Results of ECU reset and other for feul economy

[Weborific]

OK, so I've reset my ECU in an attempt to get better gas mileage and my results seem positive. I used to get a maximum of 320 Km per tank from FULL to gas light, now I've got 360 Km. Here's what I did (thanks to all your posts!!) along with the ECU reset:

- inflate tires properly and use your own digital gauge. My gas station's gauge was off by 10 PSI!! It showed one tire at 33 PSI when in fact it was only 22.5 PSI on my digital gauge...

- Shave a couple of minutes off warmup idle on cold days

- Turn heater dial all the way CCW to "face" setting, this way the compressor isn't running.

Here's what's weird... I filled the gas tank and here's what I got:

- at 3/4 tank full mark: drove 120 Km total
- at 1/2 tank mark: drove 230 Km total
- at 1/4 tank full mark: drove 350 Km total
- at 360 Km, gas light went on

IS THIS NORMAL?? Needle is still just a touch under the 1/4 tank remaining mark...

[Kansei]

360km on the tank isn't really great fuel economy at all. You can take all your numbers and just tack "miles" on to the end and that's not even super duper gas mileage for a Protege5.

You're seriously getting as bad fuel economy as I am with my horribly rich running turbo setup and me driving the car really hard.

When were your spark plugs/wires last replaced? Is it an automatic? Something's really up to have gas mileage that bad... winter blend petrol won't make it that bad at all.

[Weborific]

Thanks for reply! Yeah, my mileage sucks. I replaced my spark plugs about 3 or 4 months ago and my wires about 8 months ago. I had trouble finding wires for the P5 here in Montreal (which is surprising to me) so I ordered 2 sets from Ebay, both where wrong for the P5. I FINALLY found a spot that had the wires in Montreal, but not thick, high performance ones. They look like the standard ones....

[redpr5]

my gas mileage kinda sucks. i just took the crossbars off the roof rack so i'll see how that helps. just had new front tires put on and gettin new rear tires this week so that will solve any tire problems. just did the spark plugs like 4 or 5 weeks ago, havent done wires yet. mines an automatic with a SRI (which i know doesnt help mileage) and i baby it everywhere. im lucky to get 320miles to a tank. i used to get over 340
btw kansei, sucks about your car man. right after you got it turboed too. get it runnin again soon.

[Weborific]

I originally replaced the spark plugs like 2 weeks after I bought the car March of last year. I bought NGK's (I THINK they were iridiums or something). I was getting AT MOST 460 Km before the gas light lit. Then, a few months ago, I had my brother-in-law (a mechanic) check my spark plugs (don't remember why) and I asked if they needed to be replaced. He said they didn't look too bad but (if I remember correctly) he mentioned that they didn't have much life left in them...and this was after a maximum of 7 months of use. He installed new NGK's and told me that they're COLD spark plugs. He told me they'd be better for winter, although after what info I've read on-line, this doesn't appear to be true. I've read a statement or 2 indicating that COLD plugs reduce gas mileage, but haven't found anything definitive....

[Weborific]

I'm having a really hard time finding performance wires for the P5. Can anyone suggest a site??

[Kansei]

You don't need thick high performance wires. The OEM wires or the wires NGK sells are good enough for anything. I had high performance wires (sparkco brand) that went bad on me, causing bad misfiring..

Do you remember what brand/model spark plugs? The NGK BFR5F-11 is the standard Protege5 plug, but you can run the NGK ZFR5F-11 as well, it seems to smooth things out a bit.

I'm really scratching my head here trying to think what else could be amiss causing such bas gas mileage. Are there any modifications to the vehicle? Even with the extensive modifications my engine had before I turboed the car, I still got fuel economy of 6.42 litres per 100km on the highway, and not that much worse driving around in the city.

[Kansei]

Oh that's it! If he went with a 6 heat range plug instead of a 5, that could cause it. With all my modifications (before being turbo of course), I still couldn't run the 6 heat range without the car's performance suffering.

I'd buy some NGK ZFR5F-11 plugs, they're very cheap (since they're copper) and slap them in and see how things go.

[Weborific]

No, I don't remember what brand of wires, I just wanted to replace the originals that the previous owner was still using. I swear, he didn't take care of her and I'm the one paying the price! There are no mods to the car what-so-ever. Thank you guys SOOO much for taking the time to help. I was hoping the above steps I took (listed above) would help me crack the 400 Km mark and the info would help others in the same situation... sorry. My last bet (I'm really wondering) is that tomorrow I'll fill-up at a different gas station. I topped-off about 17 litres from a different station this last time. I wonder if this is what has accounted for the 40 Km increase....

[Weborific]

Thanks for confirming this, Kansei!! OK, so (without me sounding too stupid here) where can I get these spark plugs? Are they special order or will anybody have them? Up until my last plug change, I had no idea there where different classes of plugs like COLD plugs...

[Weborific]

I just realized something I need help on. When I bought my spark wires, the box had only 2 wires in it. 1 long, 1 short. I understand that we have coil packs. But I just found P5 wires on a website and that kit comes with the same 2 wires I've got PLUS 2 connectors without an actual wire to them. Are these for the coil packs? If I remove the coil packs, is there something I can replace without replacing the entire coil pack?

[whitemp5seattle]

I think it's just something about Montreal that's giving you bad mileage. When I drove up to Montreal this weekend I got about 75 miles per quarter tank - 300 miles per tank. When I drove back down to CT I got my usual 100ish per quarter tank - almost 400 miles per tank. (dunno)

[i12drivemyMP5]

Thanks for confirming this, Kansei!! OK, so (without me sounding too stupid here) where can I get these spark plugs? Are they special order or will anybody have them? Up until my last plug change, I had no idea there where different classes of plugs like COLD plugs...Sparkplug.com

[newprot5fan]

hey man,

you are getting about the same gas mileage I am.

Maybe it is the cold here in Canada during the winter (I am in NS). I have replaced my air filter, checked my tire pressure, about to put some V-power NGK spark plugs in, and soon cahnge the transmission fluid (manual). I have also run a bottle of the "fuel system cleaner" through the system this tank, so hopefully that might improve it a bit, but I hear you about the crappy mileage. I got my car used, and I don;t think there were any modifications done.

Are those numbers you have for mileage a mix of city/highway, or what?

[ctt 1982]

i usually get a consistent 550km per tank in the frigid cold wastelands of edmonton

edit: and i drive like a madman

[P-Funk!]

Key here -the ecu reset did nothing. The correct tire inflation and better operating technique account for the improvement.

[Kansei]

Thanks for confirming this, Kansei!! OK, so (without me sounding too stupid here) where can I get these spark plugs? Are they special order or will anybody have them? Up until my last plug change, I had no idea there where different classes of plugs like COLD plugs...

You should be able to get them at any auto parts store. They're a pretty standard plug.

[treybrad]

- Turn heater dial all the way CCW to "face" setting, this way the compressor isn't running.

Is this true? I don't mean to threadjack, but I've tried to search for this before, I know on my '02 it seems like the a/c compressor kicks on w/ the heater even when the light is off. Is that the way around it? Just keep it on the "face" setting instead of feet?

trey

[Kansei]

Yes, the a/c compressor kicks on even when the light is off. There's a how-to for disabling that around here somewhere, it involves some circuitboard soldering.

air conditioning won't decrease the gas mileage on these cars that much but it sure does suck the pep from them.

[JoshP5]

Interesting...I run on "face/feet" mode constantly and have been scratching my head as to why I'm getting 250 miles to the yellow light, even after plugs, filter, and seafoam. Maybe "face" mode will solve my fuel consumption problem, too...

[Kansei]

no, face/feet shouldn't turn the compressor on. I was under the impression that it only turns it on for feet/windshield and windshield, and maybe for just feet too.

[geomatics_tech]

I get 550-625kms in my MSP in Calgary, and I warm my car up for 5 minutes when its cold.

Try using the block heater when its really cold out, my car starts up like a summer day if I plug it in for 30 minutes before.

[treybrad]

no, face/feet shouldn't turn the compressor on. I was under the impression that it only turns it on for feet/windshield and windshield, and maybe for just feet too.

That's how all my previous cars have been. It'll turn itself on for defrosting, windshield or feet/windshield, but never for feet or feet/face. The P5 seems to on feet, and I think feet/face. I'll have to play around with it and see what does what..

trey

[Kansei]

^^ I think any setting that it doesn't let you turn on recirc for is a position where it's using A/C

[Weborific]

I think it's in the manual, I know I've read it somewhere. i think that only the FACE setting disables the compressor. I just filled-up my tank today. The final result... I drove 380 Km on 46 litres of gas. That's 236 miles on 12.15 Gal. That's 19 mpg. To answer a previous question, I drive mostly highway (like 70%) and try to use cruise control when I can. I'll be ordering those plugs you suggested real soon...

[Weborific]

I just filled-up at a different station today. It actually cost me about 4 cents per litre more than most stations. We'll see if there's fewer additives there...

[clicknext]

Yeah, 360km is pretty crappy mileage, even if it's an improvement. Personally according to the mileage I've gotten in the past, I consider it good mileage when I've got 520km at refuel time. Usually that translates to about 28-29 mpg for me.

[MyZmZm]

i normally get about 500-550 km per tank in the summer, which drops to about 450-500 per tank if it's -25C or colder for a stretch, when i tend to let my car idle a little longer (about 5-7 min) than normal to warm up. i drive 90% city with a little freeway and/or highway on occasion.

definitely try different spark plugs; if that doesn't fix your really bad consumption, i would suggest a trip to the shop to see if it's something deeper that's causing your problem because 19 mpg is NOT normal for the P5.

[Weborific]

Yeah, I hear you guys. 500+ Km is awesome. Even spoke with my brother-in-law tonight about what it could be. I just wish there was something definitive. One think he's not sure of that I came across last night are the spark plug wires. When I replaced mine last year, I got 2 wires. I found on a site last night a company selling those same 2 wires PLUS 2 other boots and 2 long springs. Are these to replace whatever is underneath our coil packs or what? Don't I have to buy a coil pack seperately or can I just replace the boots on them??

[Kansei]

do the two wires already have the long boot things on them? If so, then yeah, sounds like they are replacing the ones on the stock coils (didn't even realize you could remove that from the stock coil packs.

[Weborific]

Yeah, the long wires already have boots, but there are EXTRA boots. Click this link, they're the wires on the top of the page. Click image for close-up...
http://replacement.car-stuff.com/parts/carstuff/wizard.jsp?year=2002&make=MA&model=PRO-5-002&category=F&part=Ignition%20Wire%20Set&returnurl=null&dp=true&showdc=true#top

[Kansei]

yup, those are definitely the boots and such for the coil packs. nice find!

[Weborific]

Kansei, I had my friend (mechanic) look-up those sparkplug numbers you gave me and I realize I may have over-looked possible the largest factor in gas mileage differences...engine size. The plugs you mentioned are for a 1.6L engine. I own a 2L engine and I believe there's a 1.8L as well. Can there really be a 200km difference in miles per tank between these 2 sizes? Does the P5 rating of 30MPG only apply to a 1.6L engine or any model?? Sorry if it's a noob question.... And THANKS!

[Kansei]

there's nothing other than a 2.0 Protege5. Yeah, I know the ZFR5F-11 isn't the OEM plug the mazda manual tells you to use but it works wonderfully and more smoothly than the BKR5F-11 stock plug. The only difference is that it is a long reach plug.

[i12drivemyMP5]

I have those plugs & 2.0l & auto & AC & can pull upper 20s easy if I keep it reasonable on the crazy driving habit scale. Car loves them. They just aren't spec'd on our cars in US.

[newprot5fan]

I have those plugs & 2.0l & auto & AC & can pull upper 20s easy if I keep it reasonable on the crazy driving habit scale. Car loves them. They just aren't spec'd on our cars in US.


Hey there....I just tracked down those ZFR5F-11 plugs...I was gonna put in NGK V-power, but those other ones sound pretty good. A longer spark plug is fine then in our cars??

Let me know since I can get them today:P Does climate affect what spark plugs work better? I am in NS and it does get quite cold here...just curious.

[Kansei]

the ZFR5F-11 plugs I used were v-power, the v-power is just a standard copper plug with a little v cut in it though. the stores here don't carry any NGK plug cheaper than the v-power ones, weird.

The ZFR5F-11 will be fine in NS, I'm in a cold place too, it's no problem.

[newprot5fan]

the ZFR5F-11 plugs I used were v-power, the v-power is just a standard copper plug with a little v cut in it though. the stores here don't carry any NGK plug cheaper than the v-power ones, weird.

The ZFR5F-11 will be fine in NS, I'm in a cold place too, it's no problem.

So these plugs are a big improvement then over the regular sized plugs? I guess I am just wondering how big of a difference putting new longer ones in would be compared to putting normal sized ones in. I don;t know too much about cars (yet) so I am pretty curious when it comes to "why"...:P (I'm a scientist..It's my nature!)

So you recommend these longer plugs.....What was the improvement when you switched to them?

[Kansei]

It smoothed the idle as well as making it less jerky in reverse?

I can't find the thread for it right now but the long reach plugs (ZFR instead of BKR) are the plugs the car has from the factory when sold in Japan, I'm not really sure why they didn't in North America.

[Chicoloco]

i get 700 nautical miles per tank. :P


No really, i'll fill up my tank and post what a protege 2.0 gets in a tropical weather.

[FlyinMSP]

I think it's just something about Montreal that's giving you bad mileage. When I drove up to Montreal this weekend I got about 75 miles per quarter tank - 300 miles per tank. When I drove back down to CT I got my usual 100ish per quarter tank - almost 400 miles per tank. (dunno)

Yep, I wouldn't be surprized if the oil companies have a special mix for us! They love to rip us off :(

In winter I NEVER get more than 400-420 Km with a tank

[Kansei]

Yeah I know there's "winter mix" gas but the northeastern CT gets it too.. I doubt it's any worse in Canada though

[newprot5fan]

It smoothed the idle as well as making it less jerky in reverse?

I can't find the thread for it right now but the long reach plugs (ZFR instead of BKR) are the plugs the car has from the factory when sold in Japan, I'm not really sure why they didn't in North America.


Did you notice any gains in fuel economy or any small gains in power?

[CTt3P5]

there's nothing other than a 2.0 Protege5. Yeah, I know the ZFR5F-11 isn't the OEM plug the mazda manual tells you to use but it works wonderfully and more smoothly than the BKR5F-11 stock plug. The only difference is that it is a long reach plug.

IIRC the long reach plugs require the use of premium fuel to prevent knocking? (dunno)

[Kansei]

IIRC the long reach plugs require the use of premium fuel to prevent knocking? (dunno)
nope, I ran them for the couple months after I sold my MP3 ECU and before I turboed my car on 87 octane no problem.

[CTt3P5]

^^^I might just go that route then. I remembered reading up on them but thought it was mentioned that premium fuel was required due to the long reach. Thanks

[Kansei]

Yeah people thought that maybe it was but like I said I had no issue for 4-5k miles that way. The long reach plugs are so slightly different anyway, side by side you can see that

[i12drivemyMP5]

Nothin but 87 in mine with no problems. IIRC octane bump is for cams, ecu changes, turbo, etc

[newprot5fan]

Nothin but 87 in mine with no problems. IIRC octane bump is for cams, ecu changes, turbo, etc


So if I have no mods or anything, then I can use the ZFR5F-11 in my P5 without changing to 89 octane?

it seems people are really split on this. Some swear by these long reach plugs and others say just put the stock NGKs back in.....Since I know NOTHING about cars, I don;t want to screw anything up if I put these new plugs in..but it is tempting:P

[Kansei]

I don't know of a single person who has used the ZFR5F-11 and had problems. I know at least a dozen people who use them and swear by them, including Protege FAQ guru TheMAN, the guy who originally broached the topic of the ZFRs on here.

[JoshP5]

Here (http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123631485&highlight=long+reach+plugs)'s the thread.

[GMalatrasi]

So what's the veridict on the poor milage thing?... cause I struggle to get 25mpg

[Kansei]

With an automatic 25 isn't that bad unless it's all highway cruising at 70 with windows closed and no air conditioning on. The original poster was getting like 16mpg on a non-turbo, manual transmission Protege5

[GMalatrasi]

I drive really short distances and go through lots of stop lights, it's really hard to get better than 21-23mpg. When I drive on the highway though, I normally get about 25-26mpg.

[newprot5fan]

I don't know of a single person who has used the ZFR5F-11 and had problems. I know at least a dozen people who use them and swear by them, including Protege FAQ guru TheMAN, the guy who originally broached the topic of the ZFRs on here.

OK Kansei, you convinced me:P

So just to be safe, I am going to use 89 octane. Now, if I put these long reach ones in, and "pinging" happens, do I just take them out and put the regular V-powers in? How bad is PINGING for your car and will I notcie it with the windows up?

ANything else I should know before picking these puppies up? I am new with cars mind you....SHould they be speicifially torqued or just tightened?

I am hoping this might help my s**ty gas mileage too....

So I need ZFR5F-11 right? Not the 6F

[clicknext]

I have the long reach plugs and the power is a little bit better I think, but it did nothing to the mileage.

[newprot5fan]

I have the long reach plugs and the power is a little bit better I think, but it did nothing to the mileage.

they didn't worsen your gas mileage did it?

[newprot5fan]

hey all

I know this is a dumb question, but when I change the sparkplugs, how tight do I tighten them? I don;t have a torque wrench or anything like that.....

Is it possible to over tighten them? I am putting in the long reach NGK ZFR5F-11...Keep your fingers crossed I will get an improvement:P (and god, I hope not worse gas mileage!)

Thanks! OH, and what is this anti-seize stuff I have been hearing about? Should I use that too?

[Kansei]

I've never used anti-seize on the plugs for this car, but yeah some people do I guess?

As for how far to tighten them, it says right on the box. We have an aluminum head so you basically just hand tighten them and just go a little bit farther (1/16th of a turn or so) with a wrench handle on the extension. To do the plugs on this car, since you haven't before, you need a spark plug socket with the rubber insert to get the stock plugs out, they are very deep in the holes. You also will of course need a decently long extension that fits on your spark plug socket.

[Weborific]

OK, I received the new V-Power plugs you've suggested and will be installing them this Saturday. As usual, I'll be posting results (initial and after a week or so). Thanks for all the help!
I love you.
(oh crap, that was weird!)

[Mr.Ames]

ctt 1982, do u have any mods? how many km on ur car? i'm lucky to get 400km/tank in grande prairie, and i drive probably the same as you and i have 111,000km on my car

[GMalatrasi]

lol

[newprot5fan]

one more question with these long reach spark plugs...
Do you gap them the same as the normal plugs (.044")? these are the ZFR5F-11 plugs...
thanks!

[Kansei]

The "11" in the part number means 1.1mm gap, which is normal. I'd say you should probably make sure the gauge is correct on the plugs before you put them in, but I usually can't find my gap measurer so I don't bother haha

[Chicoloco]

Ok, filled the tank. Resulted in 308.5 (kms/miles?) on the tripmeter when the gas light turned on.

Note: The gas needle on the First Half goes down slowly, but after the half it goes down faster.

Oh the first half i was on highways, second half of the tank i was on stop-and-go city traffic. I had the A/C always on.

80F +degrees everyday.

[newprot5fan]

I've never used anti-seize on the plugs for this car, but yeah some people do I guess?

As for how far to tighten them, it says right on the box. We have an aluminum head so you basically just hand tighten them and just go a little bit farther (1/16th of a turn or so) with a wrench handle on the extension. To do the plugs on this car, since you haven't before, you need a spark plug socket with the rubber insert to get the stock plugs out, they are very deep in the holes. You also will of course need a decently long extension that fits on your spark plug socket.

Hmmm....What is this rubber insert that I need?

[Kansei]

Hmmm....What is this rubber insert that I need?

it sits up inside the spark plug socket so that it grabs onto the white part of the plug as you pull it out. Since the plugs are so deep in our engines are are vertical, it's the only easy way to pull them out. Any auto parts store or like a Sears Hardware store should carry them (there are different sizes). Not exactly sure on the size we use, but I do know that most spark plug socket sets sold in the states are imperial but our plugs are actually metric.. but it's some size in millimetres that it nearly a dead on conversion to inches.

[chuyler1]

Miles/Kms per tank is a useless stat. Please calculate your mpg properly. Run until empty. Fill the tank up completely (2nd time pump shuts off). Reset your trip. Run to empty and fill up again. write down trip mileage and number of gallons put in the car. Divide miles by gallons to get immediate results. For more accurate results repeat the process several times and sum gallons, sum mileage, and divide. On my P5 I usually get 28-31 mpg but it has slipped a little toward the low end now that the car has 76K miles on it. My MS6 gets 19-20 thus far, woohoo.

[Chicoloco]

Can't i just divide what i obtained and divide it with the capacity of the tank?

Like 308.5/14.5 = 21.28 mpg? wow that suks. I accelerate pretty hard from stops many times and sometimes floor it. Oh and I'm a salesman, so i do a lot of stop and go traffic in the city.

[chuyler1]

Unless you run to empty...NO. When you fill up, most of the time there is at least 1-2 gallons left in the tank...even when the warning light is on.

You need to divide by the number of gallons you used to drive that distance. You will only know that by filling to the brim once, and then filling to the brim again and writing down the number of gallons you put in the tank.

[newprot5fan]

it sits up inside the spark plug socket so that it grabs onto the white part of the plug as you pull it out. Since the plugs are so deep in our engines are are vertical, it's the only easy way to pull them out. Any auto parts store or like a Sears Hardware store should carry them (there are different sizes). Not exactly sure on the size we use, but I do know that most spark plug socket sets sold in the states are imperial but our plugs are actually metric.. but it's some size in millimetres that it nearly a dead on conversion to inches.

OK....

So just out of curiousity, how hard is it to take off the rubber caps to the spark plugs on numbers 1 and 3 (# 2 and 4 don;t have that rubber cap)??? Since I have never done this before, I don;t want to use too much force to yank them off but they sure as hell won;t come off easy. Do I just rip them off no matter how hard it is?

[Chicoloco]

ooh ok that's true! Thosw couple of gallons do make a difference. i just divided again with 2 gallons less 12.5 and it makes 25 so yeah i need to do that.

[Kansei]

OK....

So just out of curiousity, how hard is it to take off the rubber caps to the spark plugs on numbers 1 and 3 (# 2 and 4 don;t have that rubber cap)??? Since I have never done this before, I don;t want to use too much force to yank them off but they sure as hell won;t come off easy. Do I just rip them off no matter how hard it is?

yeah just give them a good yank. if there wasn't any dielectric grease on them they can be really tough to get off.

[Tasty]

Miles/Kms per tank is a useless stat. Please calculate your mpg properly. Run until empty. Fill the tank up completely (2nd time pump shuts off). Reset your trip. Run to empty and fill up again. write down trip mileage and number of gallons put in the car. Divide miles by gallons to get immediate results. For more accurate results repeat the process several times and sum gallons, sum mileage, and divide. On my P5 I usually get 28-31 mpg but it has slipped a little toward the low end now that the car has 76K miles on it. My MS6 gets 19-20 thus far, woohoo.

What? No. You fill up, reset the trip meter. Next time you fill up, write down what's on the trip meter, then divide that by the # of gallons you pump in. There's no need to fill up twice, add, divide by pi, and wait for the moon to line up with Europa. This method will give you pretty damn accurate mpg, and it's the way people have been doing it for eons.

I really don't get all the whining in this thread anyway. Our cars were only EPA rated at 25city/31hwy mpg. If you're in that range then you're pretty much on. I get 31.2 in mixed driving. That's solid the last 3 times I've calculated it.

[chuyler1]

You have to fill up completely before attempting to track mileage (that's once) and then you have to fill up again after you have tracked mileage (that's twice) to find out how many gallons you used since your last fill-up. You can call it whatever you want but you have to start with a full tank, drive, then fill it up again.

I also recommend running until the light comes on or at least 1/4 tank. You will find you get better mileage on your second half of tank than your first (most likely due to weight).

[Tasty]

You have to fill up completely before attempting to track mileage (that's once) and then you have to fill up again after you have tracked mileage (that's twice) to find out how many gallons you used since your last fill-up. You can call it whatever you want but you have to start with a full tank, drive, then fill it up again.

I also recommend running until the light comes on or at least 1/4 tank. You will find you get better mileage on your second half of tank than your first (most likely due to weight).

I think you're saying what I'm saying, but in a different way? (dunno)

[newprot5fan]

yeah just give them a good yank. if there wasn't any dielectric grease on them they can be really tough to get off.

well, changed the plugs! My first ever repair or work on my car!

The plugs in there were Bosch with the 4 prongs...they looked black (like soot)

So if the car starts, then I did it right??? It felt some went in better than the others, so I just want to be sure they are good.

I have a question though. When you look up in the end of the rubber plugs, there looks like there is a place for the end of the spark plug to go. But how can it reach the plug? I think the plugs are too deep. That probbaly sounds like a very dumb question, but I am just wondering if the rubber caps just cover the spark plug hole or if they are supposed to make contact witht he plug.

thanks for the help!

[newprot5fan]

WEll, had the car out for a run. There doesn;t seem to be any sudden acceleration spots..meaning it seems more smooth accelerating (but also feels a bit weaker) and the idle seems smoother.

Still bucks in reverse and 1st gear. Hard to say if it actually improved.

Is there any chance that I didn;t screw some of them all the way in (maybe crossthreaded?) I don;t think that is the case, but it sure felt like some went in more than others. BUt the car runs fine..no weird sounds..etc...I guess now I am just being paranoid.

When I did pull off the first boot, there was a wire that seemed to pull out of the rubber top. I looked at the other rubber top and the tip of this wire was in the rubber cap, so all I did was push the wire back into the cap until it seemed flush. Did I break anything? If I did, would the car run?

thanks

[JoshP5]

I really don't get all the whining in this thread anyway. Our cars were only EPA rated at 25city/31hwy mpg. If you're in that range then you're pretty much on. I get 31.2 in mixed driving. That's solid the last 3 times I've calculated it.

You'd whine too if your mom's SUV was getting better mileage than your P5.

[chuyler1]

My P5 bucked in 1st and reverse from the day I got it (if you try to drive slowely or idle it while fully in gear). I don't think changing the plugs would fix that. The plugs should help with fuel economy though. You may want to reset your ECU after replacing them though. Then check the mileage to see if it improves.

[P-Funk!]

The bucking is acombination of the slightly warped pressure plate and the soft (broken?) engine mounts.

New motor mounts will help - use the ones for a diesel (Non-US) Familia to have less annoying vibes from the AWR mounts. ;)

[tmamer]

what are the negative impacts of reseting the ecu (if there are any) and if there are none, why wouldn't we all do it, and if we all do it, how often should it be done.

i have to tell you i am a little concerened with what i am reading in the forums about mileage. one of the reasons i bought this car was that the ecu rating was quite reasonable for gas mileage, i have only had my mp5 for 3 days, and have not had a chance to even fill it yet to start to record the economy i am getting, so i guess there is no reason to jump the gun, but if i get lest than 30mpg on the highway, i am going to be severly pissed. my 87 toyota camary that had 360,000 km on it got 29 mpg consistantly on the highway with some city mixed in. ANY stock 4 cyl car that is newer than 2000 should be getting AT LEAST that no? or am i just a naive little newb who bit off more than he can swallow? lol

which brings me to next question: other than resetting the ecu are there any mods to improve fuel economy?

i have been searching the forums for the key words fuel econom y or improve gas mileage, etc. and so far, i have found very little helpful imfo other than reseting the ecu which seems to get mixed reviews as far as economy. ANYone out there get really great economy? if so how are you doing it?

t.

[thrasher]

what are the negative impacts of reseting the ecu (if there are any) and if there are none, why wouldn't we all do it, and if we all do it, how often should it be done.

i have to tell you i am a little concerened with what i am reading in the forums about mileage. one of the reasons i bought this car was that the ecu rating was quite reasonable for gas mileage, i have only had my mp5 for 3 days, and have not had a chance to even fill it yet to start to record the economy i am getting, so i guess there is no reason to jump the gun, but if i get lest than 30mpg on the highway, i am going to be severly pissed. my 87 toyota camary that had 360,000 km on it got 29 mpg consistantly on the highway with some city mixed in. ANY stock 4 cyl car that is newer than 2000 should be getting AT LEAST that no? or am i just a naive little newb who bit off more than he can swallow? lol

which brings me to next question: other than resetting the ecu are there any mods to improve fuel economy?

i have been searching the forums for the key words fuel econom y or improve gas mileage, etc. and so far, i have found very little helpful imfo other than reseting the ecu which seems to get mixed reviews as far as economy. ANYone out there get really great economy? if so how are you doing it?

t.


My fuel economy sucks. Barely 400km / tank.

I think my pre-cat is dying and clogging the actual cat... what a crappy design.

[Mr.Ames]

i get not quite 400km to a tank but i only have a highflow cat

[tmamer]

My fuel economy sucks. Barely 400km / tank.

I think my pre-cat is dying and clogging the actual cat... what a crappy design.


can't you unclog the pre cat?

[delguini]

i get not quite 400km to a tank but i only have a highflow cat

you're saying 400km till the engine light goes on, or 400km's till you're on your last drop and you have to fill up?

[ho bag]

you're saying 400km till the engine light goes on, or 400km's till you're on your last drop and you have to fill up?
400km?? Damm

I did notice that since ther winter gas is gone and regular gas is back im getting alot better millage

im about 550km to a tank in the city

[Mr.Ames]

400 when its past E...if im lucky. lately its been 370-380 ish

[Weborific]

WOW. this post is alive again!! OK, so here's what I've done to date to improve mileage. I went from 16MPG to 19MPG. Not even worth all these mods!!

- replaced PCV valve
- replaced air filter
- used fuel injector cleaner (several times)
- used an oil additive (Xentx)
- oil change
- new spark plugs
- new ignition wires
- new coils
- installed a grounding kit
- checked tire pressure
- ECU reset
- new rotors and checked for dragging brakes
*and I'm sure there's more I'm forgetting!

So after all that, my question is...WTF??!

[Weborific]

BTW, I did notice that on a long trip (about 2 hours of highway with cruise set between 100 and 115 km/hr) my mileage went to 23 mpg. But that's my highest....

[chuyler1]

What year car and how many miles Weborific? Perhaps the cats are clogged.

[Brian MP5T]

I get 20,304,345,234,542.04 nm Per Tank

[P5inder]

My 2005 P5 gave me worst mileage with no cats and a wide open muffler.

The next worst mileage was with both cats.

I am now running only the second cat and the Magnaflow cat-back exhaust.

Yesterday I got 675Km for 53L. Travelling between 80-110KPH, trying to keep the revs near the 2800-3200 RPM mark.

The only time I re-set the ECU was when I put on my custom CAI. Well, and when I forgot to re-connect my EGR sensor (thought it was a misfire code)

[pass the peas]

Wait, I thought fuel consumption was calculated as liters/100km in Canada. 19 mpg would be 12.4 liter/100km, right?

[Weborific]

according to the site below, 12.4 L/100km is 19 MPG.

http://www.convert-me.com/en/convert/fuel

Chuyler1, I own a 2002 automatic P5 with about 96000 km on her. I'm not familiar with all aspects of cars, the least of which are the catalytic converters. Is is a simple check for my mechanic or is there dismantling involved? Pricey to replace? Thanks!

[StealthWyvern]

according to the site below, 12.4 L/100km is 19 MPG.

http://www.convert-me.com/en/convert/fuel

Chuyler1, I own a 2002 automatic P5 with about 96000 km on her. I'm not familiar with all aspects of cars, the least of which are the catalytic converters. Is is a simple check for my mechanic or is there dismantling involved? Pricey to replace? Thanks!

I own a 02 p5 regular auto and I get 24.5-26.5 all the time with over 153k on it. The worst I ever got was 22mpg and best was 27.3!

[P5inder]

according to the site below, 12.4 L/100km is 19 MPG.

http://www.convert-me.com/en/convert/fuel

Chuyler1, I own a 2002 automatic P5 with about 96000 km on her. I'm not familiar with all aspects of cars, the least of which are the catalytic converters. Is is a simple check for my mechanic or is there dismantling involved? Pricey to replace? Thanks!

A Cat cannot be dismantled...well, it can but its no use trying to put it back together. They are not meant for that...

A way you can tell your Cat-converter has gone belly up is when yo start noticing a foul, rotten-egg-like smell from your exhaust. Most mechanics/exhaust shops will visually inspect the cats for free. Visual inspection means looking at the cat's body to ensure there are no dents, shaking it to make sure there is nothing rattling inside...although you'd hear rattling with regular driving...if its the pre-cat, you'd throw a code.

You can get a performance (free-flow) cat for about $100-$200 CDN. Try LORDCO you can get one that'll fit in the exhaust tunnel for about the above noted prices. After that, all you need to do is to have a reputable exhaust place take off your old cat, build you up a nice, larger diameter pipe to go with your larger-diameter free-flow cat and you're done. I'd say about $300-$500 CDN and you've got a nice mid pipe to complement what ever cat-back system you might want to buy later...

If you want to do a nice performance upgrade, get a header, a mid-pipe like the one described above and a nice cat-back system.

Getting rid of the restrictive cats will also net you better mileage...if you can keep your newly discovered heavy right foot off the gas that is...

[Weborific]

You guys are always so damn helpful...THANKS! Money is tight right now, so $300-$500 for anything right now is outta the question. But I'll ask my brother-in-law (a mechanic) what I can do since he's more familiar with her privates than I am!

[StealthWyvern]

I'll ask my brother-in-law what I can do since he's more familiar with her privates than I am!
LMAO

[spacgoste]

What I gather is that with the long reach plug: A. the engine will run more smoothly. B. You can still use reg gas. Is this correct?

[Brian MP5T]

The engine is designed for a long reach plug. It must be used. Period.

[Weborific]

I actually AM using the long reach plugs as recommended on this board....

[cam-shaft]

when you first reset your ecu don't you get bad gas mileage for like the first couple weeks while your computer figures out your mods and driving style. just something i thought i remember reading on the forum here. just this winter i went on a trip and on the way home i got 39 mpg, and yes you read that right and i typed it right. my wife got pissed at me because i wouldnt shut up about how good of gas mileage i got. i run a injen CAI, magnaflow exhaust, and some magnacor wires. nothing special, and i know i did my math correctly.

[Weborific]

Resetting the ECU didn't improve or worsen my mileage. The car would instantly run like a beast for a few days then calm down...

[delguini]

Resetting the ECU didn't improve or worsen my mileage. The car would instantly run like a beast for a few days then calm down...

how's your mileage now?

[Weborific]

Same. around 20 MPG. 21 or 22 if I go on long trips

[chuyler1]

What size/brand tires do you have?

[Weborific]

16" Toyo Proxes 4 in summer, 15" Blizzak Revo 1 in winter......

[chuyler1]

but what size? 195/50R16? 205/50R16? A 205 tire is taller than a 195 and will give you the illusion of getting worse gas mileage but in reality it is because your odometer is off and telling you that you drove fewer miles than you did.

[Weborific]

I don't recall the exact sizes right now but I do know that the speed difference of either tire is at most 2% difference. So if I'd drive 100 miles, maybe I actually drove about 98 or 102 or something like that. Nothing that'll affect MPG in any significant way...

[ho bag]

Well since i lowered my car ive been getting 30mpg and its getting better. Im sure that also has alot to do with the fact that its nicer out.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/noframes/18551.shtml

[tmamer]

Well since i lowered my car ive been getting 30mpg and its getting better. Im sure that also has alot to do with the fact that its nicer out.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/noframes/18551.shtml

[tmamer]

Well since i lowered my car ive been getting 30mpg and its getting better. Im sure that also has alot to do with the fact that its nicer out.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/noframes/18551.shtml

[tmamer]

Well since i lowered my car ive been getting 30mpg and its getting better. Im sure that also has alot to do with the fact that its nicer out.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/noframes/18551.shtml

[Chicoloco]

you posted 3 times o_O

[ho bag]

Lol

[tmamer]

i guess i reaaaalllly want to know... lol

[Mr.Ames]

how low do u want to go? i just did my car, 200 for the RB springs, 400 for the tokico blue's, and somewhere around 300ish for all 4 mounts and endlinks. I can fit 1 finger between the rear tire and fender, stock was almost 4 fingers LOL its tight now