any fun.

anyway, that's gay. I was expecting to see more like 20-30 hp and tq extra from the AP.

[sleeper3]

I just feel I have to say this. What is the basis for the $695 these guys are charging for this stuff? I understand their need to be in business and make a profit, but there comes a point with an ecu reprogramming where it crosses the line between reasonable tweak into major investment, when it doesn't have to be that much money. There is a lot of competition in the ECU programming market and this simply isn't competitive with other vendors.

No matter who makes the maps or what stages they are, how nice they play with the rest of your bolt ons etc... it's still playing with fire in the long run.

I heard rumors that superchips might be working on our car. if they come out with something, I'll definitely be interested in it. they've been reflashing cars for YEARS and their stuff is way cheaper.

[sleeper3]

http://www.webridestv.com/showvideo.aspx?video=46118

interestinggggg

[Super Unique]

superchips is only a few miles from my house. They wrote me an email keeping my car in mind when they need a stocker to test on, supposed to get in touch with me when they get to our cars.

[sleeper3]

OH GOD PLEASE LET THEM GET TO OUR CARS


and in that video, that guy is full of crap. the difference in power potential between gas and diesel motors is mostly due to the fact that they can crank the turbo in the diesel so far up it's obscene. they run like 12:1 compression and 30 lbs of boost. we can't do that. but on a turbo car, we have a lot of potential too. on the stock system I don't see why we can't expect around 30 hp with the right setup. 30 safe hp.

[dkswim]

that small HP gain is on an awd mustang dyno @ 4,000 feet so it should come up if they were to come down to see level and dyno on a dynojet. the gains they claim are also more meaty then most others out there. cobb is claiming a economy increse which should be nice as well and i get to run the 93 which might add a little more power.

[AutoXRacer]

Cobb doesn't have any competition right now...so they are free to charge whatever they want and people will buy it since there is no other option; regarding reflashes that is...

Superchips will be working on our cars, but I wouldn't hold my breathe for it...they said they are currently working on the CX7 then the Mazda3 before they get to our MS3s.... (lame)

Anyway, I'm waiting to see real world results on this AP...it's been hyped up waaaaaaay too much...

[sleeper3]

that small HP gain is on an awd mustang dyno @ 4,000 feet so it should come up if they were to come down to see level and dyno on a dynojet. the gains they claim are also more meaty then most others out there. cobb is claiming a economy increse which should be nice as well and i get to run the 93 which might add a little more power.

dynojets register (on average) about 30% higher than mustang dynos. so we get 13 hp on a dynojet. neat.

[sleeper3]

Cobb doesn't have any competition right now...so they are free to charge whatever they want and people will buy it since there is no other option; regarding reflashes that is...

Superchips will be working on our cars, but I wouldn't hold my breathe for it...they said they are currently working on the CX7 then the Mazda3 before they get to our MS3s.... (lame)

Anyway, I'm waiting to see real world results on this AP...it's been hyped up waaaaaaay too much...

I am anxious too.

superchips might be a very valid alternative. like I said, they've been making reflashes for years and have them for MANY different models. as long as it offers a tuning option, I will be getting a superchip.

[Shane5425]

Well, cobb has released stage 1 initial results.. remember they are 6000 feet above sea level and will be dynoing again in San Diego.
Without further delay here are INITIAL dyno graphs. I have to add the disclaimer that these may not be final. Our tuners are working to get more power from Stage 2. Also, these results are from our dyno which reads lower than most and is also handicapped by altitude. The turbo on the MS3 is not large, so it falls off on the top end, and that is even worse at altitude. Keep in mind the entire power band, not just the peaks.

Here are the notes from our head tuner:

“This dyno graph has been generated on our AWD Chassis dyno while running the car in AWD mode. We must do this so the traction control system does not take over and re-tune the car. We have spent extensive time trying to smooth out the throttle control, boost control, and torque control systems so this car is more enjoyable to drive. This makes the car easier to drive at part throttle conditions, allows for much smoother part throttle control, and the vehicle acts less like an on/off switch. By doing this we have significantly increased the gas mileage of the vehicle as well with our Stage1 and Stage2 calibrations.

The peak power numbers for these graphs are as follows:
Stock = 247 ft. lb. TQ / 212 WHP
Stage1 + SF = 267 ft. lb. TQ / 222 WHP (20 WTQ, +10WHP)
Stage2 + SF Intake = 279 ft. lb. TQ / 232 WHP” (32WTQ, +20 WHP)

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d32/iwannaratrod/InitialMS3Results.jpg

[Shane5425]

all the TRq comes in 500 rpms earlier and 20+ more of it.. amazing.. they will release more dynos at sea level next week.

This is exactly what josh said "Everyone, keep in mind that as I said, these are INITIAL RESULTS. Things may change within the next week before release. You wanted what we have at the moment, so there you have it. Results may stay the same, or they may get better. But we are limited by physics (turbo running out) and what we feel is reliable. We have NEVER won the power battle, but we have ALWAYS won the battle of the most cars still on the road. :D"

its getting close !!!!

[sleeper3]

another battle that they win is most expensive equipment.

I'm just saying that $700 for 10 hp and 20 tq is gay. I can bump psi by 1 and get almost the same thing. with a reflash, psi should be 3 pounds more and the mixture should be leaned a bit. we should see a 30-40 hp increase, not 10.

[numbnuts22715]

Cobb isnt about peak power. Can you boost xontroller make around 50 more wheel torque 500 rpms sooner?!?
I'm happy with the results

[sleeper3]

Cobb isnt about peak power. Can you boost xontroller make around 50 more wheel torque 500 rpms sooner?!?
I'm happy with the results

I don't think my revs dip below 3500 on the track... who cares.

I'm guessing at that number, but seriously, I don't need 50 extra ft lbs at 2500 rpm. I would take 50 accross the whole rpm band though.

[sleeper3]

I wish everyone wasn't in line to bend over for this thing. I want to hear honest reports of what it does for people's cars after they're on. I don't think I am going to see that here.

[frito]

Keep in mind that the AP is just a tool. I have one on my Subaru now. It also comes with maps that are safe and better performing than stock. Additionally, tuners will be able to tune your car on a dyno and make a map for you that the AP can use. I am not sure what the initial one will have but they are always upgrading the ROM and adding features for the Subaru one that I have. I really like mine and will buy it for my MS3. Stage1 on my Subaru was modest in power gains but very a large improvement. There words about drivability etc are not just a cop out.

[Je5ter]

So their Short ram intake actually gives more HP (11 as they claim) than this...... Weak sauce.

[Shane5425]

I will be getting it, not when it comes out though, i want to see it dynoed by some users at sea level and over multiple cars..

[Shane5425]

i think it will also be a better tool once we can make our own maps..

[Aaron@JSC]

Keep in mind that the AP is just a tool. I have one on my Subaru now. It also comes with maps that are safe and better performing than stock. Additionally, tuners will be able to tune your car on a dyno and make a map for you that the AP can use. I am not sure what the initial one will have but they are always upgrading the ROM and adding features for the Subaru one that I have. I really like mine and will buy it for my MS3. Stage1 on my Subaru was modest in power gains but very a large improvement. There words about drivability etc are not just a cop out.

+1 the accessport is meant to be a tuning tool that has the ability to 'grow' as you mod your car and is completely custom tunable. It is essentially a complete engine management system. Find me another engine managment system on the market for $695

if you are planning on purchasing an accessport and flashing your stock car once, i agree the price isnt worth it. If you are planning on doing an I/E/H, FMIC, Garrett Turbo, Meth/Water injection etc... $695 is a good deal for a complete tuning tool.

Keep in mind that the people with Subarus commonly see 15-20 more whp and torque when they get custom tuned as opposed to tuned with Cobb's off the shelf map with the same modifications. Cobb has to build the re-flash maps with a little leeway to make sure its safe on all MS3s

[Shane5425]

+1 the accessport is meant to be a tuning tool that has the ability to 'grow' as you mod your car and is completely custom tunable. It is essentially a complete engine management system. Find me another engine managment system on the market for $695

if you are planning on purchasing an accessport and flashing your stock car once, i agree the price isnt worth it. If you are planning on doing an I/E/H, FMIC, Garrett Turbo, Meth/Water injection etc... $695 is a good deal for a complete tuning tool.

Keep in mind that the people with Subarus commonly see 15-20 more whp and torque when they get custom tuned as opposed to tuned with Cobb's off the shelf map with the same modifications. Cobb has to build the re-flash maps with a little leeway to make sure its safe on all MS3s
agreed but we can't custom tune till later this year..

[AutoXRacer]

I really like the part about:



"this makes the car easier to drive at part throttle conditions, allows for much smoother part throttle control, and the vehicle acts less like an on/off switch."

I find it hard to part throttle this car at autocross events...

[Aaron@JSC]

agreed but we can't custom tune till later this year..

a very good point-- something to consider before pulling the trigger for sure.

[numbnuts22715]

I'll give an honest review when I get it, trust me. I just don't see why everyone keeps knocking on Cobb ive seen what the ap can do for other cars. Its an extremely nice tool and even if gains arent great it'll be even more worth it when the tuning software comes out. I don't like piggy backs I just don't think theyrr right judging by how badly theyve worked on a few friends cars. Thats my personal opinion though

[sleeper3]

695 would be a great price for a complete tuning tool. unfortunately, they're going to want like $400 more for the software when they release it a year from now.

I have lots of other stuff I'd like to spend $1100 on.

[clos561]

I wish everyone wasn't in line to bend over for this thing. I want to hear honest reports of what it does for people's cars after they're on. I don't think I am going to see that here.

+1 all i been hearing is cobb this for SO fucking long and the thing comes out and u get 20whp.....i want to see results from people who buy it

[wisniaPl]

695 would be a great price for a complete tuning tool. unfortunately, they're going to want like $400 more for the software when they release it a year from now.

I have lots of other stuff I'd like to spend $1100 on.

400 more for what??

[xandrake]

400 more for what??

a dashhawk for datalogging

[xandrake]

gah, or software....why the fuck doesn't the edit button work on these forums anymore?

[sleeper3]

oh yeah you need the dashhawk also for datalogging. so lets make it $1350 for the complete setup. That is stupid.

[SwampAss]

I've been trying to give companies $1100 for a PNP/no cut tuning solution since this time last year. No one wants it!

[sleeper3]

if the access port came tunable with computer software and some basic maps as well as the ability to log runs, I would be ALL over it.


SA AP for me. gotta improve that 60' time.

[Shane5425]

i mean, sleeper3, if you can pull a 13.5 with out it, i thnk you could easilly get low 13s with ap, with the added torque lower, if you get traction ... but i do agree, they need the software to do custom tunes out alot sooner.

[wisniaPl]

you can just run with ap....they gona buy couple maps...

[sleeper3]

uh, as I said before, low end torque isn't going to help me a WHOLE lot at the track. maybe a tiny bit with the launch, but I have trouble not spinning all day as she sits. I definitely don't see a $700 benifit with this thing.

[Conso]

i ordered xede last night, i think this is a better tunning solution, cost a lil more but i think in the long run the results ill get will more then make up for the xtra cash

[AutoXRacer]

i ordered xede last night, i think this is a better tunning solution, cost a lil more but i think in the long run the results ill get will more then make up for the xtra cash

I was gunho about the Exede when I first got my MS3... But after being on the forums a while, I don't know if thats the best solution...

How does Xede affect things like Dashhawk...?
If you set the boost to 18PSI using Xede, will the Dashhawk relfect the change? How do you keep tabs on what your engine is doing?

I want to find a way to increase boost with out using a mechanic device; eg MBC...

Post a new thread on how the Xede is working out for you. Have you ever done tuning before? I wonder how hard the learning curve is for fist timers. Did you get a PnP or hard wire?

[Conso]

just ordered fella lol prolly be here in the next 2 weeks, and yes i did get the plug and play harness, ill start a new thread w/ install pics and stuff when me and liquid_ag put it on along w/ a video of start up and all that good stuff, and this will be my first car w/ em so we will c wat we end up w/ (yippy)

[sleeper3]

the dashhawk shows what the ECU sees. since the xcede is intercepting signals from EVERYTHING, the dashhawk is useless. you'd need a wideband O2 sensor for certain just to make sure that you're not leaning it out too much.

[AutoXRacer]

just ordered fella lol prolly be here in the next 2 weeks, and yes i did get the plug and play harness, ill start a new thread w/ install pics and stuff when me and liquid_ag put it on along w/ a video of start up and all that good stuff, and this will be my first car w/ em so we will c wat we end up w/ (yippy)

You got PnP!!!??? (huh)

[AutoXRacer]

the dashhawk shows what the ECU sees. since the xcede is intercepting signals from EVERYTHING, the dashhawk is useless. you'd need a wideband O2 sensor for certain just to make sure that you're not leaning it out too much.

(bang) that was what I was afraid of... (sad2)

[sleeper3]

I thought they xceed was plug and play naturally. why do you need the extra harness?

[AutoXRacer]

I thought they xceed was plug and play naturally. why do you need the extra harness?

No, BEGi only had half of the harness...they still needed the Mazda side of the harnesses... I didn't know they finally released the PnP capability...

Here is a quote from BEGi's website:

**Right now, the plug 'n play harness is not available for the MS3. We are have some connectors custom molded. 2/26/8 **

[sleeper3]

well PG has their harness coupler that you can use so that you don't have to splice into the factory wires.

[Yoo Shin]

I'm also a Subaru guy that's really considering the leap to a MS3.

I have the Cobb AP for my 06 WRX and while it's dyno didn't look very impressive, it's the curve that really needs to be looked at. For example the torque shifted from 230lbs @ 4200 down to 271lbs at 2900 rpms.

On my WRX the gains were modest when comparing before and after numbers but the translation to the drag strip is were it was apparent. A stock 06 WRX would run 5.4 0-60s with 14sec qtr at 95 where a Cobb Stage II runs 4.8 0-60s and low 13s in the qtr.

Plus there are ton of tuners experience with the Cobb software and products, and will be very familure with the MS3's AP. Some tuners will even offer "mail order" tunes with feadback from data logs, like PDX Tunning so you wouldn't even have to leave your house to get a tune.

[numbnuts22715]

well PG has their harness coupler that you can use so that you don't have to splice into the factory wires.

450 dollars later....

[numbnuts22715]

I'm also a Subaru guy that's really considering the leap to a MS3.

I have the Cobb AP for my 06 WRX and while it's dyno didn't look very impressive, it's the curve that really needs to be looked at. For example the torque shifted from 230lbs @ 4200 down to 271lbs at 2900 rpms.

On my WRX the gains were modest when comparing before and after numbers but the translation to the drag strip is were it was apparent. A stock 06 WRX would run 5.4 0-60s with 14sec qtr at 95 where a Cobb Stage II runs 4.8 0-60s and low 13s in the qtr.

Plus there are ton of tuners experience with the Cobb software and products, and will be very familure with the MS3's AP. Some tuners will even offer "mail order" tunes with feadback from data logs, like PDX Tunning so you wouldn't even have to leave your house to get a tune.

This is exactly how I feel about this all. Peak numbers mean nothing. Our car's are not dyno queens. Thank you for expressing it in a well worded manner.

[sleeper3]

I'm also a Subaru guy that's really considering the leap to a MS3.

I have the Cobb AP for my 06 WRX and while it's dyno didn't look very impressive, it's the curve that really needs to be looked at. For example the torque shifted from 230lbs @ 4200 down to 271lbs at 2900 rpms.

On my WRX the gains were modest when comparing before and after numbers but the translation to the drag strip is were it was apparent. A stock 06 WRX would run 5.4 0-60s with 14sec qtr at 95 where a Cobb Stage II runs 4.8 0-60s and low 13s in the qtr.

Plus there are ton of tuners experience with the Cobb software and products, and will be very familure with the MS3's AP. Some tuners will even offer "mail order" tunes with feadback from data logs, like PDX Tunning so you wouldn't even have to leave your house to get a tune.

$450ish for the personal tuning software from cobb, plus it won't be available for a year. making the total investment 1100 or more and a years time with the crappy base tune... I mean how many people have all cobb stuff on their cars?

[numbnuts22715]

I dont understand why everybody thinks that it's crappy just because the peak gains are not huge.
To my knowledge, no pricing has been announced for the street tuner software.
The intake is the only thing that matters, and to be honest, it's probably one of the most widely used ones, if not, the most used.
Exhaust doesnt matter, I really don't think a good fmic will matter either.

[sleeper3]

maybe if they get the tuning software out quickly, it will be a good thing. as long as price isn't too much. Id on't remember where I read that price, but I remember seeing it.

[MS3077]

I'm also a Subaru guy that's really considering the leap to a MS3.

I have the Cobb AP for my 06 WRX and while it's dyno didn't look very impressive, it's the curve that really needs to be looked at. For example the torque shifted from 230lbs @ 4200 down to 271lbs at 2900 rpms.

On my WRX the gains were modest when comparing before and after numbers but the translation to the drag strip is were it was apparent. A stock 06 WRX would run 5.4 0-60s with 14sec qtr at 95 where a Cobb Stage II runs 4.8 0-60s and low 13s in the qtr.

Plus there are ton of tuners experience with the Cobb software and products, and will be very familure with the MS3's AP. Some tuners will even offer "mail order" tunes with feadback from data logs, like PDX Tunning so you wouldn't even have to leave your house to get a tune.

I don't think a stock 06 wrx runs 14 flat in the 1/4. I thought they ran somewhere around 14.2-14.5. Can you post an article or something showing a 06 wrx running 14.0 in the 1/4? You might be right just never heard of it.

[Yoo Shin]

$450ish for the personal tuning software from cobb, plus it won't be available for a year. making the total investment 1100 or more and a years time with the crappy base tune... I mean how many people have all cobb stuff on their cars?

I understand the price point of veiw and a lot of my Evo friends feel the same. What's also nice about the Cobb software and Accessport (aka AP) is that it'll resale for a good bit of it's original price. Back when I got my AP for my WRX, even used APs were going for $500+. At least you can have some value back if you got rid of the car plus unloading (unmarrying) maps is a cinch.


I dont understand why everybody thinks that it's crappy just because the peak gains are not huge.
To my knowledge, no pricing has been announced for the street tuner software.
The intake is the only thing that matters, and to be honest, it's probably one of the most widely used ones, if not, the most used.
Exhaust doesnt matter, I really don't think a good fmic will matter either.

I've talked to quite a few tuners about the Subaru and Evo and they all pretty much agree that the first areas that often need to be addressed is the flow from the downpipe. Intakes, and CBE have marginal affect(effects?) compared to the effeciencies gained from a larger free flowing downpipe. FMICs and Intakes are often benificial only to larger turbos and custom tunes. Plus most get them because they look cool.


maybe if they get the tuning software out quickly, it will be a good thing. as long as price isn't too much. Id on't remember where I read that price, but I remember seeing it.

It'd be a solid guess it'd be the same price as the Subaru software.

Patience, this stuff will be out before you know it. Cobb puts together good stuff. They're a relatively small outfit and very anal about how their stuff works. Reliability is their # priority.


I don't think a stock 06 wrx runs 14 flat in the 1/4. I thought they ran somewhere around 14.2-14.5. Can you post an article or something showing a 06 wrx running 14.0 in the 1/4? You might be right just never heard of it.

Some off of NUTSAC ran 14.1-14.2 stock but you're right it's typically mid 14s. I should have been more specific.

I do have to say that you MS3 guys got some really cool cars and again, I might be jumping the Subaru ship here soon along with a few of my other Subaru buddies, for the MS3.

EDIT: MS3077, how do you like you shifter bushings and shifter? Does it really help the feel of the gates?

[MS3077]

Yoo Shin - The TWM SS & Bushings make a huge improvement over the stock shifter. The Short throw shifter shortens the throws 30% and the bushings make transition into gears much more precise and direct. I would higly recommend! $263.00 for the TWM SS & Bushings shipped from SU and the install is pretty easy.

[wisniaPl]

$450ish for the personal tuning software from cobb, plus it won't be available for a year. making the total investment 1100 or more and a years time with the crappy base tune... I mean how many people have all cobb stuff on their cars?

they will release couple maps
personally I will buy ap and wait for new maps with diff stage, by the way they are for free (right??)...Im not loooking into 100hp gains with only tune

[enganear]

I have the Cobb AP for my 06 WRX and while it's dyno didn't look very impressive, it's the curve that really needs to be looked at. For example the torque shifted from 230lbs @ 4200 down to 271lbs at 2900 rpms.

On my WRX the gains were modest when comparing before and after numbers but the translation to the drag strip is were it was apparent. A stock 06 WRX would run 5.4 0-60s with 14sec qtr at 95 where a Cobb Stage II runs 4.8 0-60s and low 13s in the qtr.


Trap speed is proportional to area under the torque curve. Peak horsepower is just not that meaningful in the real world.
-enganear

[numbnuts22715]

I've talked to quite a few tuners about the Subaru and Evo and they all pretty much agree that the first areas that often need to be addressed is the flow from the downpipe. Intakes, and CBE have marginal affect(effects?) compared to the effeciencies gained from a larger free flowing downpipe. FMICs and Intakes are often benificial only to larger turbos and custom tunes. Plus most get them because they look cool.



I wasnt saying that exhausts and fmics wont help our car. I was saying that for Cobb's flashes, for the accessport, you can have a different brand turboback and most likely a differnet brand fmic as long as its not junk, and you'd be okay with their basemaps...

[sleeper3]

I wasnt saying that exhausts and fmics wont help our car. I was saying that for Cobb's flashes, for the accessport, you can have a different brand turboback and most likely a differnet brand fmic as long as its not junk, and you'd be okay with their basemaps...

I had to read it twice before I figured out that's what you were saying too.

[yager]

I have to say I am completely dissapointed by the numbers, But I still must purchase the AP, I know from expierence that the pro-tune will make it worth while.

[Absent-Minded]

The argument of price on the AP and software is kind of ridiculous, IMHO. It's not overpriced, it's market priced. There are numerous other companies (auto or other) that could be complained to for definitively overpricing their products. In this case, start with automobile manufacturers.

If you're an appearance-modder, you'll likely spend at least three times the cost of the AP and software on crap (read: stuff) that does nothing more than "look" good. If you're performance oriented, than you should already know that power and handling comes with a price. And a lot of times an unusually high price for what you actually gain.

Will I get the AP? Most likely yes, though once it has been out there and some have had time to play with it. Will I get the software? Probably not, but that may change depending on what I choose to do.

Just my thoughts on it.

[AutoXRacer]

I have to say I am completely dissapointed by the numbers, But I still must purchase the AP, I know from expierence that the pro-tune will make it worth while.

Just wait a little longer... Superchips will be coming out with an AP twin...along with CP-E working on a flash and a few other options with other vendors...

Don't get all caught up on the "Cobb" band-wagon, they might be great on Subbies, but no one knows what the outcome with Mazdas will be...

Just let the tuning wars simmer...

[sleeper3]

all I am saying price wise is that $700 would be better spent on an intake, valve, and midpipe. you'd pick up way more than 10 hp.

[sleeper3]

Just wait a little longer... Superchips will be coming out with an AP twin...along with CP-E working on a flash and a few other options with other vendors...

Don't get all caught up on the "Cobb" band-wagon, they might be great on Subbies, but no one knows what the outcome with Mazdas will be...

Just let the tuning wars simmer...

(mswerd)

[DAC17]

I've had Cobb maps for other Subie's, and they're a very good balance of increased power and engine life. As I understand, only a 91 octane map is coming out at first. Once you get comfortable with that increase, they'll bring out the 93 octane maps (those should be free to the AP owners).

I'll be getting mine.

[yager]

They start shipping the week of 5/12

-THATS MONDAY-

[numbnuts22715]

They start shipping the week of 5/12

-THATS MONDAY-

that doesnt exactly mean that it'll ship monday though, just sometime next week.
I sure hope it's monday though

[wisniaPl]

waiting for cobb ap reviews guys ;)

[sleeper3]

hahaha wasn't it supposed to definitely be last week? this is hilarious.

[numbnuts22715]

hahaha wasn't it supposed to definitely be last week? this is hilarious.

according to street unit it was supposed to be 4/14. cobb has never really said anything.

[Shane5425]

they will have a new mazdaspeed line out before this is released..

[mazpro]

lol, that's what it looks ike...

[SwampAss]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dy72lpZWtzo

(pow)

[Erich]

hahaha wasn't it supposed to definitely be last week? this is hilarious.

No, at the beginning of last week they said this week or next. Now a bunch of the vendors are also saying this week, so it looks like Cobb is holding to what they said at the beginning of last week.

[sleeper3]

stop defending them dude come on. no, you neva gonna get it. not this time.

[dkswim]

yeah we have the cobb haters over here.

[sleeper3]

more like realists. how can I hate on something that isn't even out yet? oh yeah they released their dyno graphs and it was equivalent power to a cold air intake.

[wisniaPl]

do ap will eleminate cel caused by catless downpipe??

[aaronc7]

yep

[aaronc7]

For those that dont check out the other forums out there...

Stage 2 vs stock

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee51/PDXImportRacer/stage2_vs_stock.jpg

stock vs stage 2, but a custom tuned map, not the "off the shelf map"

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee51/PDXImportRacer/sterling_vs_stock_dyno.jpg

not as impressive as the swampass AP...but pretty serious nonetheless for a mustang dyno :). I think they are @ sea level.

[Shane5425]

nice, but nothing will beat swampass... he has released his...

[boost_me]

sweeet..

[sleeper3]

it doesn't matter if you look at a mustang dyno or a dynojet dyno when you're looking at the DIFFERENCE in horsepower.

those are much nicer numbers though. what do you have to have for stage 2?

[aaronc7]

turboback (or just downpipe and stock CBE). And intake if you want

[john blutarski]

impressive! 315 tq on a Mustang at just stage 2

[sleeper3]

25 hp and 40 tq should be gains from stage 1. stage 2 should be even higher in my opinion. whatev though at least you have the potential to tune.

[sleeper3]

the strange thing is that this car only saw +10hp and +1 tq with a tune. weird.

[john blutarski]

25 hp and 40 tq should be gains from stage 1. stage 2 should be even higher in my opinion. whatev though at least you have the potential to tune.

I hear you man but a lot of people are looking for more than just big numbers but making power safely and smoothly and increasing area under the curve. When I had a WRX, it was not safe at all to slap parts on it (04+) until you had an AP or some sort of professional tune. The difference I felt from even stage 1 to stage 2 with Cobb AP was night and day. I know its a different car but ECU logging has proven time and again that they were making safe HP with their maps. They know they're tuning. I then was protuned by an AP tuner in my area and he was able to get another 15-20 HP/TQ out of the same mods.

[john blutarski]

the strange thing is that this car only saw +10hp and +1 tq with a tune. weird.

Its possible the tuner is not too familiar with this ECU yet and is still learning.

[sleeper3]

I guess... I'm just whining because the thing is $700.

[lamp3]

are the stage 2 maps going to be available right off the bat?

[aaronc7]

available at launch:

stage 1 (stock)
stage 1 + intake
stage 2
stage 2 + intake

and economy, valet, and anti theft mode...all maps all for 91 octane. 93 maps will be out sometime soon after

[sleeper3]

stage 2 means that you need turbo back though, right?

[aaronc7]

or just downpipe (CPE DP or CS/TXS DP and race pipe). They said catback isnt restrictive really, so you can run stage 2 with it no problems, you mihgt lose 2 hp or something.

[lamp3]

SWEET!! Just got off the phone with SU. Made payment for my Ap pre-order. they said it should ship out to me tomarrow!! Now I need to order a down pipe. any suggestions? Should I keep a cat?

[Shane5425]

right.. beleive that if you want.. i dont take anything SU has said in stone.. you will get it in prolly a month..

[aaronc7]

lamp3,

They said tomorrow for sure? I talked to them yesterday and they didnt have an exact date yet...can't wait! I'm going to drive to orlando to pick mine up...can't wait another day! lol

[yager]

Just got off the phone with Chris at SU, they do not have the APs in stock, he said they are still waiting for them from COBB.........STILL ORDERED MINE CAN'T WAIT!

[sleeper3]

lol @ shipping tomorrow. they've been saying a month for 6 months, a week for 6 weeks, and tomorrow all week. we'll see when it happens.

[lamp3]

hmm.... I talked to mark. He said tomarrow it would ship. Maybe thats when their shipment is coming......hmm.... either way, its happenin this week. They're in the mail from cobb. Gotta get a downpipe, goin straight to stage 2. I'm all giddy reminds me of when I first took my STi to stage 2. Its time to unleash the beast!!! lol.

[sleeper3]

I need bigger tires.

[lamp3]

Will have those on the way tomarrow my friend. 225-45 falken azenis rt615's. And wheels yet to be decided. I'm diggin this being divorced thing......no one to tell me I cant have my toys!!! Ya! long live the single life!!

[Shane5425]

Is SU the only place that you can order Cobb ap from or can Ken get it?

[sleeper3]

I think Street Unit is the only place doing a preorder.


a dude at work is about to put 245s on his speed3. I can't wait to see how much it rubs. if it's not much, I think I am going to do that too!

[aaronc7]

lol @ shipping tomorrow. they've been saying a month for 6 months, a week for 6 weeks, and tomorrow all week. we'll see when it happens.

http://www.cobbtuning.com/categories/?id=3112

http://www.accessecu.com/accessport/mazda/07-08MS3Maps.html

[Erich]

I think Street Unit is the only place doing a preorder.


a dude at work is about to put 245s on his speed3. I can't wait to see how much it rubs. if it's not much, I think I am going to do that too!

There are several places doing pre-orders. A couple of them (not SU) are doing pre-orders with free overnight shipping.

[BluMicaR]

Is SU the only place that you can order Cobb ap from or can Ken get it?

I tried posting in the PG thread but nobody's listening...

Gawd, now it's out, but the notes say:
"YOU MUST USE THE COBB SF INTAKE SYSTEM ONLY. NO OTHER AFTERMARKET INTAKES ARE CERTIFIED COMPATIBLE WITH THIS CALIBRATION. THE INSTALLATION OF ANY OTHER HARDWARE SUCH AS AN EXHAUST MANIFOLD OR CATLESS EXHAUST MAY ALLOW THE VEHICLE TO RUN LEANER THAN DESIRED, WHICH CAN CAUSE ENGINE DAMAGE."

Curses and drat!!(rant)

[dkswim]

dude they had to just add that beacuse i was looking at theat 1 hour ago

[aaronc7]

It "may" cause damage. Then again, our ECU is really adaptive and it may run fine and generate lots of power. They just haven't tested it with a catless exhaust or with an exhaust manifold. There's an MS6 guy running GT35 turbo with stock ECU! (wow)

[squabbin]

http://www.cobbtuning.com/categories/?id=3112

http://www.accessecu.com/accessport/mazda/07-08MS3Maps.html

How soon you think before they release some 93octane maps? I'm going Stage 1+Intake and i live in jersey where 93 is readily available. If subaru's can get 93 tunes than so should we ;) Hopefully they get on releasing the 93 maps soon!

[numbnuts22715]

How soon you think before they release some 93octane maps? I'm going Stage 1+Intake and i live in jersey where 93 is readily available. If subaru's can get 93 tunes than so should we ;) Hopefully they get on releasing the 93 maps soon!


In case nobody has seen yet, you can now order it from cobbtuning.com.

[aaronc7]

Not sure how long...they just needed to finalize some testing on it I think. It's not like they havent even started testing iwth 93 or anything.

[squabbin]

The sooner the better!

[dkswim]

i think i remember seeing that there wasnt any real gains for 93 over 91 with our car to make it worthwhile at least that was my take on it.

[squabbin]

i think i remember seeing that there wasnt any real gains for 93 over 91 with our car to make it worthwhile at least that was my take on it.

Yeah I just got off the phone with Chris over at Cobb and asked him about the 93' maps and if they are going to be made available. From what he said it looks like the turbo is pretty much maxed out with the 91 map and he said after the initial release that they will be looking into possibly making some minor timing tweaks with the 93 octane and may or may not release those maps depending on if those tweaks actually net any improvments.

[SHAGwagn]

whats mid grade? 89 octance? That would be great if its was 91 cuz then we could start buying cheaper gas which we all know is gettin crazy! Something tells me its 89 though...havnt used it in a couple years so i stopped paying attention.

[squabbin]

whats mid grade? 89 octance? That would be great if its was 91 cuz then we could start buying cheaper gas which we all know is gettin crazy! Something tells me its 89 though...havnt used it in a couple years so i stopped paying attention.

Umm Mid-Grade is 89 which is fine to use if u dont mind ruining your motor. These cars are designed to run on nothing lower than 91, theres actually a thread around here somewhere about a guy who bought his MS3 from the dealer and they had apparently accidently put regular in it. It spend the next week or so getting fixed from all the dmg it had caused.

[SHAGwagn]

Umm Mid-Grade is 89 which is fine to use if u dont mind ruining your motor. These cars are designed to run on nothing lower than 91, theres actually a thread around here somewhere about a guy who bought his MS3 from the dealer and they had apparently accidently put regular in it. It spend the next week or so getting fixed from all the dmg it had caused.

I was asking cuz i wasnt sure what mid grade was being that we down here in south florida have 93 for supreme and it would be nice to get a break on fuel. In no circumstance is the 89 usable on this car being the manual says so and that its a turbo charged vehicle. The only damage that will be caused from the regular gas is detonation to the pistons/rods which of course only happens if you drive it hard and push the turbo into boost. You can run a full tank of regular gas with no problems as long as you stay out of boost. Thats why the kids car got jacked up, not becuse there was regular gas runnin through the thing.

[BluMicaR]

It "may" cause damage. Then again, our ECU is really adaptive and it may run fine and generate lots of power. They just haven't tested it with a catless exhaust or with an exhaust manifold. There's an MS6 guy running GT35 turbo with stock ECU! (wow)

Yeah but be that as it may I still want to maintain the appearance in any shallow gesture of trying to maintain some level of warrantiness. Especially how I like to get on it in my car, last thing I need is to boom my engine. It's my DD. Soon I think I'm going to look at fricking motor scooters though, stupid gas.

[AGM130]

They need a 98 octane map, thats Super Plus here in Germany.

[Shane5425]

HA, thats pretty much racing fuel over here... not a chance they will make a map for that..

[aaronc7]

I thought the octane rating method/procedure was different?

[sleeper3]

I was asking cuz i wasnt sure what mid grade was being that we down here in south florida have 93 for supreme and it would be nice to get a break on fuel. In no circumstance is the 89 usable on this car being the manual says so and that its a turbo charged vehicle. The only damage that will be caused from the regular gas is detonation to the pistons/rods which of course only happens if you drive it hard and push the turbo into boost. You can run a full tank of regular gas with no problems as long as you stay out of boost. Thats why the kids car got jacked up, not becuse there was regular gas runnin through the thing.

mid is what, 20 cents cheaper per gallon? do you want to risk it to save $3 on a fill up that costs over $50? not worth it if you ask me.

[AGM130]

I thought the octane rating method/procedure was different?

Ah your right Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating) explained it. So I guess its about the same as 93-94 in the states.
I have seen some 100 though, at stations on the autobahn, so thats like 95-96 in the states.

[sleeper3]

we have 100 octane fuel at BP stations or something here... and 100 lowlead at the airport if you want to go nuts. or 110 at the drag strip but it's got to be close to $10 a gallon by now.

[dkswim]

100LL is funny beacuse it contains more lead then the 70s leded gas. stupid LL but hay its officialy been released

[dkswim]

repost stupid me. but hay its been relesed for all those naysayers.

[MS3077]

haha you posted the same thing twice

[Munnugles]

ok trying to figure out something... i was reading through the map notes... but still curious... i have ms cai, hks bov in vta, and ets tmic... would i be able to use any of the maps if i was to get the ap or would i need to get an actual tune... for me its either getting the ap or doing down pipe/race pipe and a front lip... so its one choice or the other

[Mspeed3]

tuning ur existing mods will yield some serious power while also making it more reliable

[dkswim]

bov would be a problem, cai might be compatable, and ets might not make much of a diffrence to run stage one+. but i dont think it would be all that safe and no one has validated those parts with it. i dont even know what to recomend for you.

[Munnugles]

would a tune be able to make things correct even with vta?

[dkswim]

i dont think cobb is intending on doing any tunning for vta a custume tune might be able to correct for that and it would deffanently be able to correct everything else.

[sleeper3]

ok trying to figure out something... i was reading through the map notes... but still curious... i have ms cai, hks bov in vta, and ets tmic... would i be able to use any of the maps if i was to get the ap or would i need to get an actual tune... for me its either getting the ap or doing down pipe/race pipe and a front lip... so its one choice or the other

stage 1 is 10 hp dude. you'll see more than that with just the midpipe. I'd get the other stuff.

if you're dead set on getting the AP, just make sure you either go to a dyno and chart your a/f ratios or get a wideband 02 sensor.

[Conso]

thats y i ordered xede =P

[sleeper3]

I'm not sure how I feel about piggyback systems yet. our ECU is so adaptive, seems like eventually it would rewrite the maps to cancel it out... not sure about that or anything, but I want my ECU to see what exactly is going on... not be fooled by a black box. that being said, the xede gets GOBS of power from what I've read.

[2.0t03speed]

wow im reading the map notes now for the cobb maps and for the stage 2+sf they are tapering the boost down to 7psi by 6700? wtf is up with that

[AutoXRacer]

i dont think cobb is intending on doing any tunning for vta a custume tune might be able to correct for that and it would deffanently be able to correct everything else.

That would be pretty cool though...man, if I could run my HKS VTA that would be sweeeet!!!!!

I little ricey (ricer), but still sweet... I wonder how much louder it would be... (huh)

I think they would/should tune for that... I think there would be quite a few interested...


wow im reading the map notes now for the cobb maps and for the stage 2+sf they are tapering the boost down to 7psi by 6700? wtf is up with that

Our stock turbos can't handle high RPMs... I'm pretty sure they did it to save our turbos and engines.

[sleeper3]

wow im reading the map notes now for the cobb maps and for the stage 2+sf they are tapering the boost down to 7psi by 6700? wtf is up with that

are they doing that on purpose or is it because of the throttle plate closing?

[dkswim]

we have a small snail. and the turbo is running out of steam. and boost is a measure of restriction. thats why the boost tapers off so quick.

[aaronc7]

Here's how I see it. Leaving the throttle open 100% till redline will probably make SLIGHTLY more power...but either way power sucks beyond 6000-6500ish and you're going to be shifting around 6k anyways. Gobs of power just is not possible up there with our turbo and cam setup. They do start closing the throttle at those rpms, but its to save some wear and tear on parts. If it had produced any real power they would have left it open. (proved by Christian in a couple posts in other forums). They can do whatever they want with the throttle..it's cobb's bitch.

If you go new turbo...maybe even exhaust manifold or other mods they haven't tested yet, all bets are off and opening it up may help more significantly.

I was hoping for more power in the upper RPM range too, but if its still just fattening our current one over the entire rev range thats still good to me.

[sleeper3]

also, if my motor sees 6700 rpm, it's only by accident.

[sleeper3]

Here's how I see it. Leaving the throttle open 100% till redline will probably make SLIGHTLY more power...but either way power sucks beyond 6000-6500ish and you're going to be shifting around 6k anyways. Gobs of power just is not possible up there with our turbo and cam setup. They do start closing the throttle at those rpms, but its to save some wear and tear on parts. If it had produced any real power they would have left it open. (proved by Christian in a couple posts in other forums).

If you go new turbo...maybe even exhaust manifold or other mods they haven't tested yet, all bets are off and opening it up may help more significantly.

fyi, the throttle is never open 100%. I think the most it is ever open is 95ish %

[sleeper3]

here is a log I did this morning
I'll post the graph when I get home but in the mean time, I thought I'd share what I pulled off the DH screen
It's interesting to say the least

3rd gear pull @ 18PSI
37% @ 2977RPM
51
67
69
71
73
75
77
78
79
82% @ 3958RPM
77
74
69
67
65
63
66
67
70
72
73
72
65% @5764RPM
11%(let off throttle)

we are now assuming that these measurements are in degrees rather than percent, thus 82/90=91%throttle at 3958rpm. this is with the gas pedal on the floor.

[AutoXRacer]

I read the difference between 100% opened throttle plate and 50% was only 3-4HP at those high RPMs...

[2.0t03speed]

ok just for a little comparison. the gt25r would hold boost all the way to red line and its just as small as the k04 if not smaller. so saying the turbo is running out of steam and has to taper down to 7 psi by redline is just stupid in my eyes. i would agree with them tapering the boost down to save the motor but as far as the turbo not being able to hold boost is just rediculous

[aaronc7]

sleeper3: I'm not sure about that one, would have to ask cobb or some tuner that's dealt with it all I guess. Thsi was cobbs dyno of power @ 50% throttle duty cycle vs 100.

http://www.accessecu.com/Christian/MS3/Interesting%20Comparison.jpg

[aaronc7]

ok just for a little comparison. the gt25r would hold boost all the way to red line and its just as small as the k04 if not smaller. so saying the turbo is running out of steam and has to taper down to 7 psi by redline is just stupid in my eyes. i would agree with them tapering the boost down to save the motor but as far as the turbo not being able to hold boost is just rediculous

Cobb talks a lot about the cam setup and it leaving its efficiency range after 6k rpms or so. Possibly that's a factor as well? And how would we know a GT25 would hold boost all the way to redline? It may very well run into the other hardware limitations that the K04 is running into.

[sleeper3]

ok just for a little comparison. the gt25r would hold boost all the way to red line and its just as small as the k04 if not smaller. so saying the turbo is running out of steam and has to taper down to 7 psi by redline is just stupid in my eyes. i would agree with them tapering the boost down to save the motor but as far as the turbo not being able to hold boost is just rediculous

size isnt everything. it also has a lot to do with the wheels.

[sleeper3]

sleeper3: I'm not sure about that one, would have to ask cobb or some tuner that's dealt with it all I guess. Thsi was cobbs dyno of power @ 50% throttle duty cycle vs 100.

http://www.accessecu.com/Christian/MS3/Interesting%20Comparison.jpg

yeah and I think that air flow doesn't change at all between 90-100% of open. so it's a moot point, I was just saying, our throttle is never 100% open.

[Munnugles]

the only reason y i was asking about the vta also is that my car the way it is now, runs like crap in recirc and runs perfectly fine in vta... i guess some cars love it and some hate it... i am running a tad bit lean i think cuz i do get popping when i slightly reving it but thats it...

[aaronc7]

The car is set up and designed for recirc. It's always going to run better in recirc than VTA. If its running better in VTA than recirc then it's some other variable...probably a problem with your BOV.

[Erich]

The car is set up and designed for recirc. It's always going to run better in recirc than VTA. If its running better in VTA than recirc then it's some other variable...probably a problem with your BOV.

Or a faulty MAF

[AutoXRacer]

ok just for a little comparison. the gt25r would hold boost all the way to red line and its just as small as the k04 if not smaller. so saying the turbo is running out of steam and has to taper down to 7 psi by redline is just stupid in my eyes. i would agree with them tapering the boost down to save the motor but as far as the turbo not being able to hold boost is just rediculous

There are also issues with the shaft getting soft from the high heat produced at high rpm/boost levels... (notcool)
The GT25R is a much more robust turbo than the K04...K04s are not recommended to be used as high rev/boost turbos; from what I gather.
(dunno)

[aaronc7]

What? What's this?

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u65/aaronc7/Mazdaspeed%203/IMG_2968.jpg

[EngulfinFlames]

(rockon)(rockon)(rockon)(rockon)(rockon)(rockon)(r ockon)DUDE, post more info, whats your impression on it. difference and all that.

[squabbin]

Bahhh u SOB u got urs already...I'm horribly jealous!

[sleeper3]

nintendo ds?

[Munnugles]

nintendo ds?

i thought it was a PSP...

[SwampAss]

someone photoshopped my name off of it.

[MS3077]

someone photoshopped my name off of it.

ROFLMAO!!!

[SHAGwagn]

wow...gues they are out. Any first impressions???

[aaronc7]

I think my bpv might be causing issues with mine...still working stuff out, stay tuned. A couple other people have posted on the other forums and have said good things(although no descriptive explanations)

[aaronc7]

Besides my little issue...power is a lot smoother I will definitely give them that. Driving around power comes on very smoother at half throttle/causal driving. No on/off feel at all.

[Mspeed3]

im gonna have to wait because none of the calibrations match my parts. Hopefully the protuner software isnt outrageous

[aaronc7]

They are making MS CAI map. Once thats out, get the CS mid pipe and you can run stage 2 + ms cai

[aaronc7]

My discussion continued over here: http://www.cobbforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40274

[AutoXRacer]

Congrats!!!!! Sweet!!! (2thumbs)

[sleeper3]

I'm glad I don't have it yet... AP makes it slower? no thanks!!!

[dkswim]

I'm glad /I don't have it yet... AP makes it slower? no thanks!!!

how do you figure it makes it slower

[yager]

has anyone seen the Ko4 that protege garage has, modified, id like to see what cobb or a protuner can do with that, its really supposed to open up the to end.

[sleeper3]

how do you figure it makes it slower

read aaron's comments in the thread on cobb's board.

[sleeper3]

has anyone seen the Ko4 that protege garage has, modified, id like to see what cobb or a protuner can do with that, its really supposed to open up the to end.

there are a couple of places modifying the ko4. from what I've heard, mazda screwed up in the relative sizes of the wheels. the worked ones are supposed to be much better.

[aaronc7]

Still running into some problems with stock bpv...gonna try some more things today. Perhaps the corksport DP is throwing it off.

Another guy is having the exact same problem as me, and Christian thinks its overboost (not fueling problem).

[sleeper3]

yeah, I'm sure your turbo is spooling much faster than the map is thinking it is going to.

[aaronc7]

You think the Corksport DP is THAT much more less restrictive than Cobbs? (how would we know..its not out yet! lol). I mean it's just a fundamental design difference...with corksport's divorced style, etc.

BTW I am running a high flow cat in the mid pipe so its not due to that I dont think.

[sleeper3]

it's definitely a weird thing. or maybe not. do you know of anyone else running stage 2 maps with no problems?

[Shane5425]

exactly why i am waiting a month or 2 before i am gonna get it.. let the bugs and more maps come out.

[aaronc7]

There's been one of two "hey guys i got mine also, running stage 2 its great"

lol

[aaronc7]

Wastegate/boost control issues due to divorced style downpipe perhaps? I hope it's not a limitation, just something that needs to be tweaked in the tuning or something.

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u65/aaronc7/Mazdaspeed%203/IMG_2684.jpg

[sleeper3]

they might just be cobb leg humpers though.

who knows.

[sleeper3]

I'm sure when cobb releases the tuning software, it won't be as big a problem. is the car learning the maps better now that you've driven it some?

[aaronc7]

I've been switching around. It seems to driver smoother over more time/power cycle, but gets the stutter every time. ok gonna go test some more

[Shane5425]

aaronc7, how was the install for the CS DP, that is my next buy...

[dkswim]

its not that bad i did it in 2.5 hours with jack stands but i get payed to turn wrenches all day i could probably do it in 1.5 - 2 hrs now

[sleeper3]

what is up with all the people saying it took 6 hours? did you go from the top or the bottom? also, do you get any smoke? I'm guessing you have some sort of catless midpipe also?

[dkswim]

bottom, advantage of an air compressorand a great tool set as well i also had loosend up a bunch of the bolts months before beacuse i was planning on this mod and i wanted to loosten them ub and antisize some of the dificult ones mailnly heat shield bolts and i got to a couple of the easyier turbo bolts.

[aaronc7]

More food for thought. Christian recommended I run regular stage 2 map as an experiment.

No stuttering like before...can actually feel the power increase, it's nice...BUT

it's too much boost! It feels great until I get boost cut. Little over 20psi in 3rd, 4th. Did a "log" of boost, WGDC, and Load %. With Cobb's maps, boost cut limit has been increased to around 20psi, and I'm right there. But I don't get any of the same stuttering as before, and first and second feel really nice (can actually spin the tires again heh).

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u65/aaronc7/Mazdaspeed%203/th_Stage2data.jpg (http://s165.photobucket.com/albums/u65/aaronc7/Mazdaspeed%203/?action=view&current=Stage2data.flv)

Wastegate isnt doing anything like it was before...weird, I dont get it. Anyone have insight?

[sleeper3]

I wonder what is different between stg2 and stg2w/sf

[aaronc7]

I sent the info over to Christian., since he is gonna know by far the most about what's going on with the various maps (boost fueling etc), I'm hoping he can get some useful info out of it.

When I ran stage1 + SF for fun, I had the same issues as stage 2 + SF (stutter, but no big boost cut like with just plain stage 2)

[sleeper3]

be careful by the way... CPe released an article saying that our ECU was only good for a finite number of flashes. I'm not sure why this would be the case, but I don't know why they would make something like that up.

[aaronc7]

They have some thing about 100 being the limit or something like that. Cobb has said they have flashed their car 700-1000 times, so while I don't want to flash this thing every 10 minutes, I'm not super worried about it.

They've never had an ECU fail on them due to flashing or flashing too many times. I can only imagine how many times some of their own WRXs or STIs have been flashed..lol. Just want people to know...don't want this to turn into some huge paranoia like hydrolock or something.

[lamp3]

Geez 7 bills and I'm going to loose power and have problems. I'd only be running stage 1 sf right now though. any reports from stage 1 guys? I'm starting to think i should cancel my order and do my suspension mods first.I'm quite disapointed right now :(

[aaronc7]

every other single person who has made any comment on it (not just cobb guys) has been good/running fine.

Just wanna let you guys what's going on. It may be a quick fix with the mapping once Christian figures out exactly what is causing the problem. It may be the corksport downpipe design just sucks. It might be it flows better than Cobbs and its boosting too much. Just dunno yet, we gotta test one thing at a time and try to pinpoint the exact problem

[sleeper3]

hm interesting. I didn't know cobb had reflashed that many times without an issue.

[aaronc7]

Christian is making some revised maps and I should have them this evening or early tomorrow. He's going to try a few different things with them, and "it may be as simple as providing a calibration that has reduced WGDC in order to compensate for the downpipe design."

[sleeper3]

hm I wonder if they're going to do this for everyone!

[squabbin]

hm I wonder if they're going to do this for everyone!

my guess is they may put together a main thread of possible issues and setups that correspond with those issues then possibly offer tweaked maps for different instances. This is just my guess.

[aaronc7]

I think they are also trying to see if theres any deeper issues at hand, such as fuel pump problems, etc. that may affect lots of people.

[SHAGwagn]

this really sucks, i was really excited about this. I havnt seen any of these posts u mention where people are actually happy.

[aaronc7]

No one really has it yet...shoudl hear more reviews tonight. I think most people are getting it int he mail today/this afternoon

[SHAGwagn]

o i was jus sayin that cuz ive seen it written a few times on several forums, i think by u actually, that others besides u have had nothing but good things to say and i just cant find them

[funkyman]

I have Turbo XS DP,RP,Injen&PG manifold set up howmany HP increase do u think i have?:-)93 octane FL

[aaronc7]

manifold might bring you some problems....again no one knows. get it and try it!! lol

[SHAGwagn]

figured.

[funkyman]

I hope to go to Moroso drag strip sometime soon to get real results and test the car ,we`ll see.

[matsuda]

No one really has it yet...shoudl hear more reviews tonight. I think most people are getting it int he mail today/this afternoon

I'm sure people will hook it up, reflash, drive for 30 minutes, and post their impressions without giving the ECU time to "re-learn".

[matsuda]

this really sucks, i was really excited about this. I havnt seen any of these posts u mention where people are actually happy.

People have to actually receive the AP before they can post their impressions.

Even after they receive it, it may take several days of driving in various conditions before anyone can offer a really good evaluation.

If you really want to know how good the AP is, wait about a month. By that time, enough people will have tested it on different cars (mods), and in different conditions.

[MS3077]

lol@ the test dummies for the AP (lol2)

I'm laughing but I will most likely get it regardless when funds are available.

[aaronc7]

Ok my problems have been solved. Replaced spark plugs and gapped to .028. Recommend anyone getting the AP to check their plugs out and possibly replace...or anyone for that matter. No idea how my Iridium plugs went bad so quick (19k). Possibly running my mods without tuning? I ran a hybrid BOV for like 2 weeks? Either way...check them out. I bought the cheapest plugs they had at Autozone just incase it dindt work out...best $16 so far, lol

[wisniaPl]

so no more boost cut??

[aaronc7]

My original problem was stuttering at WOT in 4k+ range..apparenly it was my plugs because I am running that same map now with no problems. Boost seems right on target and in line with what the map notes say.

[sleeper3]

we all know how rich these cars run.


were the plugs super black? that indicates you were running rich.

[aaronc7]

This was the only questionable plug really. I'm no expert at plugs but some people said it looked like it was running lean (cylinder 3).

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/9566/img3018fh8.jpg

[sleeper3]

yeah that looks like it was running REALLY lean... of course I am used to looking at 2 stroke plugs. definitely not rich though.


(two stroke plugs are always blacker, because they burn oil too)

[aaronc7]

But yeah, not sure why it is....fuel related (running my mods w/o tuning)? I run richer with the AP than I do stock map. I guess that's safer and apparently they ran it a little on the rich side because they found that there wasn't much/any power to be had by making it a little leaner. And they are conservative of course.