What Car to Build??

[Moonman8]

Ok, well I'll be a college graduate come December and I will finally have a cash flow higher than that of a starving college student.

I really want to find a junker for a full teardown and rebuild but I haven't 100% set my sights on any one car yet.

So I'm asking the members with experience with cars other than the Protege greater than my own to give some insight.

I've set my spending limit on the car itself to be no higher than $3,000 but I hope to find something in the $2,000 area. I know this limits my selection but I'm not looking for a pristine, low-mileage car, either.

Preferences: 4-cylinder, rear-wheel drive, lightweight, decent baseline power/torque, parts readily available, decent looks with the right treatment. The car would ultimately be a track-type car but still take me to work a couple of days a week. Don't care about mileage or aesthetic condition, just a straight chassis with no rust.

Plans: full teardown (engine, interior, body panels, suspension, etc). Fully-built engine, probably turbo but that will depend on the car chosen. Stripped interior with race buckets, harnesses, little or no audio. Upgraded suspension that is tight but borderline streetable. I think you get the idea.

So far I've been looking at these cars:
1990-1997 Mazda Miata (I would prefer 94-97 for the 1.8 engine but I could always do a swap)

1985-1986 Toyota Corolla GT-S (I know it's hard to find, but I like them and their cheap)

Nissan 240SX (not the lightest but damn their pretty and parts are all over the place...but the SR20DET swap might be a little too much $$ for this build)

Nissan Sentra SE-R (the early-to-mid 90's model, not the bubbly piece of shit that came out in 98-99 or so...but it's not RWD so not quite sure)

1st Gen Protege (some aftermarket parts available, cheap, easy to find, but FWD)


So please post up your input. Add or delete cars from my list and tell me what's good or bad about each platform. Many thanks to those with a greater knowledge than I!

[JOMO]

Sentra or 240. I remember though someone telling me that the early gen sentra's had major tranny problems though. But those 2 would be my choice. I would prob end up with the 240.

[Moonman8]

Sentra or 240. I remember though someone telling me that the early gen sentra's had major tranny problems though. But those 2 would be my choice. I would prob end up with the 240.

I've been trying to find 240's in my area and the few that I've found (only 4-5 within 300 miles) are either modified to all hell in a way that I would never do it, or they are asking way too much money for them because the seller knows they are hot right now.

Thanks for the heads up about the early Sentra transmissions. I've never owned a Nissan so there is a bit of a learning curve in that department.

[jred321]

I remember though someone telling me that the early gen sentra's had major tranny problems though.i wouldn't call them major, but they do have issues. mostly it's gear popout i think

if you really want a project, rwd, 4 cyl, http://www.meyersmanx.com/ would be sweet. you could either do a new one (take an old vw frame and get all parts) or get a used one that's already done and tear it apart and redo it (they've been making them for decades so they're not terribly hard to find).

[Moonman8]

if you really want a project, rwd, 4 cyl, http://www.meyersmanx.com/ would be sweet. you could either do a new one (take an old vw frame and get all parts) or get a used one that's already done and tear it apart and redo it (they've been making them for decades so they're not terribly hard to find).

I've seen those before...are they even street legal? I'd like my car to be able to take me to work a few days a week and/or Sunday cruises.

[GhostMercury]

na what i would do is get a rx7 and put a v8 in it..cause they have kits to do so

[freekwonder]

Im a little sided but I say Datsun 510.

Light from the factory and can be made to be lighter.
RWD
MANY parts from other nissan swap over with little to minimal work. (I have 280zx brakes getting ready to go on mine, 280zx front struts with coil overs, and 240sx camber plates.
personaly a great looking car.
Racing history (just look up BRE racing '71 and '72)
MANY motor options. L20 drops in and with side drafts is awsome
or with little work you can get SR20, KA24DE, VG30E, VG30ET, VG30DE. S2000 motor.

[Moonman8]

na what i would do is get a rx7 and put a v8 in it..cause they have kits to do so

Sinners!!

Yeah, I've seen the articles and such about LS1-powered FD's and from what I've read, there isn't any advantage to the swap. The crate motor/parts would cost the same as building a 13B to put out the same power if not more. I don't know, it just doesn't seem right to me.

[seanmcsean]

Myers Manx are so much fun, it should be illegal.. I'm with jared on this one.

[Moonman8]

Im a little sided but I say Datsun 510.

Light from the factory and can be made to be lighter.
RWD
MANY parts from other nissan swap over with little to minimal work. (I have 280zx brakes getting ready to go on mine, 280zx front struts with coil overs, and 240sx camber plates.
personaly a great looking car.
Racing history (just look up BRE racing '71 and '72)
MANY motor options. L20 drops in and with side drafts is awsome
or with little work you can get SR20, KA24DE, VG30E, VG30ET, VG30DE. S2000 motor.

I love the look of the Dime. Finding one without rust in decent order might be a bit tough. Maybe it would be worth the wait and hunting time, though. I've seen several restored/fully-built 510's in magazines recently and they are awe-inspiring with ultra-clean engine compartments and simple, functional interiors/exteriors. I love vintage racers, too (I am glued to Speed channel during the Monterey Historics races at Laguna Seca). I'd have to do some research into how much dropping one of your mentioned motors into the car would be. How much would I expect to pay for a fair-ordered 510?

Lets not forget they are manufactured pre-1974, so emissions exempt!!!

[jmv]

you should try to find an old 323 gtx!!! that would be a fun project car for sure.

[Moonman8]

you should try to find an old 323 gtx!!! that would be a fun project car for sure.

I've found searching for specific models (especially those I know little about) can be difficult. What parameters would I search for when looking for a GTX (what years, trim, etc.)? I only ask because when searching for Corolla GT-S's, I've found that most people like to call them SR5's and it was hard to filter out the shitty FWD, automatic granny Corollas.

[freekwonder]

I love the look of the Dime. Finding one without rust in decent order might be a bit tough. Maybe it would be worth the wait and hunting time, though. I've seen several restored/fully-built 510's in magazines recently and they are awe-inspiring with ultra-clean engine compartments and simple, functional interiors/exteriors. I love vintage racers, too (I am glued to Speed channel during the Monterey Historics races at Laguna Seca). I'd have to do some research into how much dropping one of your mentioned motors into the car would be. How much would I expect to pay for a fair-ordered 510?

Lets not forget they are manufactured pre-1974, so emissions exempt!!!
ya finding one with out rust is a bit dificult. sadly a great running little to no ruster is going to be a bit higher then 3,000. more around 4-5,000. you can find a non runner little ruster for 2,000 and cheaper probably. I think prices have changed since I bought mine.

depending on which motor you want it depends. the cars came with an l16 (1.6 liter), if you want to drop in the l20 (2 liter) its pretty damn easy. as for the sr or ka. they are the exact same to drop in, a company down under sales a SWEET, but expensive swap kit, but its also as easy as flipping the cross member, new sway bar, tranny mount, motor mount and drive shaft. The SR does need a top manifold. if you are interested here a couple websites for someinfo.

Datsun510.com (http://datsun510.com/)
Engloid's VG30 Tips (http://mywebpages.comcast.net/engloid/vg30tips/vg30tips.html)
View topic - 5 lug :: The 510 Realm :: Datsun PL510 Resource :: 510 Club of BC (http://www.the510realm.com/PNphpBB2-viewtopic-t-1415-highlight-z32.html)
Experimental Engineering - www.VG30.com - State of the Art Performance for your Vintage Datsun (http://www.vg30.com/)
http://dimequarterly.tierranet.com/

[jersey_emt]

1st gen Miata sounds like its the perfect choice for you.

Lightweight.
4-cyl.
RWD.
Plenty of aftermarket parts available.
Cheap.
Fun!

[Moonman8]

Thanks for those Datsun links. I'll definitely be looking over those thoroughly.

Jersey - yeah, I've been looking over the Miata possibility with a little more favor than the others for the exact reasons you just listed. Also been picking through Flyin' Miata's website, too (seem like great people and they're pretty close to here...about a 4-5 hour drive). However, it seems like those who have them don't want to get rid of them and those who are selling know what they have and are asking a little more than I would want them to. I'll be looking a little more seriously when I actually have money in my hand and making phone calls is more warranted.

Right now I just want to hear what you guys have to say so I can set my heart on something so I can dive right in and go after it when the money finds its way into my billfold.

[jred321]

I've seen those before...are they even street legal? I'd like my car to be able to take me to work a few days a week and/or Sunday cruises.they most certainly are :) there's no reason you couldn't take it to work. it uses an old beetle engine/frame. or, if you want to get crazy, you can swap a subaru engine in it (including the wrx).

[03Mazdarati]

E30!!!!(peep)

[Moonman8]

bump for the evening crowd and more opinions/testimonials!!

Good stuff guys, thanks to those who have posted so far.

[kcbhiw]

Miata, E30 (325i), MR2 - in that order.

[early 70's] 510's are sweet, but good luck finding one that is either inexpensive or in workable shape, especialy a two door.

The drifters are driving the price of 240's and RWD corollas through the roof.

Maybe even an old Foxbody mustang or Merkur XR4Ti? They're cheap and power can be had very inexpensively.

[Moonman8]

Miata, E30 (325i), MR2 - in that order.

[early 70's] 510's are sweet, but good luck finding one that is either inexpensive or in workable shape, especialy a two door.

Maybe even an old Foxbody mustang or Merkur XR4Ti? They're cheap and power can be had very inexpensively.

What year E30 would fit in my price range if any? I've heard a few people say they are pretty easy to work on but what about the costs and availability of parts?

MR2's are pretty sweet but that cramped engine compartment in the back makes me cringe when I think about getting a wrench in there. Lots of power capability I would imagine, especially with the older turbos. Mid-engine would be pretty cool too.

Foxbody Mustang? Not too bad but not quite my thing. My brother (urban-cowboy type) dreamt of having a early 90's LX 5.0 but settled on a 91 Camaro RS (5.0L, 5-speed, and f*ing fast) and to this day that was his favorite car he has owned (currently drives a police car...yes he is the PoPo...and a 2000 Ford F250).

[freekwonder]

Miata, E30 (325i), MR2 - in that order.

[early 70's] 510's are sweet, but good luck finding one that is either inexpensive or in workable shape, especialy a two door.

The drifters are driving the price of 240's and RWD corollas through the roof.

Maybe even an old Foxbody mustang or Merkur XR4Ti? They're cheap and power can be had very inexpensively.
Whats your definition of workable shape and inexpensive. for 5,000 I can find a 95% rust free, daily drivable 510. Its a four door, but I got my first dime for $1000, it had minimum rust and a one dent, and I drove it on the freeway at 80mph everday with no problems. you could do the same with a 2 door for maybe 1 or 2 thousand more.

[evilmonkeyMSP]

86-92 FC RX7...leave the 13b...v8s are sacrelidge!!! lol

[MiaTurbo]

FB, or NA6 plenty of aftermarket stuff, and they are both Mazduhs, since this is a Mazduh forum :p

[B1GHAM]

hmmm Miata sounds EXACTLY what youre looking for.

I would love to do an E30 M3 myself..... but you wont find one for like 3k.

Im tearing down my MSP and building that up (I know its not that old, but its fun for me). Im then rebuilding either a 94 or 95 3000GT VR4 (not around 3k, well maybe depending Ill have to go look) for my dad.... Then comes my large project which consists of rebuilding/restoring a BMW 850CSi (If I can ever friggin find one!!) but thats going to be a challenge, or a mid 90s Supra, but I dont know if I want a tuning whore (yeah 850 whp is ALWAYS fun, but do I want to do THAT much custom fab/tuning?)

My vote goes for the Miata, or the 240sx.

If youre decent with engines, then Id say tackle a rotary...

Ill have more Ideas for you tonight... youve actually gotten me thinkin (glare) and thats never a good thing lol

Sean

[Shift_Lost]

How about, an 88 celica alltrac, Awd + turbo, they come in the 2500 range, really good car for a project.

3s-gte is a beast when built, Its what TOP SECRET used in they're first supra

[Moonman8]

How about, an 88 celica alltrac, Awd + turbo, they come in the 2500 range, really good car for a project.

3s-gte is a beast when built, Its what TOP SECRET used in they're first supra

I remember that TOP SECRET Supra. ~700whp built for top speed thus a 4-cyl mounted as close to the firewall as possible rather than that hefty 2JZ.

I was kinda looking at Celicas but FWD or AWD isn't really what I want, RWD would be ideal.

[Moonman8]

hmmm Miata sounds EXACTLY what youre looking for.

I would love to do an E30 M3 myself..... but you wont find one for like 3k.

Im tearing down my MSP and building that up (I know its not that old, but its fun for me). Im then rebuilding either a 94 or 95 3000GT VR4 (not around 3k, well maybe depending Ill have to go look) for my dad.... Then comes my large project which consists of rebuilding/restoring a BMW 850CSi (If I can ever friggin find one!!) but thats going to be a challenge, or a mid 90s Supra, but I dont know if I want a tuning whore (yeah 850 whp is ALWAYS fun, but do I want to do THAT much custom fab/tuning?)

My vote goes for the Miata, or the 240sx.

If youre decent with engines, then Id say tackle a rotary...

Ill have more Ideas for you tonight... youve actually gotten me thinkin (glare) and thats never a good thing lol

Sean

Sounds like you have a lot on your plate. A BMW 850 would be nice but way too much $$ and hard to find parts much less the car itself like you said. I love Supras and their power potential but built wrong they are just dyno queens. However, there a few guys in Houston that drive their 1000+ whp whale-tail clad monsters daily.

I'm leaning more and more towards a Miata. I took my puppy for a walk and I saw a white 92-93 in almost perfect condition sitting in a driveway (unfortunately not for sale) and....yeah, I want one. Just have to find one.

[B1GHAM]

Sounds like you have a lot on your plate. A BMW 850 would be nice but way too much $$ and hard to find parts much less the car itself like you said. I love Supras and their power potential but built wrong they are just dyno queens. However, there a few guys in Houston that drive their 1000+ whp whale-tail clad monsters daily.

I'm leaning more and more towards a Miata. I took my puppy for a walk and I saw a white 92-93 in almost perfect condition sitting in a driveway (unfortunately not for sale) and....yeah, I want one. Just have to find one.

LOL!! Realize these are projects I have thought out way ahead of time, not something Im doing tomorrow.. Later when Im more established and comfortable.

Sean

[Moonman8]

any more thoughts?

[Run for Cover]

from what year to what year miata is the first gen or the gen your looking for?

[BradC]

Miata, 510, Toyota 2000GT (if you could find one cheap!!)

[Moonman8]

from what year to what year miata is the first gen or the gen your looking for?

I believe the first gens were from 1990-1997 (in terms of body), but some considered the first generation to be split because of the engine change. The 1990-1993's had the 1.6L while the 1994-1997 (and beyond) had the more powerful, slightly more reliable 1.8L.

In terms of preference, I would like any first gen. The 1.8L engine would be preferred but it can be swapped into the earlier models pretty easily but I would rather avoid the swap cost.

[MP3Architect]

early miatas would be cool. make it liek a go kart form hell.....i like the old celicas but like you said....not rwd.

[Captain KRM P5]

you should try to find an old 323 gtx!!! that would be a fun project car for sure.

i look at this site once a week :) http://www.sturtevant.com/323GTX/forsale.htm

[MP3N.Y.C]

So far I've been looking at these cars:
1990-1997 Mazda Miata (I would prefer 94-97 for the 1.8 engine but I could always do a swap)

I would go for the miata. Scrap the 4 banger and drop in a 5.0 or 5.8 with a t-5. That would be the ultimate track car and a fun car to drive to work during the week. Roll up next to a riced out civic or WRX and blow the doors off it. Thats my suggestion.. I would like to do one of those cars myself one day.

Pete