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Tenc_ms3x
03-20-2008, 11:07 PM
Just like the title said, my timing jumped. I've heard that we dont have an interference motor and then i heard we do. Which one is it? I know 2.3's are jumping thanks to a bad design from mazda( thanks Jay) I'm basically trying to prepare myself for what might be wrong with my car. trying to decide wether or not i should buy a new motor or try fixing what i got and upgrading my turbo. (homework)(help)
ForceFed
03-20-2008, 11:09 PM
Did you trash the motor...If not...And its still running...Whay are you talking of replacing the engine?

If the timing jumped..Pull the belt..repair the issue and install a new belt.

What is the Flaw you speak of...I want to hear this one.
Tenc_ms3x
03-20-2008, 11:22 PM
its a chain driven motor so my buddy told me i can't do it like i do a belt motor. it only runs when i keep my foot on the gas. it won't start on it's on.
2.0t03speed
03-20-2008, 11:36 PM
yea the mzr is a chain and sprocket driven motor
GoFast
03-20-2008, 11:53 PM
the rumor from stealerships on this one is that synthetic oil can actually cause this. i am not quite sure if i buy it but i swear i remember that conversation on here before. it doesnt make sense to me but oh well. in my mind 5w-30 =5w-30 regardless of synthetic or fossil
redrocketz
03-21-2008, 12:09 AM
they can jump timing because there is NO key way anywhere in the timing setup so shit is just pushed on and bolted down.
ForceFed
03-21-2008, 01:55 AM
Ok..Even if it is Chain Driven..Did your motor make contact(piston to Valve?)
If not..WHy are you still needing to replace it rather than fix it?

And what is the solution then if these are chain driven?
dkswim
03-21-2008, 03:29 AM
subscribed.
Haltech
03-21-2008, 03:36 AM
Synthetic oil is the culprit? LMFAO.. i guess my dealer needs to stop offering it for oil changes than huh? Dealerships grasping at straws!
Tenc_ms3x
03-21-2008, 07:41 AM
I haven't taken the head off to see yet. As for the oil thing that bullsh** never heard of anything like that
2.0t03speed
03-21-2008, 08:08 AM
you cant take it to the dealer and let them fix it ? you are still under warrenty right? just put it back to stock if you have any mods and tak eit to them and have them fix it
ericrapp
03-21-2008, 05:28 PM
So the question is ; is the motor an interference design where things have unhappy meetings. Is It? Then and only then can we seek the root source and hopefully the answers to the damage in question.
fourthmeal
03-21-2008, 05:38 PM
snip
fourthmeal
03-21-2008, 05:41 PM
gone
fourthmeal
03-21-2008, 05:44 PM
snip
1Sleepy93
03-21-2008, 05:47 PM
That design certainly does not make one feel all warm and fuzzy.
fourthmeal
03-21-2008, 05:54 PM
snip
Demi
03-21-2008, 07:01 PM
Agreed! Scary! Siiiiiiiiiiiigh.
GoFast
03-21-2008, 11:58 PM
I haven't taken the head off to see yet. As for the oil thing that bullsh** never heard of anything like that
here is just one example of a dealership saying that....again not that i buy it but, its been said before...

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123699689&highlight=synthetic+oil+changing+timing
Fudgie
03-22-2008, 08:43 AM
Yup- you need a special bolt that screws into the back of the block to locate the crank. A flat bar that locks the cam in position and a pulley holding tool so you don't break the bolt that got threaded into the block (or the block itself) while removing and reinstalling the crankshaft bolt (which also is suppose to be replaced everytime it is removed).
ericrapp
03-22-2008, 05:54 PM
Yup- you need a special bolt that screws into the back of the block to locate the crank. A flat bar that locks the cam in position and a pulley holding tool so you don't break the bolt that got threaded into the block (or the block itself) while removing and reinstalling the crankshaft bolt (which also is suppose to be replaced everytime it is removed).

This whole story is bizarre. what design advantage would using a taper lock provide? I'm sure i've missed the obvious again, I can not see what drove M engenears to do this. I trust there is a reason, anybody anyone at all.
Tenc_ms3x
03-22-2008, 06:34 PM
so i guess its time to get the head worked on.
ForceFed
03-22-2008, 06:36 PM
Not neccesarily....Depending on what is damaged..You may be able to repair what you have.
You still havent said if your had any Interference contact.
Just because your timing slipped does not mean you made contact....Did any valves hit the pistons?

DO you even know?
Have you checked?

Thats where I would start.
AutoXRacer
03-22-2008, 07:17 PM
If this info is correct...Mazda just dropped the ball on this one...
No key? Interference engine? Piece of crap!!!

I miss my Miata now... Belt driven timing and non-interference!!!! FTW
I should of just gotten a MS Miata with a Flying Miata turbo kit for 300 RWHP!!!!! (bang)
Betelgeuse
03-22-2008, 08:38 PM
This whole story is bizarre. what design advantage would using a taper lock provide? I'm sure i've missed the obvious again, I can not see what drove M engenears to do this. I trust there is a reason, anybody anyone at all.

Found this link on google. It outlines several advantages of an interference design.

http://www.leemyles.com/articles/interference-engines-and-timing-belts.html

From what I've read, interference designs are very common on modern high compression engines. The key to their longevity is the is the nature of the timing belt. Chains are more durable than rubber and should negate any worries regarding breakage. However I'd like to know more about this 'tapered' design with respect to the crankshaft gear and why they used that. I'm sure there's a reasonable explanation for that as well.
ericrapp
03-23-2008, 07:24 AM
Found this link on goggle. It outlines several advantages of an interference design.

http://www.leemyles.com/articles/interference-engines-and-timing-belts.html

From what I've read, interference designs are very common on modern high compression engines. The key to their longevity is the is the nature of the timing belt. Chains are more durable than rubber and should negate any worries regarding breakage. However I'd like to know more about this 'tapered' design with respect to the crankshaft gear and why they used that. I'm sure there's a reasonable explanation for that as well.

I am ok with that. But the taper lock design is harder to align as it draws the sprocket in as you torque it down. If the shaft or taper is out of tolerance even a tiny bit, I.D.- O.D.,it will not align and possibly not clamp enough on shaft. The only advantage I see at this point is ease of removal. Which defeats the point of using the chain. Still thinking on this one
Fudgie
03-23-2008, 09:12 AM
There is no taper. It just tightens up and "voila" your good! I would love to hear input on why this set-up is worthy of being on any engine??





This whole story is bizarre. what design advantage would using a taper lock provide? I'm sure i've missed the obvious again, I can not see what drove M engenears to do this. I trust there is a reason, anybody anyone at all.
Tenc_ms3x
03-23-2008, 07:52 PM
If this info is correct...Mazda just dropped the ball on this one...
No key? Interference engine? Piece of crap!!!

I miss my Miata now... Belt driven timing and non-interference!!!! FTW
I should of just gotten a MS Miata with a Flying Miata turbo kit for 300 RWHP!!!!! (bang)

I don't think that u should feel like that. I was mad at first but now its just life. When they designed this car they had good intentions I'm sure. I think the problem is that we're just not used to this type of design. everything has it's flaws. Just look at what i'm going through as something to help you and the rest of us MS3 owner. You'll know what to look out for and to keep an eye on.