Is Turkey Harmful?

[HeHateMe]

I have heard mixed opinions on what the Turkey sound really is? Is it surge all the way back to the turbo? Or is it just the sound of the Air recirculating back into the intake? Whats the truth?

[icespeed]

My personal opinion, and please correct me if I'm wrong: When you step on the clutch, the pressure charging into the throttle body needs a place to go. The reason for a bov is to release this charged air from the pipes. However, because our turbo's are way on the other side of the engine, there is more distance of piping than a custom aftermarket turbo kit. If the charged air is exhausted into the atmosphere, a "vacuum" is created in the charged end of the pipes. There isn't enough air in the pipes, the engine riches out and stalls. The reason for the bpv on our cars is to send that charged air back through the turbo to help counter-act this "vacuum". "Pressure Surge" is when there is no way of this air to escape and heads back down to the turbo. The reason why this is bad is because the fins on the turbo's blades are designed to move air in one direction, the air moving backwards on it causes problems and eventually causes the intake blade and exhaust blade to snap off (the complete "turbine") of each other (bad boom, turbo done). The "turkey" is actually the charged air running back into the "uncharged" portion of the intake set up, not pressure surge. For ex: I run 10psi of boost. That means that when I step on the clutch, air over a distance of, i don't know, maybe 6 feet (????) with a Dia. of 3" is a volume of close to 42 cubic feet (assuming 6' pipe distance) of "charged air" at 10psi. This volume of air flies through the bpv at a rate greater than that of which the "uncharged" side of the turbo can pull it through. This causes the excess air to blow out of the intake filter as the turbo is trying to "suck" it back in. The reason why aftermarket cai's have a "louder" turkey is because they generally, have a larger dia tube than stock. The air can escape through the air filter faster than stock, and also be sucked back in faster than stock. This (get your minds out of the gutter!!) blowing and sucking causes the resonance of the pipe to create said "turkey".

Hope this helped.

[ChopstickHero]

i still think the turkey sound comes from the location of the BPV outlet on the hot intercooler pipe. if the nipple and BPV were repositioned on the cold intercooler pipe, i don't think it would make that noise. it would still recirculate into the intake tract.

actually, does anybody have this setup on a somewhat stock MSP?

[Notorious]

Compressor Surge is the turkey sounds. Yes it can be harmful for prolonged periods of time and can increase shaft play in the turbo. The surge comes from the throttle body closing and the turbo still spining and compressing more air in the pipes. The air deflects off the throttle body plate. The issue is the stock bpv can't move enough air quick enough to stop the compressor surge. Stock boost its not a big problem, being that the turbo will most likely outlast the car. At higher boost levels 20+ this could become a big problem.

[Notorious]

Going to have to disagree with this one. To prove my theory cap off the pressure signal to the stock bpv and disconnect. No air could move through the BPV. This is easier if you have an aftermarket BOV, you could just tighten it all the way. The turkey will be even louder, careful not to go in too much boost, as it is possible to bust off the stock plastic pipe.


The reason why aftermarket cai's have a "louder" turkey is because they generally, have a larger dia tube than stock. The air can escape through the air filter faster than stock, and also be sucked back in faster than stock. This (get your minds out of the gutter!!) blowing and sucking causes the resonance of the pipe to create said "turkey".

Hope this helped.

[Ryoga28]

Have you searched....? There were a couple of threads that would've answered your questions.

[HeHateMe]

yes i have searched, thats why i asked cuz i never found a answer. I dont think its a problem, but the fact that i have a aftermarket BPV on my hardpipe, it will fow more air after the MAF. SO that might add more air for a few seconds causing a slight leaning out. But that shouldnt be a problem

[Notorious]

The air is already metered, especially if its after the maf. You won't go lean, even if the air exits before the maf its just re-metered and the car runs richer.

[ChopstickHero]

The air is already metered, especially if its after the maf. You won't go lean, even if the air exits before the maf its just re-metered and the car runs richer.

so technically... if a good BPV or recirculated BOV was placed on the cold hardpipe, it could essentially replace the stock BPV?

[Notorious]

That is how my BOV is setup. My BOV is less than 12 inches from the TB.


so technically... if a good BPV or recirculated BOV was placed on the cold hardpipe, it could essentially replace the stock BPV?

[HeHateMe]

same here. Here is a pic when i was venting, and recircing. Sorry bought the crappy pic.

[terbow]

My bpv is on the hot pipe and i have no turkey what so ever. its just a bigger valve.

[Hellnightkid]

i thoughht turkey sound like a BOV...

[terbow]

nah its this obnoxious wobbling sound.

[SpicyMchaggis]

i like to get high and listen to the turkey's call.

[doggman]

hell yeah. i love my turkey. it's so unique. where else does a stock car come with a bpv that so0unds like that. most people who dont know shit about cars are probably baffled and baffooooned when they here a turkey go past them at 40+mph (pending on which "turkey call" i'd like to send them). i dont know boout ya'll but my turkey stays until i need a better boy/bpv.
dats my two cents

take it easy
-dave

[jeffmsp]

with my stock pipes and ic with the forge bov i get a hybrid turk/pssst.

[doggman]

nice, so it's your own take on the turkey, what a pimp dude. i dont get why everyone is all about changing our bpv. that shit is pimp!!! gobble gobble 4 LIFE.....

-=DAVE

[mp5jeff]

Compressor Surge is the turkey sounds. Yes it can be harmful for prolonged periods of time and can increase shaft play in the turbo. The surge comes from the throttle body closing and the turbo still spining and compressing more air in the pipes. The air deflects off the throttle body plate. The issue is the stock bpv can't move enough air quick enough to stop the compressor surge. Stock boost its not a big problem, being that the turbo will most likely outlast the car. At higher boost levels 20+ this could become a big problem.
yep you are right, when the throttle closes, the air has no where to go, which is what a BOV or BPV is there, and if the bov is not sufficient enough to get the air out of the piping asap, it will send it back to the turbo, basically like hitting the brakes on your car, that's what the air does to the turbo's compressor wheel, and intern makes a "turkey" type noise, if you listen to other vehicles with compressor surge it makes the same type of noise, if not exact....if you are getting compressor surge alot, it will hurt the turbo alot faster then if you did not. like nutorious said, at low boost levels it isn't as big an issue as say a supra running 30psi and getting it.

[daedalus]

turkey = teh bad. Compressor surge isnt good no matter what. The sooner you kill the turkey, the more happy your car will be.

[HeHateMe]

It can't be compressor surge. Once a aftermarket CAI is put on, the turkey is the Air venting into the intake and resonating in the pipe. You have air being pulled in by the turbo, then air pushed in its way. I have heard compressor surge on my friends turbo fiero. It sounds like a whoosing not a gobble. How can the air i vent to the intake not be enough, so that the rest of the air travels down the hotpipe through my FMIC back up and to the turbo fins causing backpressure? Like some said maybe under 20psi we would get surge, but then we would here turkey+surge.

[mp5jeff]

It can't be compressor surge. Once a aftermarket CAI is put on, the turkey is the Air venting into the intake and resonating in the pipe. You have air being pulled in by the turbo, then air pushed in its way. I have heard compressor surge on my friends turbo fiero. It sounds like a whoosing not a gobble. How can the air i vent to the intake not be enough, so that the rest of the air travels down the hotpipe through my FMIC back up and to the turbo fins causing backpressure? Like some said maybe under 20psi we would get surge, but then we would here turkey+surge.

??the entire IC/piping system is pressurized....so when the TB closes, where's the air going to go? thats right...back to the turbo, and if your BOV doesn't get all that air in the system out fast enough, it will create compressor surge, just do some research 1st because no offense, but it looks like you don't really know what you are talking about. It doesnt matter what boost you run, you can run 1 psi and get compressor surge, it's when you run alot of boost that's when it really starts to ruin the turbo, why you ask, because more boost = what? more pressure going to the turbo. I have tried to explain this alot on this site, still seems no one wants to agree.

[mp5jeff]

here's an article i found that is a good writte up on compressor surge and the cause
http://www.motorsportsgrenada.com/features/tech/2005/June/article.htm
notice the compressor surge "sounds" as he puts it is a fluttering noise, aka turkey.

[BOOSTR]

Interesting article. With normal driving, this should even be an issue. Only under hard acceleration and shifting do I get the turkey sound. Hopefully the design/features of the turbo will offset any negative effects. I haven't noticed any increase in spool time.

[mp5jeff]

Interesting article. With normal driving, this should even be an issue. Only under hard acceleration and shifting do I get the turkey sound. Hopefully the design/features of the turbo will offset any negative effects. I haven't noticed any increase in spool time.

yea because under acceleration(load), you are creating more boost, intern creating more pressure in the pipes, then more air to go back into the turbo to create surge(if the bov/bpv doesn't get it out).

[daedalus]

??the entire IC/piping system is pressurized....so when the TB closes, where's the air going to go? thats right...back to the turbo, and if your BOV doesn't get all that air in the system out fast enough, it will create compressor surge, just do some research 1st because no offense, but it looks like you don't really know what you are talking about. It doesnt matter what boost you run, you can run 1 psi and get compressor surge, it's when you run alot of boost that's when it really starts to ruin the turbo, why you ask, because more boost = what? more pressure going to the turbo. I have tried to explain this alot on this site, still seems no one wants to agree.


ditto!!!! Someone finally speaks the truth. There is a reason high performance turbo cars dont turkey, ITS BAD.

[HeHateMe]

From the Article..."A compressor bypass valve (CBV) is a vacuum-actuated valve designed to release pressure from the intake tract of a turbocharged car when the throttle closes. It re-circulates the air back into the intake before the turbo inlet, but after the airflow sensor.

(This is whats on our cars)


The reason why most turbocharged cars have a CBV is that when the throttle closes and the intake system is under pressure, the high-pressure air entering the motor will bump into the closed throttle plate, and in the absence of a CBV, a pressure wave will travel back to the turbocharger. The result is that the compressor wheel will stall a phenomenon known as “compressor surge” and slow down very quickly. This is hard on the bearings and decreases the turbo’s lifespan, but it also means the turbo will take longer to spin up the next time the throttle is opened.

So the BPV helps, and if your BPV is aftermarket it flows better than stock reducing the risks of surge.

[sickspeed94]

(deadhorse

[PharmacyMSP]

Amazingly I'm one of only 32% of the people who answered Yes.....

Turkey = Compressor surge - Period. It is not due to the recirculated air back into the intake. There are two points for recirculating air. First and foremost is an effort to have some pressure on the intake side to keep the compressor wheel spinning and to fight surge (the pressure acting on the charge side that is both counterproductive in slowing down the compressor and detrimental to the bearings). On a lesser note I've heard some by pass proponents speak of the "efficiency" in that the air going back into the intake has already been filtered.

I have just recently finished a custom fmic project on my msp in which I have a dual-port Turbosmart bov. It is 50% recirc and 50% atmosphere. I virtually eliminated all turkey. I was amazed at the amount of air that is released during boost and I'm really only speaking of the 50% atmosphere side! (Stock boost) I challenge all people who don't agree that the turkey is compressor surge, to stick their hand in front of an atmosphere blow of valve that has been released after only 7psi and feel the amount of air coming out of damn thing. After which you'll know that charged air hits the fins and causes a little surge. Surge is almost impossible to completely eradicate given simple physics. Tuning (bov) is mainly an effort to minimize surge... maximize performance... and to protect the bearings. Sorry for the long ass thread. PEACE.

[PharmacyMSP]

If you don't have an atmospheric bov to see the amount of air, but still need a picture drawn, then go a fan in your house and speak into the fan in opposition of the blown air. Sounds pretty cool huh. Welcome to the concept of surge.

[doggman]

well seeing as a new bov is needed what about the turboXS type H-34 recirculatin bov. i havnt herd many persons talk about it but i was looking into purchasing this one and im wondering if it's a worth while buy. as well as helping ruduce the (in my case beloved turkey sound =( ) compressor surge.

thanks
-dave

[PharmacyMSP]

well seeing as a new bov is needed what about the turboXS type H-34 recirculatin bov. i havnt herd many persons talk about it but i was looking into purchasing this one and im wondering if it's a worth while buy. as well as helping ruduce the (in my case beloved turkey sound =( ) compressor surge.

thanks
-dave


Looks good. BTW our stock recirculation hose diameter is 19mm which is pretty damn close to 3/4" standard. I actually welded a custom 19mm fitting for my turbosmart. You can go this route or increase the diameter on your intake fitting to accomadate the 34mm. Good luck.

[apocman]

man I have a FMIC with hardpipes and a HKS SSQ BOV set to the lightest setting and I still get turkey as if your fucking right next to a turkey on crack the size of texas.

I do have a PSSSSSSSSSSSSSSTTTTTTTTTT real fucking loud and then followed by BU"DUL,BU'DUL,BU'DUL,BU'DUL>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>the turkey.

[Notorious]

Try my expirement with capping off the bpv or use an open vent bov. It'll prove that it's compressor surge.




It can't be compressor surge. Once a aftermarket CAI is put on, the turkey is the Air venting into the intake and resonating in the pipe. You have air being pulled in by the turbo, then air pushed in its way. I have heard compressor surge on my friends turbo fiero. It sounds like a whoosing not a gobble. How can the air i vent to the intake not be enough, so that the rest of the air travels down the hotpipe through my FMIC back up and to the turbo fins causing backpressure? Like some said maybe under 20psi we would get surge, but then we would here turkey+surge.

[mp5jeff]

man I have a FMIC with hardpipes and a HKS SSQ BOV set to the lightest setting and I still get turkey as if your fucking right next to a turkey on crack the size of texas.

I do have a PSSSSSSSSSSSSSSTTTTTTTTTT real fucking loud and then followed by BU"DUL,BU'DUL,BU'DUL,BU'DUL>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>the turkey.

yea that means your bov isn't releasing enough air...try to keep adjusting it

[MSPBlazinYellow]

I have an injen intake and i dont get a turkey. From what I understand the turkey is an loud audible squealing type noise. All I hear is and air fluttering sound coming from my car

[yashooa]

No, it is low fat (rockon) (evil) (rockon)

[yashooa]

I have an injen intake and i dont get a turkey. From what I understand the turkey is an loud audible squealing type noise. All I hear is and air fluttering sound coming from my car
That sir, is THE TURKEY!(naughty)
And at 12-15PSI she is a VERY loud, gobbling little HO!
I am at around 80k miles now and thus the far the Turkey has been my friend.

[Autox MSP]

its not the compressor surge. Besides turbos running such low boost don't even really require one.

[yashooa]

its not the compressor surge. Besides turbos running such low boost don't even really require one.
I think people are over "thinking" this one. It just sounds like air being violently spit back in the intake track and it is oh so cool (rockon)

[apocman]

I may be screwed becuase if I turn the screw anymore it will fall out basically...

any suggestions??????



yea that means your bov isn't releasing enough air...try to keep adjusting it

[yashooa]

I may be screwed becuase if I turn the screw anymore it will fall out basically...

any suggestions??????
Use more JBWELD! (lol2) (2thumbs) (lol2)

[goldwing2000]

Turkey makes me sleepy but I wouldn't say it's harmful. :D

[Notorious]

No, cap off your bov and then tell me its not compressor surge. And yes, all properly conceived turbo motors that run on gasoline should have one.


its not the compressor surge. Besides turbos running such low boost don't even really require one.

[doggman]

yeah im running 9psi with spikes to 11 and the turkey is TEH LOUD!!!! ist's hi larious when people try to put a reason for a car making that sound. some of the things that people think "teh turkey" is: electrical problem (personal favorite) hydrolic clutch../vbb225/images/smilies/nono.gif ... ../vbb225/images/smilies/attn.gif ../vbb225/images/smilies/xxrotflmao.giflol and the list goes on. but yeah i'll try the type h 34 and let ya'lls know how it does.

-dave(shrug)

[goldwing2000]

And no there really is no TURKEY inside my car.

Except the one behind the steering wheel. (evil)

[doggman]

u calling me a turkey? u wanna go... i'll put my turkey against your turkey anyday..../vbb225/images/smilies/chairshot.gif will see which turkey comes out of the cloud dust all battered and bruised victorious!

-dave

[PharmacyMSP]

Doggman,
I got 1/2 on it. You bring the brew... I got the shit from Holland!

[doggman]

Doggman,
I got 1/2 on it. You bring the brew... I got the shit from Holland!

yeah i hear you got hella shit down thur in texas. hope it doesnt all get washed away tho with them their now hurricans and shit.

if im ever down in texas i'll look you up mang,

take it easy
-dave

[PharmacyMSP]

not as bad as we were expecting. I'm up in Austin right now. I'll probably head back to Houston tomorrow night around midnight or 1am. Lousiana got the worst of Rita, not Texas. Smoke in honor of us. Later.... - PharmacyMsp