MS3....Lead Wheels???

[mazdaspeed32007]

ok...so in another thread we were discussing the weight of each rim and wheel of the MS3. the conclusion of the thread determined that Mazda bonked on this one big time. what do you think were the reasons for such a heavy rim? if they were going for performance, why not use a 17 inch lighter weight rim? and so on.......

[TorqSpeed5252]

I don't know how much one wheel weighs, but one day I was pondering why they went with a ten spoke design as opposed to a five or six. The only think I came up with that satisfied me was to make it stronger for the type of people that dont watch out for potholes. Could be totally wrong though.

[Ryz]

How is a 24lb rim heavy? If they went lighter the car would have cost more right of the bat.

[BLACKMS3]

Even with a light wheel setup, you are only going to lose 50lbs max.... not necessarily insignificant, as that is rotating mass, but you could get the same thing by keeping the car under half a tank...

I could care less... I would like to run a car with equal add-ons and only lighter wheels and see what the difference is on the track... I guarantee you won't notice...

[BLACKMS3]

Oh and BTW... Mazda did it for styling purposes in my opinion... if they wanted us to go faster, they wouldn't have had the throttle slap closed at 5800rpms... or dropped the boost in the lower gears..

They made a compromise, plain and simple.

[Bufalo]

Plus, have you already forgotten that Mazda offers dealer-installed forged wheels as an upgrade?

[TheDutchGun]

Then there's the whole them keeping their own costs down. Costs a lot more to mass produce a lighter/more expensive wheel. They could have done it and passed the extra cost onto the customer but that would take them out of the price point they wanted to sell the car at.

[clos561]

Plus, have you already forgotten that Mazda offers dealer-installed forged wheels as an upgrade?

550 a piece....

[BLACKMS3]

Yeah I almost got those with my $2000 nav option.......... LOL Yeah Right!!

[controlo]

Yeah I almost got those with my $2000 nav option.......... LOL Yeah Right!!

haha, that's ludacris man!

i think if the wheels didn't look so good, i might have a problem with them being so heavy.

that, and i don't have 1,300 for new wheels.

[mazdaspeed32007]

Plus, have you already forgotten that Mazda offers dealer-installed forged wheels as an upgrade?

thats nice. im glad i was offered that option......fuckers. i found out about all the factory add ons when i bought the car, searched for performance parts, and car and drivers review came up with the info about it.

well, in my opinion a 50 lb wheel is def heavy. i dont see any way around thinking that it isnt. like i said in a previous thread if you bought an 11 lb 17 inch rim, threw tires on it....you could be looking at around 30 lbs a wheel. thats 80 lbs difference. if you couldnt tell the difference in the rotating mass of 80 lbs total even on the street nevermind the track youd have to be oblivious to your own vehicle. your acceleration and stopping would be greatly effected.

now im not sure about this but since its front wheel drive and the tranny has to only spin two wheels directly, does that mean the mass it has to spin would only be 100 lbs or would you factor all 4 wheels and say its rotating 200 lbs?

[mazdaspeed32007]

also...i read somewhere that each 2.x lbs (i think it was 2.17 lbs) of rotating mass is equal to 1 hp. correct if im wrong please. that means youd essentially feel about a (lets go with a 50 lb difference total throughout all 4 rims) 23 hp. thats as good as my CAI. and i felt a significant change when i put that on.

[mazdaspeed32007]

Originally Posted by neox.286
Rims:
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/graml...009-whl_brand&
Prices:
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/resul...ar=&sort=Brand

Heres a post on another thread of some very affordable lightweight rims that could help you more than youd expect in performance. i think you all greatly underestimate the difference you will feel with the weight difference on your wheels.

EDIT: Gram Lights

[SwampAss]

the difference is very significant. I shaved 6lbs per wheel.

[Young Roids]

Originally Posted by neox.286
Rims:
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/graml...009-whl_brand&
Prices:
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/resul...ar=&sort=Brand

Heres a post on another thread of some very affordable lightweight rims that could help you more than youd expect in performance. i think you all greatly underestimate the difference you will feel with the weight difference on your wheels.

EDIT: Gram Lights

links not working

[Foolish]

It's odd, really. Mazda went to the trouble of spec'ing crazy-light wheels on the original Miatas, to the extent that the wheel put on one of the early-90's models was the lightest-weight OEM wheel ever put on a car, but as time has passed, they seem to have forgotten that that was important to them. The MazdaSpeed Miatas had big, sexy wheels on them that weighed a ton, as do the MS3's and MS6's. I'm not sure what's going on over at Mazda. ???

[mazdaspeed32007]

its nice they put some styling efforts into the rim to make them look as sweet as they do. (esp the ms6) like you said though....they lost the true meaning and importance of the lighter rim on performance. even if they did charge you more for a lighter rim, think if they put a 17 inch rim, the difference in price of the stock 18 inch rim and a 17 lightweight wouldnt really be all that significant. it wouldnt look bad on the car. plus youd get a much desired performance increase.

[BLACKMS3]

The stock setup already wins it's class... that's accomplishment enough for mazda. Like I said if they wanted to make it faster they wouldn't have put the restrictions on it they did.

Why would you put a VERY restrictive airbox on the car? Not everyone bought these for the performance...

[letholone]

I think this car is a bit on the advanced side to drive. With the TQ steer involved for the mass public, maybe they used the heavier wheel on purpose to slow the car down.

just another thought process..

[tsunami]

yeah guys this is a mass produced car and 24lb 18" wheel isn't really heavy its more in the middle of the pack and actually a bit on the lighter side... so all im sayin is quit your bitchin!! your car with just a cai is pretty badass...


though this poster did pay for some light weight 18" wheel and tires for his n/a 3 and noticed a nice difference in handling and acceleration.

[mazdaspeed32007]

... so all im sayin is quit your bitchin!!

no bitching pre-say. more just a conversation on the thought process of mazda. i call it more like a politicians debate. haha.

[tsunami]

no bitching pre-say. more just a conversation on the thought process of mazda. i call it more like a politicians debate. haha.


yeah yeah... i was mostly venting my frustration at you guys for complaining over a couple pounds in the wheels when you have almost 300hp to the ground with a few simple mods.... i mean seriously you want your cake and be able to eat it to... be happy that you spent 23-25k on a car that is making substantial power with a few simple bolt ons...

[mazdaspeed32007]

no dont get me wrong im def happy. i think the stock rims are awesome looking. i just wish they made them smaller and lighter. something like the evo rim....which by the way people with the speed6 are doing. anyone think this is a bad idea for any sort of reasons?

[BoostedSpd6]

They couldve made a rim just like the EVO's have.. my buddy aaron had one i think each rim weighed like 7lbs or something like that correct me if im wrong and thats stock from the factory..and Evo's have the best handling out there in my opinion, my ms6 comes no where close to it. one because of the weight of the car and two i drive around with concrete slabs for rims.. i gaurentee if u go with a lighter rim and tire package ull take off atleast .100 off ur 1/4 mile time.

[tsunami]

there is no way in hell the rims weigh 7lbs unless they are 15" or something... a 17lb 18" wheel is pretty damn light and maybe thats what you were refering to or a 15lb 17" is light as well remember also guys the lighter the wheel the easier it usually is to bend and a f'in fly can take a dump on it when its parked and you will wonder why its out of balance... seriously i have gone through the car wash twice now with a bit of vibration and come out with out any and this was in the summer i.e. no ice build up.... just some road grime.

[crystalmeth3]

some of the lightest wheels on the market are the 15 inchers still weighing in at about 12 lbs. A very light 18 inch wheel weighs around 19 lbs and that wheel is likely forged and very expensive. The most advanced wheels on the market (callaway) are made of forged magnesium center sections and have carbon fiber rims, if they are in the 18 or 19 inch area, they still weigh 11 lbs or more. oh yeah and EACH wheel cost about $2200! 24 lbs is not heavy for a factory cast aluminum wheel.

[mazdaspeed32007]

there is no way in hell the rims weigh 7lbs unless they are 15" or something... a 17lb 18" wheel is pretty damn light and maybe thats what you were refering to or a 15lb 17" is light as well remember also guys the lighter the wheel the easier it usually is to bend and a f'in fly can take a dump on it when its parked and you will wonder why its out of balance... seriously i have gone through the car wash twice now with a bit of vibration and come out with out any and this was in the summer i.e. no ice build up.... just some road grime.

i believe the evo IX bbs 17" rim is about 15 lbs a piece. so with the tire probably something like 35 lbs total or something close to it. thats pretty light.

EDIT: each evo IX original rim weights approx. 7 lbs a piece. wooooweeee

[TheDutchGun]

I'm telling you, if they put the same type of wheels as that evo for example, expect $2-4 thousand USD more on the sticker price. Then people would start to question whether this car is the bargain that it is.

[mazdaspeed32007]

I'm telling you, if they put the same type of wheels as that evo for example, expect $2-4 thousand USD more on the sticker price. Then people would start to question whether this car is the bargain that it is.

i think by eliminating the stock 18 and replacing it with the lightweight 17 you would only see no more than 1000 change. remember....if its 1500 for the stock 18....and 2000 for the lightweight 17....difference of only 500 bucks. not 2-4 more on the msrp now.

thats just an example but you get my drift

[TheDutchGun]

i think by eliminating the stock 18 and replacing it with the lightweight 17 you would only see no more than 1000 change. remember....if its 1500 for the stock 18....and 2000 for the lightweight 17....difference of only 500 bucks. not 2-4 more on the msrp now.

thats just an example but you get my drift

I get it but thats going down a size also. I didn't mean the exact Evo wheel but going to a more expensive lighter wheel in general. You might as well buy aftermarket wheels because you'd be paying extra for the car if it had lighter wheels on it.

[Falconx84]

Think about it... if mazda put lightweight rims on it from the factory, we'd bitching that theres nothing we can tune

Mazda is smart enough to realize that we can't leave well-enough alone and that no matter how good their engineers make it, someone will figure out a different way to make it better -- so they err on the side of price

[Young Roids]

^yea I wouldn't complain about it. They gave us 18s wich is nice because the competition only has 17s. IF you really want and ultra light setup why stop at 17s the car will fit 16s go for those and really knock yourself out with lowered unsprung and rotating mass.

[BoostedSpd6]

there is no way in hell the rims weigh 7lbs unless they are 15" or something... a 17lb 18" wheel is pretty damn light and maybe thats what you were refering to or a 15lb 17" is light as well remember also guys the lighter the wheel the easier it usually is to bend and a f'in fly can take a dump on it when its parked and you will wonder why its out of balance... seriously i have gone through the car wash twice now with a bit of vibration and come out with out any and this was in the summer i.e. no ice build up.... just some road grime.

actually yes they are read the facts my buddy had a EVO 9 MR and when we rotated his tires we each could pick up 2 of them no problem.. they weigh in about i think 20 21 lbs fully inflated.(bicker)

[mazdaspeed32007]

^yea I wouldn't complain about it. They gave us 18s wich is nice because the competition only has 17s. IF you really want and ultra light setup why stop at 17s the car will fit 16s go for those and really knock yourself out with lowered unsprung and rotating mass.

thats hardly the point. im not saying go with a wheelbarrow 3 lb rim. im saying a 17 inch lightweight wouldnt raise the price of the car that much and wouldnt look bad. and im SURE it would increase performance a great deal.

it would have been nice if they decided to give us light weight rims to start off with...and not make us spend another 2000 on the sticker price and be stuck with 50lb rims. thats all im saying.

and yes, people would be unhappy about something no matter what you gave them. people with vipers complain about cabin heat. people with vettes complain about the 18th century style of the vette. but they dont complain about 50 lb. rims do they???!!! the wheels design could have been kept, they could have made a 17 inch lighter rim, fin.

[letholone]

why not put the EVO wheels on then...

they are 5/114. offset should be fine.

[mazdaspeed32007]

why not put the EVO wheels on then...

they are 5/114. offset should be fine.

yea thats what im planning on doing once i finish the exhaust. but the original question...why didnt mazda just do it. i know we'll never know exactly for sure, but speculation and debate...hey....its what we do best.

not only are they waaaaaay lighter, but look at the size also. you'd get better acceleration with a 235 instead of a 215. thatd be waaay niiiice.