New Dyno Numbers as Promised

[122 Vega]

This is in full legal STX trim, no boost controller.

Mods are: K&N Panel Filter, NGK 6097 plugs, Full Corksport 2.4" Turbo Back Exhaust (S/J, Vibrant High Flow Cat), Split Second DSM AFC2 w Super Map, RR-Racing Light Crank Pulley...that's it.

Numbers are: 188 whp/196 ftlbs tq

STX Subarus beware!

I am getting some pretty severe detonation above 5500 rpm, AFR is staying at 11.8 so I may need to riched it up or play with different gas/spark plugs.

A few engine mods left to do, plus some AFC tuning...

I hoped in my other thread for 180/190, so I am vey happy already, but there is more left in there I know.

Britt

[Fudgie]

How much boost?

[122 Vega]

Peaks at 8.1 from about 3500-4500 then tapers down to 7.2 at redline

Britt

[Fudgie]

Great numbers! How are you determining that you are detonating? Can you hear it?

[low_psi]

Good numbers, are they from a DynoJet?

[503MSP]

hey britt, so are you still running the stock smic too? or can you upgrade and still be in the stx regulations

[02PROTEGE2.0]

props... i really need to go turbo... =(

[low_psi]

hey britt, so are you still running the stock smic too? or can you upgrade and still be in the stx regulations

can't upgrade in STX.

[122 Vega]

Yeah, I'll post a shot video clip from my first run, you can hear the detonation from accross the shop!

This was done on a new Dynojet 248

[BlkZoomZoom]

Nice numbers!
Detonation is nothing to take lightly, even if you don't melt a piston you are putting alot more stress on the puny rods.
You could sneak around the stx rule by doing what I did for an intercooler. I took a custommsp's smic, bondo'd the top and bottom tanks to take the shape of stock, then painted it black. I had to point it out to fellow Msp owners because they all thought it was the stock unit.

[Earful]

Luv u man.....! awesome pulls......that should be very nice out on the Auto-x track!

[503MSP]

damn now i want to build my car like yours, to bad i'm a broke ass.

[122 Vega]

The engine mods are few and were pretty cheap. My exhaust will be for sale here pretty soon. The AFC was only @$350 the filter was $36, plugs @$10, pulley was @$100. The exhaust was $350, S/J $249, Cat $100.

So, about $1200 and almost 200 hp.

Britt

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

The engine mods are few and were pretty cheap. My exhaust will be for sale here pretty soon. The AFC was only @$350 the filter was $36, plugs @$10, pulley was @$100. The exhaust was $350, S/J $249, Cat $100.

So, about $1200 and almost 200 hp.

Britt
Britt,
Are AFC's allowed in STX? If so when did they allow it.

BTW I just bought some extra ZFR7F-11's if you are interested.

[122 Vega]

AFCs have been allowed since STX was started, I can add any controller that modifies signals coming from sensors.

The ZFR7F-11's is the #6097 with a wider gap.

Britt

[Drumfreak]

So you are telling me at 7 lbs you are detonating a lot. and with your mods? That scares the hell out of me. I'm pushing anywhere from 8 to as much as 9.5 lbs at the most and only in 4th gear. Not to mention my spike can be as high as 12 lbs sometimes. My plugs still look really good though. What do you think your biggest reason for detonating is? Plugs? Possibly bad gas? Please elaborate. What does detonation sound like? Sorry for all the questions but I just wanna keep my motor on the safe side.

[503MSP]

hey let me know when you are going to sell your exhaust, i'm interested in it, but if i buy anything it prob wont be til the new year since I have to get my car through DEQ here in march. I dont want to go through the hassle of putting the exhaust on and taking it off and putting it back on.

[jflo]

wow, very nice numbers. i'm wondering if i'm detonating, too...post that vid so i can hear what it actually sounds like. i don't think my motor is detonating, but i pretty much have the same mods as you do plus injen intake (probably doesn't do much tho) and minus the pulley and filter

[122 Vega]

I try to get the video up, but just imagine somone pouring a bunch of gravel in to your valvetrain at 5500rpm.

I'm leaning towards bad gas. And I'm actually detonating at less than 7psi, it holds at 8.1 up until about 5000 then starts bleeding off down to about 5 psi until 6000 rpm.

britt

[Drumfreak]

I try to get the video up, but just imagine somone pouring a bunch of gravel in to your valvetrain at 5500rpm.

I'm leaning towards bad gas. And I'm actually detonating at less than 7psi, it holds at 8.1 up until about 5000 then starts bleeding off down to about 5 psi until 6000 rpm.

britt

That has to be bad gas. Or maybe plugs but I don't know much about plugs as far as gaps go and what not. My buddies fully built MSP was detonating at anything more than 12 lbs at his first tune. After spending over 500 on the tune they told him it might be bad gas. So he burned through a few tanks over a couple months then came back and was able to run 17 lbs and achieve 300 hp (Dyno Dynamics dyno) with no detonating. All because of bad gas but worth the time and money. Also if you are running 11.8 AF in the high revs and only at 6 lbs isn't that a little lean for that amount of boost? I dynoed recently and at 7 psi my AF never went above 10.8 so i figured I had a psi or two to play with. Maybe get that AFC tuned which I'm sure you have thought of.

[122 Vega]

That has to be bad gas. Or maybe plugs but I don't know much about plugs as far as gaps go and what not. My buddies fully built MSP was detonating at anything more than 12 lbs at his first tune. After spending over 500 on the tune they told him it might be bad gas. So he burned through a few tanks over a couple months then came back and was able to run 17 lbs and achieve 300 hp (Dyno Dynamics dyno) with no detonating. All because of bad gas but worth the time and money. Also if you are running 11.8 AF in the high revs and only at 6 lbs isn't that a little lean for that amount of boost? I dynoed recently and at 7 psi my AF never went above 10.8 so i figured I had a psi or two to play with. Maybe get that AFC tuned which I'm sure you have thought of.

I may try richening it up just a bit on the top end just to be safe, especially since at the track I'll be full boost in 4th and 5th gears on the straights.

Here's the video from the dyno :

http://s110.photobucket.com/albums/n114/122Vega/?action=view&current=dynorun1small.flv


starts detonating about 25 seconds into the video

Britt

[122 Vega]

Sorry, it was shot on my digital camera, i didn't have my camcorder with me

Audio isn't that good

[69RMSP]

Any way of telling if your car detonating without a dyno :/

[122 Vega]

JS Safegaurd or sometimes you can hear it, if you can it's BAD!

Britt

[Drumfreak]

Audio isn't that bad but it's hard to hear the actual motor over the corksport exhaust and the rollers. I couldn't hear any detonation but I don't know what to listen for.

[Drumfreak]

Any way of telling if your car detonating without a dyno :/

Take out your spark plugs and look at them. It there is a white tip or white spots then that is a sign of detonation.

[Drumfreak]

JS Safegaurd or sometimes you can hear it, if you can it's BAD!

Britt

Britt, have you checked your plugs at all since you have heard it detonating?

[Kansei]

wow good numbers! my 160whp goal on basically an msp turbo kit doesn't sound too difficult now :D

[122 Vega]

Haven't checked my plugs since, I've put on over 100 miles since, so I won't see much on the plugs unless I actually damaged one of them

[Drumfreak]

Haven't checked my plugs since, I've put on over 100 miles since, so I won't see much on the plugs unless I actually damaged one of them
Right on. Mine looked very healthy but that doesn't mean I'm safe completely. I just set an appt with a local dyno for Monday. So I will know soon if my car will explode or not.

[69RMSP]

Thanks so much guys, im changing my plugs soon cause im at 55k. any suggestions? btw im at 7.8psi /w no boost controller

[Drumfreak]

Thanks so much guys, im changing my plugs soon cause im at 55k. any suggestions? btw im at 7.8psi /w no boost controller

NGK 7FR 11's or something. That's what I have.

[Kansei]

NGK 7FR 11's or something. That's what I have.

ZFR7F-11 you mean?

I run the ZFR5F-11 (naturally aspirated for now here), so I'm guessing that's the one you are talking about. It's a nice long reach copper plug, definitely a great plug in our cars it seems.

[Drumfreak]

ZFR7F-11 you mean?

I run the ZFR5F-11 (naturally aspirated for now here), so I'm guessing that's the one you are talking about. It's a nice long reach copper plug, definitely a great plug in our cars it seems.
Yes, those are the ones.

[122 Vega]

The -11 are gapped wide, at your boost the -8 would be better, and most Napas stock the -8 under part # NGK 6097. Or you can order the -11s then close the gap

Britt

[122 Vega]

Chris, what's up with the "22v Protege 5" thing?

Also consider that the long reach plug will up your compression, maybe 0.1 or so, but the colder heat range will kill your gas mileage.


Britt

[Kansei]

Chris, what's up with the "22v Protege 5" thing?

Also consider that the long reach plug will up your compression, maybe 0.1 or so, but the colder heat range will kill your gas mileage.


Britt

22V is Sunlight Silver Metallic :) My gas mileage went down the tubes when the guy at the auto parts store gave me ZFR6F-11 when I asked for ZFR5F-11. Good thing plugs are cheap.

[122 Vega]

I thought you were contemplating an Audi 5cyl swap or something outrageous like that...

[Blackrose]

Im at 5 PSI on a GT30/40r with a 11 afr and i have had only very little Detonation registered by the J and S.

[ND4MSP]

Nice numbers. That really gives me hope, as I don't plan on too many engine mods. I just have a mam midpipe, afc, and green filter for now. Its kinda cool that nobody is spazzing out over the crank pulley in this post. Because it seems like a nice mod for the money. I'm just too hesitant to buy one because of all the reading on the forum. Did you notice any gains/difference with the crank pulley?

[69RMSP]

I highly suggest changing that IC because how bad the stock IC is...

[low_psi]

I highly suggest changing that IC because how bad the stock IC is...

He can't change the intercooler and stay within class regulations.

[MSP032879]

I highly suggest changing that IC because how bad the stock IC is...
How much better would the perfomance be. I already know that the stock SMIC crappy. Is their really a way to get better perfomance out of the stock one? Any ideas on a good SMIC?

[69RMSP]

http://mazda3online.web.aplus.net/product_info.php?cPath=21_32_169&products_id=438 Best upgrade money can buy besdies motor mounts IMO


How much better would the perfomance be. I already know that the stock SMIC crappy. Is their really a way to get better perfomance out of the stock one? Any ideas on a good SMIC?

[503MSP]

http://mazda3online.web.aplus.net/product_info.php?cPath=21_32_169&products_id=438 Best upgrade money can buy besdies motor mounts IMO


that actually will be my next upgrade with the samco hot pipe. after seeing how the mods and tune that britt got just from his mods I think I will be going the same route since my car will be for daily driving and the occasional rally X, if i ever find time to get prepared for any.

[Rally Ninja]

Your gonna Rally X your ride 503? Sweeeeeeeeeet. I was planning on doing it too next season but all my friends are saying its too nice a car to do it with.

[69RMSP]

good good, dont forget motor mounts :P


that actually will be my next upgrade with the samco hot pipe. after seeing how the mods and tune that britt got just from his mods I think I will be going the same route since my car will be for daily driving and the occasional rally X, if i ever find time to get prepared for any.

[503MSP]

good good, dont forget motor mounts :P


opps did i didnt mean really i meant auto X, haha i was kinda drunk last night when I typed that in there. and the motor mounts, i probably wont get until I have to because I really dont like all the vibration that they give off and i dont want to sacrifice my comfort since my car is a daily driver.

[Drumfreak]

The -11 are gapped wide, at your boost the -8 would be better, and most Napas stock the -8 under part # NGK 6097. Or you can order the -11s then close the gap

Britt
I bought those plugs and used them at the dyno today. My boost spiked to 12 when he floored it then stayed at about 9.5 then tapered down to 9 at redline. A tech put his ear on the motor and didn't hear any detonation at all for all 3 pulls (2 in 3rd gear and one in 4th). A/F maxed out around 11.9 at redline. The A/F was under 10 when I hit my big boost spike so that's good. The car ran great. HP was 185.2 and 188 for Torque and the dyno was a Dyno Dynamics dyno which reads pretty low. So would be comfortably over 200 on a Dynojet. Well worth it to ensure my car is safe.

[122 Vega]

503 - saw you this morning on TV Hwy, I was having breakfast at the Blue Moon Diner with my family.

BTW The motor mounts are not that bad, especially after a few hundred miles. Probably the best investment in the car so far.

Britt

[503MSP]

503 - saw you this morning on TV Hwy, I was having breakfast at the Blue Moon Diner with my family.

BTW The motor mounts are not that bad, especially after a few hundred miles. Probably the best investment in the car so far.

Britt

haha koool, yeah I was rushing down to my new house that is being built by witch hazel elementary and then i was rushing to work right after. Which mounts didid you get for you car? and did you ever do that custom intake with the k&n panel filter?

[122 Vega]

I did the intake, i need to finish it and then I'm making a mold of it so it can be one clean piece. Whenever you have time I'll show it to you, it's nothing too special yet, but it sounds cool.

I have the softer AWR mounts, they've been in about 18 months I guess.

Britt

[503MSP]

yeah just pm when u got time, i'll prob be free this weekend after i go to CS to drop some stuff off for travis to look at. oh and i just got my k&n panel filter in too thats kinda why i'm asking since i dont want to spend 200+ on a freakin intake

<~~~~cheap bastard

[DSMConvert]

britt, did you ever get that detonation figured out...kinda curious what is causing it at such a low boost level...im thinking bad gas and/or botched plug also...but let me know...nice numbers at 7psi...