Mazdaspeed 6 UPDATE + Check pg 5 for detailed PICS!

[Killer]

Mazda product developer takes blame for delayed U.S. launch of MazdaSpeed6
MARK RECHTIN | Automotive News
Posted Date: 9/12/05

MONTEREY, Calif. - It's my fault.

How often do you hear those words in the auto industry?

But at Mazda North American Operations, Robert Davis is falling on his sword.

Davis, Mazda's senior vice president of product development and quality, is taking the blame for delaying the U.S. launch of the MazdaSpeed6.

The high-performance sedan was to have arrived at car dealerships in June with a base sticker of $28,555, including destination. But 30 days before Job 1, Davis wouldn't sign off on the North American edition of the car. As a result, the MazdaSpeed6 will not arrive until late September.

Davis' problem: He felt the transmission's final drive was not right for the U.S. market. The final drive is the last set of gears before power is delivered to the wheels. The drive determines the speed ratio between the drive shafts and wheels.

Initially, the U.S. versions had a lower final-drive ratio for lower engine revs while freeway cruising. The ratio brings slower acceleration but slightly better gasoline mileage. The Japanese and European editions had a higher final-drive ratio for quicker bursts of speed.

After evaluating both versions, the Japanese and European engineers decided to go with the U.S. edition's gearing as well. Suppliers were contacted, production dates were set.

But Davis then saw the original Japanese-market prototype and was smitten. He felt that the original, higher Japanese final-drive ratio, when mated to the 2.3-liter turbocharged engine's 274 hp and 280 pounds-feet of torque, was better suited for MazdaSpeed6 customers.

"The way the torque comes on, it's actually better with a higher final-drive ratio," he said.

Davis took his case to Jim O'Sullivan, CEO of Mazda North American Operations, who gave Davis his vote of confidence.

The main cause for the 90-day delay was the EPA's recertification process.

Mazda expects U.S. sales of about 6,000 units a year, the most of any market.

As a result of the delay, Japan and Europe will get the initial U.S. production allocation. The United States will get a larger chunk of production down the line.

[jersey_emt]

Interesting...I was wondering why it wasn't out yet.

[Shane5425]

kool... now take that gear and put it in the msp

[crossbow]

Actually it was slated to come out far far before then. Its been delayed about 6 times now. Latest issue was problems with the turbochargers.

[Autox MSP]

i predict a buggy multiple recalled ride. Yippy! i can buy it dirt cheap like the msp!

[II-Savy]

DAMM!
Who is the chick in the sig!?(scratch)

[seanmcsean]

the original problem was the direct injection.

[Newf]

I won't be buying this car first time around....nope, no sir.

Delays mean problems.

Mazda has a habit of never fixing problems on MAzdaspeeds....clunk, hesitation, stereo's dying etc

[crossbow]

Well that would make the list of problems...

Seanmscean: Direct Injection
Online Source: Turbo Issues
Mazda Source: Up/Down Auto Windows Jamming the hell outta fingers
Online Source: AWD system (engaging disengaging issues)
Mazda Source: Car too slow, adjusted final drive

Is it me...or are all the problem centered around all the stuff thats new? =/

[seanmcsean]

hehe.. seems like a trend here crossbow

[II-Savy]

Yea this a serious good observation. Does't seem like coinsidence(sp?) either. which = bad. This car would be a close natural upgrade from the MSP. (boom07)





Well that would make the list of problems...

Seanmscean: Direct Injection
Online Source: Turbo Issues
Mazda Source: Up/Down Auto Windows Jamming the hell outta fingers
Online Source: AWD system (engaging disengaging issues)
Mazda Source: Car too slow, adjusted final drive

Is it me...or are all the problem centered around all the stuff thats new? =/

[fam]

If I was rich this car would be my daily driver as Ive always liked the 6s and the way they drive, but wanted more power and a little less fwd-ness! Id love just to pull up against a slowmaro\eclipse\ricer\redneck and just roast em. Hopefully this thing will be fun.

[Pmpkinhead]

Hey, my dealer was right about the gear thing!!! The Mazda letter said the Japs and Europe were getting the US gears and NOW we are getting the Japs and Europe gears. Did I read this right?

367(mp3yellow

[Da 6]

Only good thing about this is that the issues were caught before they got here and in the dealership lots as "guarenteed lemmon suits" to be beat to death by CR as they did the 03 and 04 6.

[Rainman]

Mine is to arrive next week Wednesday. Well I guess that makes me a guinea pig...LOL! Shit...I liked my MSP so much (all problems aside...my dealership has been great about fixing any problems that have arisen no charge) that I had to get my hands on this when it became available. The lease on our 2000 Protege matured at the time that this became available (or was to become available last year) so the timing just worked out such that I wasn't going to be able to wait until the 2nd iteration. With only 8 available in my city, I figured that I should get in early or have to watch from the sidelines. Guess that I'll learn my lesson if it falls apart.

R

[TheMAN]

yup.... that's the real story behind it... I know because I talked to my guy at MNAO 3 months ago and he told me the car was pretty much ready but they were still trying to tweak the acceleration times... he didn't know exactly what was being done but I immediately suggested that they were probably retweaking the gear ratios (due to the fact that is the easiest way to fix that problem without the expense of retuning the engine which cause an even bigger EPA headache) and as such in-house testing and government recertification would have to be done

[Da 6]

Mine is to arrive next week Wednesday. Well I guess that makes me a guinea pig...LOL! Shit...I liked my MSP so much (all problems aside...my dealership has been great about fixing any problems that have arisen no charge) that I had to get my hands on this when it became available. The lease on our 2000 Protege matured at the time that this became available (or was to become available last year) so the timing just worked out such that I wasn't going to be able to wait until the 2nd iteration. With only 8 available in my city, I figured that I should get in early or have to watch from the sidelines. Guess that I'll learn my lesson if it falls apart.

R
Eh... what's life really worth w/o taking some risks. If nobody did then we'd prabably be an even worse nation. Keep us informed with problems/service dept righting them off as "Normal Issues".

[Rainman]

Eh... what's life really worth w/o taking some risks. If nobody did then we'd prabably be an even worse nation. Keep us informed with problems/service dept righting them off as "Normal Issues".

Will do. Seriously, apart from this issue with the MS6 availability (which was beyond their control), my dealership has been really great with both Proteges. In fact, they sponsored my MSP in our local Import Night last summer. It wasn't a lot, BUT it did help out somewhat with the mod fund.

R

[MoJoeTCM]

hmmm....i bet the first part to go on the 6's will be the tranny's....then the turbo....but gosh....can you imagine the look on the face of a sti or evo owner when someone builds one of these cars right? So much potential in this car, sticker price is a little steep though....

[noclue119]

hmmm....i bet the first part to go on the 6's will be the tranny's....then the turbo....but gosh....can you imagine the look on the face of a sti or evo owner when someone builds one of these cars right? So much potential in this car, sticker price is a little steep though....

I'll take your bet.

First thing to go is the brakes than tires just like the MSP

then its the turbo and the engine

i'll put money on the fact that the transmission will hold up pretty well as long as people are not dumb about it.

[MoJoeTCM]

and god forbid if this has a factory lsd.....i can see it already....i just think mazda has shitty transmissions after past experiences with my speed....it broke under normal acceleration....oh well......i never realized how good you can make the 6 look....interesting...might be my next car...but this time i will wait for the second year...i am never buying a first year car again...

[noclue119]

and god forbid if this has a factory lsd.....i can see it already....i just think mazda has shitty transmissions after past experiences with my speed....it broke under normal acceleration....oh well......i never realized how good you can make the 6 look....interesting...might be my next car...but this time i will wait for the second year...i am never buying a first year car again...

my tranny has been fine. i've had the turbo replaced a few times.. and Ya i can see the LSD going tho.

[MoJoeTCM]

me too.....i am on my third turbo, and second midpipe....second lsd....

[blthlt]

Its weird about these MSP's isnt it. I"m on my second turbo, first had a bad wastegate, but everything else has been fine. The LSD is still alive, brakes are fine, got 40K out of the tires. Hmmmm...maybe it's not all the cars fault.

[noclue119]

Its weird about these MSP's isnt it. I"m on my second turbo, first had a bad wastegate, but everything else has been fine. The LSD is still alive, brakes are fine, got 40K out of the tires. Hmmmm...maybe it's not all the cars fault.

Maybe some of us acutally enjoys our investements a little.

[MoJoeTCM]

Its weird about these MSP's isnt it. I"m on my second turbo, first had a bad wastegate, but everything else has been fine. The LSD is still alive, brakes are fine, got 40K out of the tires. Hmmmm...maybe it's not all the cars fault.

Well...if you are trying to say my habits with driving are bad let me tell you the reason why the things when out...and you can judge then

1st turbo- Wastegate Malfunction
2nd turbo- Replaced because exhaust melted actuator and timing chain cover
(mazda replaced my CRACKED mani and didnt bolt it on properly which broke my midpipe causing it to break at the cat......which eventually wiggled the downpipe free. This caused the exhaust to shoot into the engine bay)
3rd- the only problem i had to date was a bad oil leak, mazda said they didnt clamp down an oil line)

LSD broke because it cannot haul a car or 4 guys under normal acceleration, i am thinking the broken motor mounts were to blame, not my driving. I originally had 50% life left on the clutch but replaced it anyway....

so no....not me....i am just unfortunate...that is why my car is costing mazda more than what the actual warranty is worth....

[blthlt]

Maybe some of us acutally enjoys our investements a little. I dont understand the demeaner of your statement. Are you saying I dont enjoy my car?

[MoJoeTCM]

I dont understand the demeaner of your statement. Are you saying I dont enjoy my car?

no he is saying every protege has its flaws....from the smallest clunk to the whole turbo system fucking up.....everyone enjoys this car, but it just has to many defects.....if this car did not have warranty i would be about 6 grand in debt so you get the idea....it is not that hard...

[MoJoeTCM]

anyway...i cant wait till the 6....

[Da 6]

Hope after modding these they don't have that mazda 3rd gear issue. If the pcm lets you bypass the factory psi after mods i'd be soo jealous! As stated by crossbow and myself in many post...make shure someone autox after breakin so we can see it in action (thumb)

[noclue119]

I dont understand the demeaner of your statement. Are you saying I dont enjoy my car?

No, I'm saying i drive my car harder than most people do their own. My tires lasted 18,000 miles and my turbo last 1/2 as long. My rotors were wraped at 5000 miles, turned and re-warped at 8000 miles. The turbo was flawed with a hole in the wastegate the first time and I had to drop it off more recently because of the stupid c-clip on the wastegate came off and I had 0 boost.

[MoJoeTCM]

lol.....that is all i can say....kudos for truth...



LMFAO! at that Wasabi video....that was the funniest shit i have seen in a while....

[blthlt]

No, I'm saying i drive my car harder than most people do their own. My tires lasted 18,000 miles and my turbo last 1/2 as long. My rotors were wraped at 5000 miles, turned and re-warped at 8000 miles. The turbo was flawed with a hole in the wastegate the first time and I had to drop it off more recently because of the stupid c-clip on the wastegate came off and I had 0 boost. hmm...i guess to each his own.

[TheMAN]

the A26MX-R (IIRC) is unproven, but hopefully there won't be any problems.... it's not related to any of the previous mazda trannies

[Rainman]

and god forbid if this has a factory lsd.....i can see it already....i just think mazda has shitty transmissions after past experiences with my speed....it broke under normal acceleration....oh well......i never realized how good you can make the 6 look....interesting...might be my next car...but this time i will wait for the second year...i am never buying a first year car again...

While my car has the same quirks that are reported on the forum (e.g. notchy shifting, clunk, head unit going crazy, bumper fascia falling off) I haven't had to replace any major parts yet. The bushings have been replaced about 4 times free of charge and the subwoofer has been replaced once. Otherwise, I am on all the stock parts other than the mods listed.

I am looking forward to building up a subtle, black sleeper 6 that is capable of making most people look twice as they see the exhaust smoke and two black strips of rubber on the pavement in front of them....LOL!

R

[crossbow]

I don't think an MPS 6 will ever be showing an Evo or Sti its taillights. Its not meant too. Even if you dumped thousands into the car, its still really heavy compared to the competition. I'm curious to see as to where the SCCA is going to classify it. I'm guessing D stock.

Sure its got the power, but the weight and poor inital tire/wheel sizing is really going to hurt both its classification, and its performance in stock classes. The lack of front LSD doesn't help much either.

Thats the one thing I don't get about the car. It runs in 100:0 distribution until slippage occurs...why the heck didn't they give it a front LSD???

I also wouldn't get my hopes up too high for the aftermarket. The standard 6 is just getting parts now, and that vehicle has a 140k+ volume of cars per year....were only looking at a max of 5-15k MPS 6's in total. The DFI/CAN system is going to really knock alot of tuners upside the head. They'll be all excited, talk about all the products for the car, then the second they get one, they'll just drop off the face of the earth.

Can disables all the standard tuner tricks. Nothing in their arsenal works. That of course won't mean that there won't be parts...just don't expect them in the first 6-12 months of ownership.

The car is dying to be tuned though...with power drop off at 5500 rpm (redline is at 6700), its obvious mazda is following the EPA2 guideline of drowing the cats in fuel, and dialing back boost in the upper rev range. Get rid of that stupid TMIC too and consumer tires/wheels. 215/45/18 on 18x7 on a 3650 lb car barely meets the required load rating.

[TheMAN]

uhh... drowning cats in fuel sets that shit on fire!

[crossbow]

Yup..and thats happened to some 6 owners. Destroyed cats at relatively low mileage.

Regardless, the 3/6/8 all dump excess fuel at upper rpms. The 6's A/F ratio at 6500 rpm is about 9.7:1.

http://www.wam.umd.edu/~greghess/stockaf.jpg

It actually drops below 10 at 5500 rpm. I bet the MPS 6 is doing the exact same thing, and dropping boost, which explains the sudden drop in power after 5500.

[Rainman]

The DFI/CAN system is going to really knock alot of tuners upside the head. They'll be all excited, talk about all the products for the car, then the second they get one, they'll just drop off the face of the earth.

Can disables all the standard tuner tricks. Nothing in their arsenal works. That of course won't mean that there won't be parts...just don't expect them in the first 6-12 months of ownership.

The car is dying to be tuned though...with power drop off at 5500 rpm (redline is at 6700), its obvious mazda is following the EPA2 guideline of drowing the cats in fuel, and dialing back boost in the upper rev range. Get rid of that stupid TMIC too and consumer tires/wheels. 215/45/18 on 18x7 on a 3650 lb car barely meets the required load rating.

Plans for first year of ownership:
Lowering springs
Rims
Fatter shoes
FMIC
AFC (possibly MegaSquirt standalone)

R

[crossbow]

Will the megasquirt work in a DFI application? DFI is a whole new can of worms to deal with.

The spring allotment in the rear looks to be the same...hopefully you'll be able to use standard springs...however the MPS 6 springs might have a higher rate then most of the aftermarket...so you'd be lowering while decreasing spring rate...increasing your body roll substaintally. There are't any sways for the MPS 6, because of the rear differential. (They have to bend up and over, so none of the 6 sways will work for the rear).

Best bet would be to wait for a full coilover solution that had some decent rates.

[neit_jnf]

Yup..and thats happened to some 6 owners. Destroyed cats at relatively low mileage.

Regardless, the 3/6/8 all dump excess fuel at upper rpms. The 6's A/F ratio at 6500 rpm is about 9.7:1.

It actually drops below 10 at 5500 rpm. I bet the MPS 6 is doing the exact same thing, and dropping boost, which explains the sudden drop in power after 5500.

Direct fuel injection allows leaner operation, I read an article about the MSP6 running stoich ratios under boost!!

It's possible it was a preproduction tune and could be different in final cars but the potential is there

[Rainman]

Will the megasquirt work in a DFI application? DFI is a whole new can of worms to deal with.

The spring allotment in the rear looks to be the same...hopefully you'll be able to use standard springs...however the MPS 6 springs might have a higher rate then most of the aftermarket...so you'd be lowering while decreasing spring rate...increasing your body roll substaintally. There are't any sways for the MPS 6, because of the rear differential. (They have to bend up and over, so none of the 6 sways will work for the rear).

Best bet would be to wait for a full coilover solution that had some decent rates.
Not sure about MS, but I am hoping that it will work.

Thanks for the info on the springs. I'll have to plan for coil-overs then. I'll put those on after the winter methinks.

R

[Antoine]

Nice...already talking about Modding the MS6...I can't wait for these badboys to show up on the streets...It's going spice things up again and to see how the aftermarket develops will be very interesting!..Not to mention how it will tie in with the MS3!

[Shane5425]

Nice...already talking about Modding the MS6...I can't wait for these badboys to show up on the streets...It's going spice things up again and to see how the aftermarket develops will be very interesting!..Not to mention how it will tie in with the MS3!

yeah, when the ms3 comes out, there is gonna be alot of support for it from the start because of the 6.. thats gonna be really good.

[Killer]

More reading:


http://www.autoblog.com/entry/1234000023064420/

[tiwing]

They look sweet in person. I had a good fortune to be at the dealership who was prepping them last week for the Canadian press show, I think there were 6 or 8 there, 3 of which will make it to the press viewing ... Very nice looking in person! I'd change the rims right away though. Too bad the trade in on the msp would still mean a cash outlay of 15 grand+!!

[J dragon]

20/26 mpg? yeesh, and I bet Premium is the only thing you can put in this bad boy....

Nontheless, sweet ride

[ChopstickHero]

i saw one again last nite at a TeamAllStars event in the Anaheim area. still a sweet looking car.

[II-Savy]

i saw one again last nite at a TeamAllStars event in the Anaheim area. still a sweet looking car.

Are they going to make it in any exciting colors? Just seems kinda ho hum to me... Nice but not THAT nice. I saw a new 06 white STI and got a woody right away. I guess I just gotta have more "boy racer" stuff on the car....:)

[Rainman]

Arrrggghhhhh, where is my car!!!!!!!!!! I want my MS6!!!!!!!!


R

[crossbow]

J dragon,

Its actually more like 18-20 city and 26-28 hwy. Final gear changes bumped the mileage down a few points. Alot of the little blurbs didn't catch mazda's final gear change. On a happier note, there is a good deal more acceleration because of it!

[Pmpkinhead]

Anyone get their car yet, NEED PICS! :( (withdrawls) sp.

(hump)

367 (mp3yellow

[MazKid]

My dealership has 6 or so ordered...2 of which are supposed to come in this week, or my inventory list(which I normally don't have) says anyway.

Can't wait! If I want my fast sedan fix I have to drive a Legacy GT(or STi, lol, but it's not the same type) - it's fast but the MS6 shall be faster!

[forrestt]

MazKid - which dealer? I was by Bommarito South Saturday, they have 2 inbound for 11/4 - both both are Sports instead of Grand Touring.

Have a dealer with Grand Touring inbound in white? I really need one.

[MazKid]

I work at the #2 Mazda dealership - Lou Fusz. ;)

I can't remember exactly what we have on the way...I'll look over the list tomarrow at work and can tell you tomarrow night. Might see if I can get ahold of a newer list because this one was from like 2 weeks ago, don't know if my boss ordered any different cars since then. I'd be honored to detail a MS 6 for you. :D

[k-lea]

good god.

-drools-

[Rainman]

Anyone know what the APR and the residual values are for an MS6 lease? Mine is not here yet and the dealer claims that they don't have this info yet.

R

[Rainman]

Just got a call from my dealer! They just unloaded my car. Its going into the shop today for PDI. Hopefully will be ready for tomorrow.

Lease rate is 5.9% with 45% residual value at 4 yrs with 20K km annual mileage.

I'll go over this afternoon to snap a few pics.

R

(yippy) (canada)

[Mazda3]

(bowdown) (thumb) (drive2)

[Rainman]

OK. Being the post-whore that I am, I couldn't wait until this afternoon to go and snap a few pics of my newly-arrived baby. I went right over after my previous post and took a few pics of that black-on-black MS badness. They had only just parked it in the dealership compound by the time I got there, so forgive me if I couldn't provide all of the shots that I (and you) would have liked.

For a Mazda Forums exclusive allow me to present the following pics for your perusal:

R

[Rainman]

And these:

[Rainman]

Notice how us Canucks are not fortunate enough to get the Nav system. Arrrggghhh!

R

[Rainman]

How about an analog sweep? AVI size is 8.1 MB. Anyone want to host it?

R

[Rainman]

Analog sweep:

http://media.putfile.com/MS6-Analog-Guage-Sweep

[Rainman]

Analog sweep:

http://media.putfile.com/MS6-Analog-Guage-Sweep

Upload Video and Images - Putfile (http://www.putfile.com)

[Antoine]

(woowoo) Awesome...Thanks Rainman! Be sure to pop that hood and get some close up pics of the BEAST! (thumb)

* Man....It's been a long time coming...It's great to finally see an MS6 in a member's hands! :D

[seanmcsean]

boy your clutch foot is getting antsy now isn't it

[clicknext]

Wow. Beautiful. I wish they could have gotten rid of the bulging out taillights, though.

[Rainman]

My black beauty with tint will be ready by 17:00 tomorrow. I can hardly wait!!!!!!

R

[Rainman]

boy your clutch foot is getting antsy now isn't it

You betcha brother.

R
(thumb)

[rarefc3s]

I could have sworn that the Mazda USA website had a lease special on the MS6 yesterday. It was like $329/mo.. Its not on there today.

[Spooled]

Damn, I am extremely jealous! I'm going to stop by my dealer on the way home to see if there are any sitting around.

[LRHK]

Right on!! (cool)

[wicked]

it doesn't look like there will be a need for any daveB/street rings for this ride.

this things looks great,just needs a few changes though,ie,wheels,ride hight,reg 6 tail lights.

[midnighter]

Hmm.. came lurking for a bit of info but it seems not many people here have seen it yet either.

I had the wonderful opportunity to test-drive one today. The car's a bit out of my price range (I was looking at the new Civic Si, 10k cheaper) but this car is so much damn fun. The power band is huge, though the engine runs a bit out of breath near redline, and it's a really fun car to drive. The interior isn't as nice as the new Civic imo, but it's still really good.

Had a fully loaded black with black/white leather seats, keycard entry, etc. Man... I had to talk to the salesguy for an hour before he even let me drive the damn thing, which was incredibly insulting and I almost started yelling at him... but they eventually gave in. They got it on Friday, it was still in the plastic, and I think I was one of the first people to take it for a test drive.

This thing PULLS like mad... in the rain. With no tire slippage. The suspension's great, very firm but still soaking up bumps. I had so much fun in this car I'm trying to work around my finances to see if it's doable. Even a lease would be great. I've never driven a turbo car before, but this is unlike all I've heard about other turbo cars. Oodles of torque around 3k rpm, a bit underpowered around 2k but that's just cruising speed anyway.

I've been eyeing this car ever since I started hearing about it a year ago. I never really thought I'd consider owning one considering its price, but it's a hell of a car.

Only problem I had with it is I found the clutch very touchy and a little awkward. I suppose it will take some getting used to, but in general it doesn't seem as easy to drive as it should be...

[Rainman]

My wife is not really a car nut (no, I am not gonna divorce her cause of it...LOL), but the first thing she said when I drove her by the lot this afternoon was, "It needs a tint, different rims, and a drop." As I'm writing this, she is telling me about how its just gonna look "sweet."

Don't worry boys and girls. I'll convert her yet. Give her a little MS6 zoom-zoom and she'll be car crazy in no time.

R

[Rainman]

Hmm.. came lurking for a bit of info but it seems not many people here have seen it yet either.

I had the wonderful opportunity to test-drive one today. The car's a bit out of my price range (I was looking at the new Civic Si, 10k cheaper) but this car is so much damn fun. The power band is huge, though the engine runs a bit out of breath near redline, and it's a really fun car to drive. The interior isn't as nice as the new Civic imo, but it's still really good.

Had a fully loaded black with black/white leather seats, keycard entry, etc. Man... I had to talk to the salesguy for an hour before he even let me drive the damn thing, which was incredibly insulting and I almost started yelling at him... but they eventually gave in. They got it on Friday, it was still in the plastic, and I think I was one of the first people to take it for a test drive.

This thing PULLS like mad... in the rain. With no tire slippage. The suspension's great, very firm but still soaking up bumps. I had so much fun in this car I'm trying to work around my finances to see if it's doable. Even a lease would be great. I've never driven a turbo car before, but this is unlike all I've heard about other turbo cars. Oodles of torque around 3k rpm, a bit underpowered around 2k but that's just cruising speed anyway.

I've been eyeing this car ever since I started hearing about it a year ago. I never really thought I'd consider owning one considering its price, but it's a hell of a car.

Only problem I had with it is I found the clutch very touchy and a little awkward. I suppose it will take some getting used to, but in general it doesn't seem as easy to drive as it should be...

I knew that I would get raped a bit on the lease for this puppy being that it is kinda exclusive and I am first on the wagon.

I'll be paying $715 CAN taxes in for a closed end lease, $0.00 DP, 48 mo lease with 20K a year, and a year extension on the warranty to match the lease term. Odds are I'll end up buying it out before the lease is done, but the lease terms are easier to fit into my budget than finance or loan payments right now.

Funny thing is that my dealer is getting 8 of these. Two are spoken for including mine. He liked the first one so much that he has decided to keep one for himself, even though he drives a monster MB S Class sedan. His car is a beast, but I guess the MS6 is just more fun...LOL.

R

[midnighter]

715?! Man... dunno how that works out but I certainly couldn't afford that. As it stands now I got a quote for a 6 year finance, 550 a month but that was with 10 grand down which I will probably only end up doing half that. 5000 down and a lease hopefully it will even be around 400 a month.

[CHICO2003]

$715?!! damn, that's like $600 USD/month! You sure that's a lease? Anyway, nice car. Still not feelin the snowflake rims or antenna (what's all the fuss about the tail lights anyway? I think they look pretty good) Definitely like the red gauges.... after the msp, that's a must for my next car. Maybe if the pricing on these goes down I'll make this my next ride. a decent set of wheels will cost a couple G's so that certainly has to be taken into consideration. Since you're planning on getting new ones, I urge you to consider black BBS. That would look.... oh man, u gotta do it.

[wicked]

$715?!! damn, that's like $600 USD/month! You sure that's a lease? Anyway, nice car. Still not feelin the snowflake rims or antenna (what's all the fuss about the tail lights anyway? I think they look pretty good) Definitely like the red gauges.... after the msp, that's a must for my next car. Maybe if the pricing on these goes down I'll make this my next ride. a decent set of wheels will cost a couple G's so that certainly has to be taken into consideration. Since you're planning on getting new ones, I urge you to consider black BBS. That would look.... oh man, u gotta do it.


or the black 5-zigen FNO1R-C,oh shit that would look good.

[Killer]

Congrats!!!!

[Rainman]

Thanks all. Definitely feeling rims in black. Just not sure which ones yet. Post pics of your favs and we'll plan from there.

R

[Jliao]

http://www.custom-wheels-rims-alloys.co.uk/shopimages/bbs-lemans-2003.jpg

Put an 18 on that or 19 would look beautiful. These are BBS LM and they're polished lip and slightly gun metal in the middle.

[crossbow]

Nah...downsize. Go with the Sti/Evo tire/wheel sizing. There is a good reason why they run that setup!

17x8's with 235/45/17's.

[MazKid]

This:
http://www.automagwheel.com/images/1113981737/Wh-RX-8-300x300.jpg
Or this:
http://www.mazdastuff.com/custom/productzoom/WHEEL_2_B.gif

[Mazda3]

Hmm.. came lurking for a bit of info but it seems not many people here have seen it yet either.

I had the wonderful opportunity to test-drive one today. The car's a bit out of my price range (I was looking at the new Civic Si, 10k cheaper) but this car is so much damn fun. The power band is huge, though the engine runs a bit out of breath near redline, and it's a really fun car to drive. The interior isn't as nice as the new Civic imo, but it's still really good.

Had a fully loaded black with black/white leather seats, keycard entry, etc. Man... I had to talk to the salesguy for an hour before he even let me drive the damn thing, which was incredibly insulting and I almost started yelling at him... but they eventually gave in. They got it on Friday, it was still in the plastic, and I think I was one of the first people to take it for a test drive.

This thing PULLS like mad... in the rain. With no tire slippage. The suspension's great, very firm but still soaking up bumps. I had so much fun in this car I'm trying to work around my finances to see if it's doable. Even a lease would be great. I've never driven a turbo car before, but this is unlike all I've heard about other turbo cars. Oodles of torque around 3k rpm, a bit underpowered around 2k but that's just cruising speed anyway.

I've been eyeing this car ever since I started hearing about it a year ago. I never really thought I'd consider owning one considering its price, but it's a hell of a car.

Only problem I had with it is I found the clutch very touchy and a little awkward. I suppose it will take some getting used to, but in general it doesn't seem as easy to drive as it should be...


So let me get this straight?
You felt insulted that they didn't want you to test drive a limited production, exclusive car that was still in the plastic? And by your own addmission the car is out of your price range? And now that you have driven it most car enthusiasts would no longer buy that one? Cars at dealers aren't there to drive just for the hell of it, test drives are for people who are actually going to buy the car. My local dealer wouldn't have let you drive the Speed 6. You would have to sign the offer to purchase, leave a deposit, and have your credit approved first. Buy the way $5000 down will get you a lease payment of about $600 a month, not $400.

Do you really think they should let everyone who feels like it test drive this exclusive car? Thats just bad business. Each dealer is only getting between 1-4 of these and you want them to mile up a demo for punks to test drive? LOL.....wow.

And buy the way the Civic Si has an ugly cheap ass interior.

[Mazda3]

Rainman, your dealer is only getting 4 Speeds.

[MazKid]

Fusz is getting like 6 or more...we're signed up for atleast 6 now and will prolly get more shortly after. I didn't think the MS 6 was as limited as the 3rd gen Limited Miata, I figured it was like the MazdaSpeed Miata which we had a good number of(and still have 2 left).

[Killer]

5k down a 600 a month??? On a lease??? That's rediculous. I guess residuals aren't that strong on it yet.

[Stormtrooper77]

$715 on a lease! Wow!

[Mazda3]

Fusz is getting like 6 or more...we're signed up for atleast 6 now and will prolly get more shortly after. I didn't think the MS 6 was as limited as the 3rd gen Limited Miata, I figured it was like the MazdaSpeed Miata which we had a good number of(and still have 2 left).

Canada is only 750 between 150 dealers. We don't have designated Speed dealers so every dealer gets at least one. The US is allocated somewhere in the 3000-5000 unit range. Because the US has designated Speed dealers the dealers that get them will get 6 or 8 of them.

[Mazda3]

5k down a 600 a month??? On a lease??? That's rediculous. I guess residuals aren't that strong on it yet.

Yeah, the residuals are weak. But keep in mind that $600 is CDN dollars and includes 15% sales tax. Take off the tax and convert to US dollars and its about $400 dollars a month.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Mazda is VERY strong in Canada. They sell almost as many Mazda's in Canada as they do in the US with 1/10 the population. Mazda is one of the top rated brands here and the Mazda 3 has been the number one selling car in the country for the last 6 months. The Protege has the highest resale of any car in Canada right now. So with success like that they won't have the cheapest cars.

[Mazda3]

$715 on a lease! Wow!

Why wow? Its a $40,000 car.
What can you lease a Acura TL, Infinit G35, or Legacy GT limited for?

[Mazda3]

48 month lease taxes paid with $0 down:

TL $750/mo
G35 $775/mo
Legacy GT $835/mo WOW!!!

$835/mo for a Subaru? Thats nuts!!

[Killer]

Yeah, the residuals are weak. But keep in mind that $600 is CDN dollars and includes 15% sales tax. Take off the tax and convert to US dollars and its about $400 dollars a month.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Mazda is VERY strong in Canada. They sell almost as many Mazda's in Canada as they do in the US with 1/10 the population. Mazda is one of the top rated brands here and the Mazda 3 has been the number one selling car in the country for the last 6 months. The Protege has the highest resale of any car in Canada right now. So with success like that they won't have the cheapest cars.

Residuals are based upon a money factor and RESALE VALUES. If the resale was so strong on Mazda products the Residual/Guaranteed Future Value would in turn be very high as well. Higher residuals mean LOWER PAYMENTS.

My thinking is, its the first year for the car, so resale values have not been set so therefore residuals will be low. this makes the payment larger.

Anyway you slice it, I wouldn't lease that car until the residuals go up. Then it might be worth it. Just my humble opinion. :)

[Killer]

48 month lease taxes paid with $0 down:

TL $750/mo
G35 $775/mo
Legacy GT $835/mo WOW!!!

$835/mo for a Subaru? Thats nuts!!

My mother leased an 05 TL w/Navi $1500.00 out of pocket $455.00 a month Tax Included (6.5%) for 39 months 12k miles a year. (first)

[Mazda3]

Residuals are based upon a money factor and RESALE VALUES. If the resale was so strong on Mazda products the Residual/Guaranteed Future Value would in turn be very high as well. Higher residuals mean LOWER PAYMENTS.

My thinking is, its the first year for the car, so resale values have not been set so therefore residuals will be low. this makes the payment larger.

Anyway you slice it, I wouldn't lease that car until the residuals go up. Then it might be worth it. Just my humble opinion. :)

I understand how a lease works. The residuals are 5%-8% higher on most of the other Mazda products. Mazda has already stepped up on the price compared to its competition in Canada, I guess they figure they don't need to step up on the residual to sell the cars. As you can see above it still leases cheaper than the competition even with the poor residuals.

[Mazda3]

My mother leased an 05 TL w/Navi $1500.00 out of pocket $455.00 a month Tax Included (6.5%) for 39 months 12k miles a year. (first)

We are discussing the Canadian market, what you can lease a TL in Florida has no bearing here.

The TL with that package sells for $47,000 dollars, you can't lease it for 4 something a month with a $1500 down payment. Also Acura dickers very little on their pricing here so she would be paying over $800 a month to lease that car here.

[Stormtrooper77]

Why wow? Its a $40,000 car.
What can you lease a Acura TL, Infinit G35, or Legacy GT limited for?

I'm not doubting the price, I'm just saying for that amount you should probably buy. That is unless he is leasing it under a company. You will always lose out on a lease if you are not a business and are planning on keeping the car.

[crossbow]

I'll let you guys handle canada :).

[Mazda3]

I'm not doubting the price, I'm just saying for that amount you should probably buy. That is unless he is leasing it under a company. You will always lose out on a lease if you are not a business and are planning on keeping the car.

You are right, but it is $900 a month to finance it over 60 months. He might not want a payment that high. Leases can be a good deal if the program is very aggressive, but unfortunately the program isn't agressive on this car.

[Killer]

I'll let you guys handle canada :).They sure are getting screwed on thier cars up there.

[Mazda3]

I'll let you guys handle canada :).

Sorry, I'm all fired up today for some reason!! :)

[midnighter]

So let me get this straight?
You felt insulted that they didn't want you to test drive a limited production, exclusive car that was still in the plastic? And by your own addmission the car is out of your price range? And now that you have driven it most car enthusiasts would no longer buy that one? Cars at dealers aren't there to drive just for the hell of it, test drives are for people who are actually going to buy the car. My local dealer wouldn't have let you drive the Speed 6. You would have to sign the offer to purchase, leave a deposit, and have your credit approved first. Buy the way $5000 down will get you a lease payment of about $600 a month, not $400.

Do you really think they should let everyone who feels like it test drive this exclusive car? Thats just bad business. Each dealer is only getting between 1-4 of these and you want them to mile up a demo for punks to test drive? LOL.....wow.

And buy the way the Civic Si has an ugly cheap ass interior.

Hahaha... wow. Did I strike a nerve there? It was clear they were interested in showing the car to a few people, as it was one of the ones they ordered that wasn't spoken for. I guarantee I would never have gone through that if I was 35 or so. And "price range" is usually just something I do to make myself pretend I'm looking at more practical cars. We're all car enthusiasts here and it would be no fun if you followed a strict budget!

I don't even know what to say about people who would buy a car without even test driving it, it's ridiculous even thinking about it. I don't care if it's limited production or whatever. This isn't a bicycle, it's a $45,000 car taxes in, I'm damn well going to make sure it's the right one for me. They're not getting a cent until I'm sure I want the car. And I don't think there's anything wrong with shopping for a car that way.

And saying the new Civic Si has an ugly, cheap ass interior goes to show how much of a fanboi you are. Have fun with that Mazda 3 (first)

[Rainman]

I'm leasing because my wife has a business and it is officially the company car. I write off a large portion of the lease payment on my taxes. I am leasing instead of buying primarily because while I finish my residency I can keep the payments lower than if I finance. Once I am done my program I will buy it outright.

Anywho......this fucking car rocks! It is really raining now so I won't take any pics yet, but it is the shit!

The Mazda Canada Rep from Toronto was here and personally presented the car to me. The silver MS6 was delayed so right now this is the only one in Ottawa. They tinted it for free and they presented me with Mazda watches for my wife and I. Some additional Mazda goodies are apparently on their way as well.

As for the drive....? Tons of torque and NO turbo lag. Pulls like a monster in every gear. Clutch, as reported yesterday, is very, very touchy compared to the MSP. I stalled it about 6 or 7 times on my inaugural cruise. The keyless entry/ignition is awesome as well. Although not as loud as the MSP stereo, the Bose system is more than adequate and its subwoofer doesn't eat up all the trunk space like the MSP unit.

It is definitely a bigger car. You can feel it when you are decelerating (although the brakes grip like demons) or changing lanes. Its weight doesn't seem to matter much when accelerating though.

These are first impressions after keeping revs mostly below 3000 RPM and granny shifting. I can hardly wait until I can hammer it WOT!

Gotta run.

R (thumb)

[Mazda3]

Hahaha... wow. Did I strike a nerve there? It was clear they were interested in showing the car to a few people, as it was one of the ones they ordered that wasn't spoken for. I guarantee I would never have gone through that if I was 35 or so. And "price range" is usually just something I do to make myself pretend I'm looking at more practical cars. We're all car enthusiasts here and it would be no fun if you followed a strict budget!

I don't even know what to say about people who would buy a car without even test driving it, it's ridiculous even thinking about it. I don't care if it's limited production or whatever. This isn't a bicycle, it's a $45,000 car taxes in, I'm damn well going to make sure it's the right one for me. They're not getting a cent until I'm sure I want the car. And I don't think there's anything wrong with shopping for a car that way.

And saying the new Civic Si has an ugly, cheap ass interior goes to show how much of a fanboi you are. Have fun with that Mazda 3 (first)

Ok....I was a little abrasive in my post. But this is the kind of car that you have your mind 99% made up on based on what you've read. When you test drive the car you should be signing the papers after the drive unless the drive was an extreme disappointment. Its not a car that you casually take for a spin to compare to a dozen other cars and then kind of think about it. You do that with a mazda 6, but not a Speed 6. I can honestly tell you that at my local dealer it wouldn't matter if you were 18 or 50 you wouldn't be able to test drive the Speed 6 unless there was a deal pending. Of course each dealer will make there own "rules" about that. It might be different if each dealer had a dozen sitting there.

Anyway, no offense I just wanted to point out the other side of the coin.

I haven't actually sat in a 06 Civic yet, but the pictures I've seen are ugly IMO. The 05 Civic has a Chevy Cavalier quality interior, sorry but this is a fact. So unless the 06 quality has improved by about ten times it won't hold a candle to the Mazda 3.

[wicked]

whats the quarter mile supposed to be on this bad boy




2000th post YAYAYAYAYAYAYAYA(cheers)(thumb)(alright)(burnout)( friday)(eekdance)(rockon)(drive)(breakn)(yippy)

[Mazda3]

I'm leasing because my wife has a business and it is officially the company car. I write off a large portion of the lease payment on my taxes. I am leasing instead of buying primarily because while I finish my residency I can keep the payments lower than if I finance. Once I am done my program I will buy it outright.

Anywho......this fucking car rocks! It is really raining now so I won't take any pics yet, but it is the shit!

The Mazda Canada Rep from Toronto was here and personally presented the car to me. The silver MS6 was delayed so right now this is the only one in Ottawa. They tinted it for free and they presented me with Mazda watches for my wife and I. Some additional Mazda goodies are apparently on their way as well.

As for the drive....? Tons of torque and NO turbo lag. Pulls like a monster in every gear. Clutch, as reported yesterday, is very, very touchy compared to the MSP. I stalled it about 6 or 7 times on my inaugural cruise. The keyless entry/ignition is awesome as well. Although not as loud as the MSP stereo, the Bose system is more than adequate and its subwoofer doesn't eat up all the trunk space like the MSP unit.

It is definitely a bigger car. You can feel it when you are decelerating (although the brakes grip like demons) or changing lanes. Its weight doesn't seem to matter much when accelerating though.

These are first impressions after keeping revs mostly below 3000 RPM and granny shifting. I can hardly wait until I can hammer it WOT!

Gotta run.

R (thumb)

AWESOME Rainman!!!!
Performance sounds exactly as I expected!!!
Enjoy, I look forward to hearing further impressions as you spend more time at the wheel. (drive2)

[midnighter]

Ok....I was a little abrasive in my post. But this is the kind of car that you have your mind 99% made up on based on what you've read. When you test drive the car you should be signing the papers after the drive unless the drive was an extreme disappointment. Its not a car that you casually take for a spin to compare to a dozen other cars and then kind of think about it. You do that with a mazda 6, but not a Speed 6. I can honestly tell you that at my local dealer it wouldn't matter if you were 18 or 50 you wouldn't be able to test drive the Speed 6 unless there was a deal pending. Of course each dealer will make there own "rules" about that. It might be different if each dealer had a dozen sitting there.

Anyway, no offense I just wanted to point out the other side of the coin.

I haven't actually sat in a 06 Civic yet, but the pictures I've seen are ugly IMO. The 05 Civic has a Chevy Cavalier quality interior, sorry but this is a fact. So unless the 06 quality has improved by about ten times it won't hold a candle to the Mazda 3.

Well then I apologize for being offensive in my response, I became quite defensive after your initial post. Perhaps I worded my experience with the Speed 6 incorrectly, but this is a car I've been fascinated by ever since I heard about it sometime last year. Yes, my friend and I were going around testing a few cars and I was planning to look at the Mazda6 and perhaps the RX-8, it was only by chance that the Mazdaspeed 6 had become available, and I longed to take a look at it.

I understand what you mean to some degree, I wouldn't want to buy a car that's been flogged about by a few others. But I didn't drive it very hard, and considering it's the dealership's first I'd be very surprised if it didn't have some hard-earned miles from the higher sales reps, etc. already. I know when I worked at Ford and we got our first 05 GT's in, all the salespeople took turns taking that GT out. Depends on the quality of the dealership of course, but this wasn't a dealership I would bear a lot of trust in.

I took an '06 Civic out for a drive on Saturday and found it to be a very nice car, loved the whole car, especially the interior. Personally I think it's very high quality, but I'm generally into a more futuristic look which is why perhaps the Speed 6's didn't jump out at me as much.

[Mazda3]

I took an '06 Civic out for a drive on Saturday and found it to be a very nice car, loved the whole car, especially the interior. Personally I think it's very high quality, but I'm generally into a more futuristic look which is why perhaps the Speed 6's didn't jump out at me as much.

Like I said in another thread cosmetics is always personal preference. The pics I've seen of the 06 interior don't appeal to me, maybe its better in person, we'll see. As far as the quality goes I'll have to take your word for it until I get to see one up close myself.

[crossbow]

Wicked,

Estimates are a 0-60 of high 5's or low 6's, with a quarter mile time of low 14's. (Possibility of high 13's on a good day with a skilled driver).

Congrats on the car rainman...it took forever!!! Take photos when its nice out please :).

[midnighter]

Wicked,

Estimates are a 0-60 of high 5's or low 6's, with a quarter mile time of low 14's. (Possibility of high 13's on a good day with a skilled driver).

Congrats on the car rainman...it took forever!!! Take photos when its nice out please :).

I think those times are always a little tough to tell with a 4WD car as well, since in most tests I've seen the drivers tend to ease them off the line when they're 4WD rather than launch them. Atleast the Top Gear drivers seem to.

[crossbow]

Well the car's only 4WD if the tires slip. The second they stop slipping its FWD again. 100:0 is the standard distribution setup by the differential. This is actually benefical, because there is less drivetrain loss if the car only has to drive the front wheels. You get the benefit of an AWD launch, with the drivetrain loss of a standard FWD platform. (Should be around 14-15%)

Going by the Volvo S60R, which is slightly heavier (about 50 lbs) with more power output and displacement (300/295), the times are about right.

Interesting enough...the volvo R's also come with 235/45/17 on 17x8's.

[midnighter]

Well the car's only 4WD if the tires slip. The second they stop slipping its FWD again. 100:0 is the standard distribution setup by the differential. This is actually benefical, because there is less drivetrain loss if the car only has to drive the front wheels. You get the benefit of an AWD launch, with the drivetrain loss of a standard FWD platform. (Should be around 14-15%)

Going by the Volvo S60R, which is slightly heavier (about 50 lbs) with more power output and displacement (300/295), the times are about right.

Interesting enough...the volvo R's also come with 235/45/17 on 17x8's.

Yeah, I have some understand of the system - not all of it though. But I figure if you launch hard it will act just as a normal 4WD car. Since I've driven the car, I know first-hand - 4WD activates BEFORE the tires slip, not after, if you know what I mean. It should grab as well off the line as any all-time 4WD car.

[crossbow]

Aye I understand as well. Let me rephrase...

If the tires were to slip, AWD engages. If they aren't, your in FWD mode.

Aka if your at the strip, you launch as an AWD car, and the second your moving, you get the drivetrain loss of a FWD car. Best of both worlds in terms of acceleration.

[Killer]

I haven't actually sat in a 06 Civic yet, but the pictures I've seen are ugly IMO. The 05 Civic has a Chevy Cavalier quality interior, sorry but this is a fact. So unless the 06 quality has improved by about ten times it won't hold a candle to the Mazda 3.



(thumb) Me thinks you should wait to pass such a harsh judgement untill you actually have seen one in person.

[Rainman]

Just a little clip I took this morning so you all could get a feel for the MS6. It was raining and I'm breaking her in before my first oil change at ~500 km. I hammered her during the first 30 km....lots of variable speeds, nothing too much over 3000-4000 RPM but lotsa application of the throttle (no WOT yet, but 3/4 for short bursts). Between 40 and 500 km I'm keeping it under 3000 RPM. After the first oil change I'll max it at 4500 or so until the next change at 1000 km. Then I'll top it up with Mobil 1 and experience all of the MS6 glorious zoom-zoom-zoom!

This clip is lo-res so that I could get it on Putfile.

R

Click here to watch To-Work-in-the-MS6-Shall-We (http://media.putfile.com/To-Work-in-the-MS6-Shall-We)

Upload Video and Images - Putfile (http://www.putfile.com)

[crossbow]

Rainman,

If you get a chance, can you take a photo from the driving position out the front windshield? I'm curious as to the hood bulge from the driving position.

[Rainman]

Rainman,

If you get a chance, can you take a photo from the driving position out the front windshield? I'm curious as to the hood bulge from the driving position.

Will do. It doesn't look too big from the driver's position, but there is definitely a noticeable depth to the hood height. It isn't obtrusive, but you instantly recognize it is not quite normal.

R

[Mazda3]

Thanks for the video Rainman!! (thumb)

[Maxx Mazda]

Looks good man. Too bad the rainy weather is makng the underside all dirty now LOL!

[Rainman]

Looks good man. Too bad the rainy weather is makng the underside all dirty now LOL!

I know! And to think...soon the snow will be here....arrrgghhhh!

As for the hood bulge, I did notice something when parking at Blockbuster this afternoon. Although the hood bulge is not obtrusive when driving it is definitely a bit of an issue when parking if you are inching up to a curb in front of the car. It is difficult to assess exactly where the front end of the car is. Almost like driving the F150 I had last week.

It is not really an issue now, but if I get it lowered after the snow, I will have to be real careful when parking head-first so that I don't damage the front fascia.

R

Crossbow: I'll have the pics up for you soon.

[rsx]

The Mazda Speed 6 is in Montreal now too, saw one at the traffic light, it was platnium, had the dealer plate at the back, and all the seats were still in plastic.

[Mikey444]

I cant wait to see pics. I saw a couple of 2006 Mazda 6's at my local dealer today but no speeds

[livelyjay]

Sweet, and congrats on the awesome new car. I just wish they would have made it the 5-door instead of the sedan.

[crossbow]

Rainman,

I appreciate it. Some owners had complained about the buldge, but from the photos it looks unobtrusive, so photos would be a welcome addition. You'll probably get hundreds of photo requests in the next few weeks :).

Btw do the rear seats have pockets?

[wicked]

the bulge can't be any worse then driving a muscle car with a cowl.

[Mikey444]

Sweet, and congrats on the awesome new car. I just wish they would have made it the 5-door instead of the sedan.

that would have aded another 60 kg's of weight and the car is already fairly heavy.

[Leonardo]

anxiously awaiting exterior pics without the plastic, especially profile and rear quarter pics as I have found very few good ones on the net......(poke)

[crossbow]

livelyjay,

They didn't make it a hatch for rigidity reasons. In fact they were so concerned with reinforcing the chassis, the rear seats no longer fold down. There is a good deal of bracing traveling across the rear seats, strengthening the rear of the car. I forget the exact percentage, but its a heck of a lot stiffer then a standard 6 is.

[Rainman]

OK. Generally speaking, I am behaving myself with the break-in of this car. But......I did get on it once today for a very short burst.

This thing is a BEAST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! At 16 PSI of boost (stock) on dry pavement, this car hooks up like a mo'fo' and slams you back in your seat. I was beginning to think that my little modded MSP was fast. Uhhhhhh....I was wrong. For a big car like this to move that quick is pretty damn tight!!! I don't have a G-Tech Pro or anything like that, but I suspect that for once, Mazda's 0-60 mph claims are very, very conservative. If I compare it to the Legacy GT I test-drove or even the Volvo V50 T5 wagon, this thing would likely out-run both.....easily.

As for the pics, I got a bunch on the camera for you all, just got load 'em up on the laptop for ya.

R

[Rainman]

the bulge can't be any worse then driving a muscle car with a cowl.


In fact, that is what came to mind when I first thought about it.

R

[fam]

If youre leasing it screw the break in period cuz itll be under warrantee unless you plan on buying it!

[crossbow]

Very true. Break that sob in hard if your just leasing :).

[Rainman]

There is an outside chance that I'll buy it so I don't wanna completely thrash it. Just maybe.....moderately thrash it....LOL!

I'll get on it over the weekend and report back.

R

[rocketr2]

Rainman: does the MS6 come with a boost gauge ? Also any chance you can up the boost with a boost controller ? maybe to 20psi

[Mazda3]

(drive2)

You've got me pumped on this car Rainman!!!

[crossbow]

I wouldn't up the boost...thats asking for trouble. But "evening" out the boost to provide a more consistent curve could be worthwhile.

I'm sure once the dyno's come in, we'll see it drop boost in the upper rpm's. Stabilizing the dropoff would give it a bit more upper rpm "umf"..as long as the turbo can handle the requested pressure. (ie if its not a turbo sizing limitation)

[vindication]

cant wait to see dynos with A/F ratio so that we can see that hopefully mazda did a WAY better job programming this ECU as compared to the MSP

[mdaj]

I doubt it. Mazda loves to use fuel. Can't wait to see the vids when I get home.

[crossbow]

I doubt it. Mazda loves to use fuel. Can't wait to see the vids when I get home.

Remember...we want the A/F ratio's to be ultra rich (bad). We want the boost to drop off as the rpm's climb. We want the stock wheels to be rediculously heavy.

Because that means there is huge room for improvement!!!! (thumb)

[wicked]

dude,you need to start offering this car to companies for some R&D,get your self some good shit made for it,like a FMIC,fuck the lease BUY IT!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Newf]

I'm very jealous right now. car looks and sounds very nice.

If I hadn't just renovated the house, I'd be seriously looking at it. It's exactly what I have been looking for, with the exception of some cosmetics. Hopefully they make more in 2007, and with better rims. Unfortunately my current dealer situation might force me to go back to Honda, in which case a SiR. and anyone that mentions the cavy and civic in the same sentence for interior quality is a nut case.



Enjoy it, and keep the media coming.

Oh, are there HID's on this? Canadian version of course.

[Mikey444]

Man, you are really keeping us waiting for more pics.

[Rainman]

Side profile front
Side profile rear
Rims
Rims and rotors

[Rainman]

Rear deck lid spoiler
Tail pipes and rear fascia
Mazdaspeed emblem rear
Tails
Driver's door handle

[Antoine]

OMG...Your MS6 is down right sinister...I love it...with the right stance and mean rims...I'm already speechless...HAWT!

[Rainman]

Headlights (Driving + Xenon HID + turn indicators)
Foglights
Headlights + fogs
Headlights + front grill + hood profile
Headlights + front grill

[Rainman]

Front grill (side view)
Cockpit (driver's side)

Interior shots to follow later today or tomorrow.

Hope you all like so far...LOL! And for all who were waiting I hammered it a few times today before returning to break-in mode. JFK this thing is quick. My wife's best friend used to have a WS6 Trans-am. That thing was friggin' loud and accelerated like a bat outta hell. This car really reminds me of that car, but without all the noise. It really accerates more like a V8 than a 2.3L I4. The size of the car gives it that feel as well. I friggin' love it!!!

R
(first)

[Rainman]

Rainman: does the MS6 come with a boost gauge ? Also any chance you can up the boost with a boost controller ? maybe to 20psi


Alas, no boost guage.

R

[Rainman]

OMG...Your MS6 is down right sinister...I love it...with the right stance and mean rims...I'm already speechless...HAWT!

Wait until I drop it an inch or two.... (thumb)

[Rainman]

I'm very jealous right now. car looks and sounds very nice.

If I hadn't just renovated the house, I'd be seriously looking at it. It's exactly what I have been looking for, with the exception of some cosmetics. Hopefully they make more in 2007, and with better rims. Unfortunately my current dealer situation might force me to go back to Honda, in which case a SiR. and anyone that mentions the cavy and civic in the same sentence for interior quality is a nut case.



Enjoy it, and keep the media coming.

Oh, are there HID's on this? Canadian version of course.

Adjustable Xenon HIDs baby! Those things are bright and down right badass! It is crazy how much of a difference they make over conventional halogens.

R

[Rainman]

Rainman,

I appreciate it. Some owners had complained about the buldge, but from the photos it looks unobtrusive, so photos would be a welcome addition. You'll probably get hundreds of photo requests in the next few weeks :).

Btw do the rear seats have pockets?

I've taken those pics for you Crossbow, but they are on my phone not my camera. I'll either get them off my phone later today or take more on my camera.

Forgot to check the seats in the back, but I'll do that at the same time as the pics.

R

[Antoine]

This thread has been stickied for extra viewing pleasure ;)

[Mikey444]

I am down right jealous and I have a RX-8 and I am still jealous. I am very impressed with this performance sport sedan. The brakes are massive too. some heavier SUV's have smaller brakes than that, much smaller. They sure didnt cut any corners anywhere on this car.

[LRHK]

(cool) I want to see one of these in person... my dealership said the one showing up there is still 2 - 3 weeks away :(

[Killer]

sweet car.

[crossbow]

Mikey,

Your brakes are actually 0.12 inches larger. lol! (rx8 mtx). I thought the MPS 6 was using the 8 brakes, but they aren't, they are a slightly different size...so no easy snagging.

That car is so rediculous awesome looking :).

[Mazda3]

anyone that mentions the cavy and civic in the same sentence for interior quality is a nut case.



Anyone who thinks that the 05 and older Civic has a high interior quality is brainwashed with Honda propaganda.

[CHICO2003]

not propoganda dude... pure FACT!! if I wasn't pressed for time (ie. lazy) I'd do some digging. if we can't trust publications like consumer reports (and to a lesser extent) the various car and drivers/motor trends/ etc. of the world... we're basically left trying to make these types of conclusions oureselves. (not something any of us could truly pull off by simply sitting and/or driving in a car for a few minutes) Bottom line: honda, overall, has always rated very highly in NVH and other quality categories.

That said, I've read that they've taken a bit of a turn with the 06 model. this is pretty surprising but, according to the 'experts', it still doesn't put them into the dumbestic market depths.

it's gonna be a bloodbath between the 06 civic and mazda3... personally the mazda looks to be more upscale and 'bmw-ish' so that's where my vote goes.

[Newf]

very nice car. But are your headlights fogging?

Honda has kind of disappointed me with the last few years, and are not the usual honda quality that I was used to in the 90's. But to say they have as bad of an interior as a cavy? Have you sat in a Cavy? The accord is another that's gotten worse. Matter of fact, the first thing I thought of when I sat in my father 2003 coupe was that the plastics, buttons etc looked just like the Mazda6 materials. I was driving a 6 that day so I was surprised how close it was.

Anyways, carry on. The car is insane Rainman. Congrats. I'd be interested in seeing how this car behaves in the warm weather of June/July etc. Right now my car pulls like crazy too, but in June, it's not so impressive. I'm wondering how that top mount handles heat.

[Mazda3]

Yeah, the intercooler is the key in the summer time on a turbo car. Is yours stock Newf?

[midnighter]

it's gonna be a bloodbath between the 06 civic and mazda3... personally the mazda looks to be more upscale and 'bmw-ish' so that's where my vote goes.

While I would not compare the interior of the 05 Civic, I don't think it's anything special, the 06 is really nice. However after looking at the Speed 6 I also started looking at the 3, and I definately think the build quality of the 3 is much better than the 06 Civic, though the styling is much more subdued.

[Rainman]

Already thinking about the FMIC. The Toronto Mazda rep who presented the car to me told me to watch out for leaves and shit on the TMIC since the opening is right there on the front grill.

R

[Rainman]

Black leather seats (rear)
Window and door lock switchs + armrest
Rear passenger lighting controls
Subwoofer for BOSE stereo
Rear passenger arm rest with cupholders (yeah right, like I'm gonna let my kids drink anything in this car!)

[Rainman]

Mazdaspeed carpet
Dead pedal
Other pedals
Instrument cluster (From L to R: Xenon bulb aim switch, guage illumination dimmer, dynamic stability control on/off switch)

[rocketr2]

TMIC, would that be an intercooler like the WRX on top of the engine ?

[Rainman]

Window and side mirror instrument cluster
Driver's door storage compartment with cupholder
Storage bin (where nav would go if we got it stock here in Canada)
Stereo and climate control system
Ashtray/lighter compartment (silver birch-like finish) + gear shift knob

[Rainman]

Ashtray/lighter compartment (cover open)
Cup holder compartment (cover closed) + e-brake lever
Cup holder compartment (cover open)
Passenger side door
Sun roof sun shade (vented openings allow airflow out of car without wind noise, turbulence, or excess sunshine)

[Rainman]

Sun shade open + sun roof
Sun shade cracke open
Sun roof + front light control panel
Front passenger airbag light (automatically turns off if person < 90 lbs or front passenger seat too close to dashboard)
Keyless ignition start knob

[Rainman]

Xenon bulb aim control dial
Instrument guage cluster
DSC on/off button
Stereo control buttons
Centre panel vents

Gotta run, so that's it for now. More to follow later.

R

[CHICO2003]

Cool pics... how does the keyless ignition work?

[Rainman]

TMIC, would that be an intercooler like the WRX on top of the engine ?

Yep. I'll get you pics of it later.

R

[Rainman]

very nice car. But are your headlights fogging?


Yeah, they were doing that on the first day. I was gonna see if it cleared up after a few days. If not then I'll have them address it with the oil change next week.

R

[Rainman]

Cool pics... how does the keyless ignition work?

Key card in your pocket. Walk up to car, press "request" button. If key card in range, doors open. Depending on number of presses of request button, driver's door, all doors, all doors and trunk, or all windows open.

Can also open windows remotely from outside of car with key card. You might be able to remote start as well, but I haven't read that part of the manual yet.

Sit in car with key card. Turn start knob. If key card in range, car starts. If not then nada. If you take your car to valet parking, take start knob cover off. Give valet special valet key. Different from emergency master key kept within key card. Valet key can only open driver's door and start car. Valet key cannot open trunk or glove box.

If key car left in car and person walks away doors do not automatically lock, but after certain time period key car deactivates itself so that car is then immobilzed with that particular key card. It will start with the back up key card, but the first key car would need to be reprogrammed by Mazda.

R

[CHICO2003]

that's pretty damn sweet!! does this car also have bluetooth capability?

[CHICO2003]

Unless the MS3 comes out with awd and a ton of hp, even though I'll have to change the wheels and swap antenaes, this is definitely my next car. ... i just wish it came in orange!! so what do you guys think it'll sell for once the initial buzz wears off? the general rule of thumb with cars is at least 2k off sticker. This car seems to be a value even at 28k so 26k would be a no-brainer.

[midnighter]

Unless the MS3 comes out with awd and a ton of hp, even though I'll have to change the wheels and swap antenaes, this is definitely my next car. ... i just wish it came in orange!! so what do you guys think it'll sell for once the initial buzz wears off? the general rule of thumb with cars is at least 2k off sticker. This car seems to be a value even at 28k so 26k would be a no-brainer.

Considering the production numbers listed for this car, I doubt you'll be able to even purchase them after a while. They're selling pretty fast.

[seanmcsean]

rainman, thanks for all the pics... we appreciate it (2thumbs)

[Newf]

How high is the shifter? I ask because the ones on the normal 3's and 6's are just too high for my liking. I love the one in the 2003.5 speed. Compare?

[midnighter]

To me it feels the same position as both the 3 and the 6, but I believe the seats might be height-adjustable... how tall are you? I've found all the shifters and actually the whole layout of the car is in the perfect position for me. Probably one of the reasons I like the cars so much. I'm 5'11"

[Rainman]

How high is the shifter? I ask because the ones on the normal 3's and 6's are just too high for my liking. I love the one in the 2003.5 speed. Compare?

Not as high as my wife's old Protege, but definitely higher than the 2003.5 MSP.

R

[Rainman]

To me it feels the same position as both the 3 and the 6, but I believe the seats might be height-adjustable... how tall are you? I've found all the shifters and actually the whole layout of the car is in the perfect position for me. Probably one of the reasons I like the cars so much. I'm 5'11"

I'm 6'1", but I still find the car a good fit. I tend to like my driving compartment to be tight though. I like everything real close....somewhat like driving a go-kart.

R

[Rainman]

rainman, thanks for all the pics... we appreciate it (2thumbs)

No worries brother. I'm glad that I can contribute to the forum.

R

[Rainman]

that's pretty damn sweet!! does this car also have bluetooth capability?

Not that I know of. That would be kick-ass wouldn't it? I'll check through the manual tomorrow, but I don't think it does.

R

['Sploder]

Just thought I'd post up a couple pics of the silver MS6 my parents recieved yesterday. I havent had a chance to drive it yet, but to quote my dad, 'it goes like a bullet'. Pics might be huge. I'll try to get more from the rents today.

[seanmcsean]

some side sills would do that car some good.

[LRHK]

Hey, that car is only 2 hrs away from me... and I'm driving through there in 5 hrs... hmm..

['Sploder]

Hey, that car is only 2 hrs away from me... and I'm driving through there in 5 hrs... hmm..

They probably have a couple at the dealer still if you wanted to stop by and see one. I can't gaurantee it tho, as I'm not there.

[LRHK]

Oh? The dealer in Kamloops doesn't have one yet, stopped by on Friday... :(

['Sploder]

That's surprising. Probably sometime this week then. My parents recieved it yesterday.

[LRHK]

Ah, well i'm off to the kootenays today for a month, so won't be near any dealerships... oh well, will have to wait.

[MP3Architect]

Key card in your pocket. Walk up to car, press "request" button. If key card in range, doors open. Depending on number of presses of request button, driver's door, all doors, all doors and trunk, or all windows open.

Can also open windows remotely from outside of car with key card. You might be able to remote start as well, but I haven't read that part of the manual yet.

Sit in car with key card. Turn start knob. If key card in range, car starts. If not then nada. If you take your car to valet parking, take start knob cover off. Give valet special valet key. Different from emergency master key kept within key card. Valet key can only open driver's door and start car. Valet key cannot open trunk or glove box.

If key car left in car and person walks away doors do not automatically lock, but after certain time period key car deactivates itself so that car is then immobilzed with that particular key card. It will start with the back up key card, but the first key car would need to be reprogrammed by Mazda.

R

holy mother of god that is awesome! i wander if i can install that keyless system in my protege? that would be so sweet. im so gonna test drive one of these within the next few weeks.

[Rainman]

Just thought I'd post up a couple pics of the silver MS6 my parents recieved yesterday. I havent had a chance to drive it yet, but to quote my dad, 'it goes like a bullet'. Pics might be huge. I'll try to get more from the rents today.


Tell him to tint it brother!!!!!!

R

['Sploder]

lol we'll see haha.

[Rainman]

6 CD in-dash CD player

[vindication]

so engine pics please

['Sploder]

Apparently they need 17" winter rims because of the size of the brakes (boom06). That is rediculous.

[Rainman]

Temperature switch (ambient/interior) 6 CD in-dash CD player
Storage compartment
6 CD in-dash CD changer
Cruise control
Illuminated guages

[Rainman]

Front seat heater switches
Rear seat head-rest
My black beauty

After our night out last night, my wife decided that it was just too big and with too many gadgets for her. She wants to keep the MSP and wants me to drive the MS6! Damn....thats just too bad....LOL! She said that she'll have to take it every once and a while, but after I lit it up for her last night, she doesn't need that kind of power...LOL!

R

[Rainman]

Apparently they need 17" winter rims because of the size of the brakes (boom06). That is rediculous.


Ouch! I haven't priced that out yet. Doh!

R (confused)

[DE31]

i might of missed it but do you have a pic of the key card?

[vindication]

engine pics man

['Sploder]

engine pics man

(mswerd)

[Maxx Mazda]

Are those "fake" high beams and foglights in the main housing? I know the fogs are fake cause it has the extra ones i nthe bumper, and I can only assume that the HID's are bi-xenon if those are indeed fake. (The most inboard bulbs)

[LRHK]

I saw a silver MS6 on my drive through Vernon... looked just like the one you posted, i'm thinking it was your parents cause there aren't many out yet...
That's surprising. Probably sometime this week then. My parents recieved it yesterday.

[Rainman]

i might of missed it but do you have a pic of the key card?

Don't yet, but I'll take one tomorrow.

R

[Rainman]

Are those "fake" high beams and foglights in the main housing? I know the fogs are fake cause it has the extra ones i nthe bumper, and I can only assume that the HID's are bi-xenon if those are indeed fake. (The most inboard bulbs)

From grill to corner:
Hi Xenon
Parking lights
Turn signals
Lo Xenon

Damn those Xenon bulbs are bright! With the hi beams on it like some huge Hollywood spotlight is shining the way. EVERYTHING gets lit up like a mo'fo'!

R

[crossbow]

I don't think the High beams are xenon, unless its tilting the low beams up. Due to the nature of "flashing" hi-beams to get attention, they never use them in a dedicated HID setup.

The low beams however definitely are bi-xenon, and stay illuminated when you turn on the high beams.

Front rotor size is 12.6, which prevents the fitment of 16's. 17's should fit without a problem though, both because the spare is a 17, and the rx8's with their 12.72 front rotors can fit them without issue.

['Sploder]

I saw a silver MS6 on my drive through Vernon... looked just like the one you posted, i'm thinking it was your parents cause there aren't many out yet...

I think they were in vernon at some point so that is very likely!


Front rotor size is 12.6, which prevents the fitment of 16's. 17's should fit without a problem though, both because the spare is a 17, and the rx8's with their 12.72 front rotors can fit them without issue.

Thats what it sounds like. Those brakes are huge.

[MS6NMI]

I talked to two different Mazda dealers today. Both dealers said the have MazdaSpeed6’s coming in next week. The cars are currently at setting at the port (WoodHaven Michigan). So I guess we will see what happens.

[505zoom]

The lack of engine pics is killing me. Rainman, post up a few pics of the bay and of the keycard when you get a chance. Sweet pics so far BTW.:)

[Rainman]

The lack of engine pics is killing me. Rainman, post up a few pics of the bay and of the keycard when you get a chance. Sweet pics so far BTW.:)

Oh damn.....I've truly reached cult status now. 505zoom waiting on pics from MY car instead of the other way around. Hold on......

OK, I'm back. I just had to look out the window to see if pigs were flying past....LOL!

Seriously though brother, I'll get some pics for you soon.

R

[505zoom]

Oh damn.....I've truly reached cult status now. 505zoom waiting on pics from MY car instead of the other way around. Hold on......

OK, I'm back. I just had to look out the window to see if pigs were flying past....LOL!

Seriously though brother, I'll get some pics for you soon.

R

NO... NOW!!! RIGHT NOW!!!

:p

Take like 20 of the bay... all different angles. If you would be so kind.:)

[Rainman]

NO... NOW!!! RIGHT NOW!!!

:p

Take like 20 of the bay... all different angles. If you would be so kind.:)

I'll get right on it, oh exalted one....LOL!

R

[505zoom]

I'll get right on it, oh exalted one....LOL!

R

<--- Bites fingernails and makes popcorn in anticipation.

[Rainman]

Let me just gripe for a second and say that there has to be a better way to add pics to posts!!!!!!! Arrgghhh


R

Engine bay pics to come later this evening.

[wicked]

upload them all to something like photobucket.com

[505zoom]

Let me just gripe for a second and say that ther has to be a better way to add pics to posts!!!!!!! Arrgghhh


R

Engine bay pics to come later this evening.

There is bro... instead of using the attach files feature in your post, go to the user CP and upload them there. Here is a quick explaination:

Got to User CP at the top of this page. At the bottom of the left hand column you will see "Upload Files", go there. Go to the bottom of that page, and you will see 4 different buttons that say choose file. Hit those, and select a different picture for each one. After you have selected 4, hit upload files. Now they are saved into your User CP and you can post them anywhere on the net. To post a link to your pics, just paste the address of the pic into a post... or if you want the picture to actually display on the page that you are posting it in, surround the address with [IMG] tags. Example of that is [*IMG]www.msprotege.com/users/rainman/etc...[*/IMG]. Remove both of the * symbols from before the IMG commands.

Hope this helps.

[Rainman]

There is bro... instead of using the attach files feature in your post, go to the user CP and upload them there. Here is a quick explaination:

Got to User CP at the top of this page. At the bottom of the left hand column you will see "Upload Files", go there. Go to the bottom of that page, and you will see 4 different buttons that say choose file. Hit those, and select a different picture for each one. After you have selected 4, hit upload files. Now they are saved into your User CP and you can post them anywhere on the net. To post a link to your pics, just paste the address of the pic into a post... or if you want the picture to actually display on the page that you are posting it in, surround the address with [IMG] tags. Example of that is [*IMG]www.msprotege.com/users/rainman/etc...[*/IMG]. Remove both of the * symbols from before the IMG commands.

Hope this helps.

Damn, I'm always learning something from ya, 505!

Anyway, I went with the photobucket.com route before I read your post.

R

[vindication]

the suspense is waaaay overdone. now (getout) and post pics of engine bay

[Rainman]

OK, OK...I will now use the language of my 14 y/o son to address the collective masses.

Since you are all "savages" (LOL) I have been forced to pimp my Black Betty in front of the camera for your satisfaction. You can check out her most private parts at Black Betty on photobucket.com (http://photobucket.com/albums/c329/premed00/). Keep your privates in your pants....I don't need any stains on the black mica finish thank you.

R

[vindication]

very nice. that hood is mad deep. any visibility problems? also, pics of turbo and piping and broader engine bay pics if you will. thanks. looks great man.

[CHICO2003]

holy shit man... nice job!! those are some great pictures you took (complete with captions and everything!) I didn't realize the hood was so high. overall, this thread has taken my interest in this car from a 2 all the way up to a 10. I'd be shocked if this isn't my next car.

[Rainman]

very nice. that hood is mad deep. any visibility problems? also, pics of turbo and piping and broader engine bay pics if you will. thanks. looks great man.

It is a bit gettting used to when you park forward in a parking garage or against a wall because it is difficult to see the end of the hood, even if you are sitting high up (I am over 6" tall). Otherwise, no problems at all when you are driving. Parking is really the only time you notice it.

I'm trying to figure out how to get pics of the turbo. It is FRIGGING tight back there against the firewall. They really shoe-horned the turbo in there tight.

I'll get some broader engine bay pics tomorrow.

R

[rocketr2]

Rainman : Blow-off valve ? so do you get a woosh, or turkey when you shift will boosting ??

[Rainman]

holy shit man... nice job!! those are some great pictures you took (complete with captions and everything!) I didn't realize the hood was so high. overall, this thread has taken my interest in this car from a 2 all the way up to a 10. I'd be shocked if this isn't my next car.

The more I drive this car, the more "savage" I think it is. It just f___ing rocks! I just can't wait until it is broken in so that I can really experience it.

One of the amazing things is how it just seems to keep going in the higher gears. Whatever they did with the gearing seems to have worked, because when you hit 5th and 6th gear and you expect power to drop off, it just seems to keep coming. Now, I have only experienced this at modest RPM as I am still babying it, but if you maintain a constant RPM and upshift from 4th to 5th, the car just seems to find a 2nd wind and take off with more vigour than you would expect after having driven the MSP.

I don't know about the other near-luxury cars to which this will be compared, but I feel that it is every bit the underdog contender with all the amenities and performance to make it a surprise winner. I realize that I am biased, but this things rocks.

R

[Rainman]

Rainman : Blow-off valve ? so do you get a woosh, or turkey when you shift will boosting ??

Technically, not a blow-off, but rather a bypass valve. No real whoosh or turkey, just mad acceleration. Truthfully, I am too busy keeping all 4 wheels pointed in the right direction to listen closely to the BPV, but I don't really recall it making much sound.

R

[505zoom]

Sweet man... those are some great pics.:) Looks like a fine piece of work for sure.

[crossbow]

Thanks for the pics! That hood is alot deeper then I thought it was. Wowzers! Glad your enjoying the car. Keep up the feedback!

Do you notice any turbine lag? One of the owners on the 6club mentioned it as one of the first things he noticed about the car (he owns the silver one I think?) but I haven't heard you complain whatsoever about lag.

[mazda6irl]

I just have to say that I am extremely jealous and that car rocks! Congrats and take care of her!

[Rainman]

There is a slight bit of turbo-lag, but nothing substantial by any means. After coming from the MSP, lag is almost non-existent in comparison.

I'm not sure what the owner of the silver one thinks, but I truly compare the feel of this car to a NA-V8. When you hammer the V8, there is a slight pause before all hell breaks loose. This car is the same. However, the turbo starts spooling much earlier than the MSP (probably around 2400 RPM vs 3500 RPM in my MSP) so the delay is very minimal. I'll try to take some vid clips so that you can get an idea of what I'm talking about.

By all means, this is easily the fastest and the quickest car that I have owned (which is not saying much), but at this point my MSP was fairly quick on the block (no dyno or track times to back it up, just light-to-light comparisons). The MS6 makes it seem like my car was going backwards.

R

[vindication]

what turbo is in the MS6?

[Maxx Mazda]

Mmmmmmmm... TMIC......

[CHICO2003]

...

By all means, this is easily the fastest and the quickest car that I have owned (which is not saying much), but at this point my MSP was fairly quick on the block (no dyno or track times to back it up, just light-to-light comparisons). The MS6 makes it seem like my car was going backwards.

R

I gotta take umbridge with you on this point. While there's no denying the MS6's overall superiority over the outclassed MSP, saying that the msp felt like it was going backwards in comparrison is a bit unfair (and untrue.) Taking 0-60 times into consideration, the best I've seen for both cars is 6.2 & 6.7 A mere half a second. 1/4 mile times are even closer. Again, not trying to say the MSP can hold a candle to the MS6 (considering it's 33% more expensive, there shouldn't really be any comparrison. However, in terms of our car's middle name, these cars are (amazingly) relatively similar. I think it's the power/weight ratio. Personally, I was shocked to see MT's 6.2 & 14.7 times. Especially when the Legacy GT (undoubtely the main competitor) posted a 5.7 & 14.2 Then I took a look at the weight. The MS6 is a solid car for sure... largely due to it's 3500 curb weight. While it's got a whopping 100hp more than the MSP, an extra 700lbs clearly comes close to evening things out a bit.

But I digress.... all of that is moot. Much of my post is hypocritcal since 0-60 & 1/4 times aren't something I'm especially interested in. When I was considering the MSP, one of the reviews that stated it FEELING faster than a WRX (even though it cleary wasn't/isn't) struck a chord. Perception's reality. The sense of speed you've been talking about bodes well for this car. Through in the practicality and handling of AWD (skidpad of .90 / also about the same as the MSP) and, last but not least, a healthy dose of originality (how many freakin TL's, A4's & Maximas does one need to see on the road?) add it all up and, as much as I hate to say it, you've arguably got the best overall bang for your buck mazda's ever produced.

.... if only they fitted it with a decent set of wheels! WTF were they thinking???

[lcruz64]

what turbo is in the MS6?
Is it a Garret?

[Mazda3]

I gotta take umbridge with you on this point. While there's no denying the MS6's overall superiority over the outclassed MSP, saying that the msp felt like it was going backwards in comparrison is a bit unfair (and untrue.) Taking 0-60 times into consideration, the best I've seen for both cars is 6.2 & 6.7 A mere half a second. 1/4 mile times are even closer. Again, not trying to say the MSP can hold a candle to the MS6 (considering it's 33% more expensive, there shouldn't really be any comparrison. However, in terms of our car's middle name, these cars are (amazingly) relatively similar. I think it's the power/weight ratio. Personally, I was shocked to see MT's 6.2 & 14.7 times. Especially when the Legacy GT (undoubtely the main competitor) posted a 5.7 & 14.2 Then I took a look at the weight. The MS6 is a solid car for sure... largely due to it's 3500 curb weight. While it's got a whopping 100hp more than the MSP, an extra 700lbs clearly comes close to evening things out a bit.

But I digress.... all of that is moot. Much of my post is hypocritcal since 0-60 & 1/4 times aren't something I'm especially interested in. When I was considering the MSP, one of the reviews that stated it FEELING faster than a WRX (even though it cleary wasn't/isn't) struck a chord. Perception's reality. The sense of speed you've been talking about bodes well for this car. Through in the practicality and handling of AWD (skidpad of .90 / also about the same as the MSP) and, last but not least, a healthy dose of originality (how many freakin TL's, A4's & Maximas does one need to see on the road?) add it all up and, as much as I hate to say it, you've arguably got the best overall bang for your buck mazda's ever produced.

.... if only they fitted it with a decent set of wheels! WTF were they thinking???

Those Motortrend times weren't actual track testing, they were quoting Mazda's VERY conservative estimates. Look for real times to be around 5.5 and 13.9. I am going to be driving one shortly, I'm just waiting for the mechanic to finish the PDI.(glare)

[crossbow]

Since the gearing requires a shift to 3rd to hit 60, I'd say the 0-60 would be around mazda's estimates...but a high 13 low 14 is definitely possible due to the gearing change.

Having to shift to 3rd to reach 60 will ruin the car's 0-60 time. I wish manufacturers would make 0-70, 55-75 (highway passing), more standards to try to move away from the similar gearing almost every car has, to try and get a good 0-60 time.

The biggest difference between the MPS 6 and other recent mazda's is when the power kicks in. The MPS 6 is specifically designed to provide lots of low end torque and low end kick. If your not used to low end torque, it feels rediculous fast when you've got heaploads of it. My previous car was a 74 pontiac, with roughly 400 ft/lbs of torque available at roughly 1500-1700 rpm (6.5 liter v8). It only had 270 bhp, and weighed about 4400 lbs, but it "felt" like it was flying off the line.

If you look at the standard 6, it doesn't even begin to make power till 3k rpm, and doesn't start making a decent amount till 4k rpm. At 3k rpm the MPS 6 is already reaching its torque peak, and by 5500 rpm its reached its power peak, an extra 1000 earlier then a standard 6.

I'd call the MPS 6 an "american" tuned mazda in terms of its power and torque delivery. American's love to not rev, and love to not shift, so they tend to keep the rev's low (just watch some of your non car ethusiast buddies drive if your in the states), so anything provides low end grunt is highly acceptable to them. I wonder if the euro/jdm MPS 6's are running a totally different tune from the US/Canada 6's again. Would be interesting to know!

[Rainman]

Since the gearing requires a shift to 3rd to hit 60, I'd say the 0-60 would be around mazda's estimates...but a high 13 low 14 is definitely possible due to the gearing change.

Having to shift to 3rd to reach 60 will ruin the car's 0-60 time. I wish manufacturers would make 0-70, 55-75 (highway passing), more standards to try to move away from the similar gearing almost every car has, to try and get a good 0-60 time.

The biggest difference between the MPS 6 and other recent mazda's is when the power kicks in. The MPS 6 is specifically designed to provide lots of low end torque and low end kick. If your not used to low end torque, it feels rediculous fast when you've got heaploads of it. My previous car was a 74 pontiac, with roughly 400 ft/lbs of torque available at roughly 1500-1700 rpm (6.5 liter v8). It only had 270 bhp, and weighed about 4400 lbs, but it "felt" like it was flying off the line.

If you look at the standard 6, it doesn't even begin to make power till 3k rpm, and doesn't start making a decent amount till 4k rpm. At 3k rpm the MPS 6 is already reaching its torque peak, and by 5500 rpm its reached its power peak, an extra 1000 earlier then a standard 6.

I'd call the MPS 6 an "american" tuned mazda in terms of its power and torque delivery. American's love to not rev, and love to not shift, so they tend to keep the rev's low (just watch some of your non car ethusiast buddies drive if your in the states), so anything provides low end grunt is highly acceptable to them. I wonder if the euro/jdm MPS 6's are running a totally different tune from the US/Canada 6's again. Would be interesting to know!

I think that this torque issue is very true and certainly what gives the impression of being much quicker than the MSP. If you go by numbers cited by Mazda and everyone's uncle, this car is not really quicker than the MSP. I doubt that it is more agile either. However, recall that since every NA article on the MSP was written the cars were held up because it was felt NA-cans would not like the proposed final gearing (it being too much geared toward highway cruising and not enough low-end off-the-line punch). With the changes that were made with the gearing this, as-yet-untested, car is much more responsive from the get-go. Add this change to the flatness of its torque curve and you need to hold on as things unfold rather quickly.

I didn't expect the car to be as quick as it is as a result of Mazda's quoted numbers. However, I don't believe the quoted numbers are accurate now that the gearing for NA vehicles (US and CAN) has been revised.

It would be interesting to have one of the journalists who tested a pre-regeared MPS test the final production model MS6 so that we could see there reactions. Personally, after driving them back-to-back (I still have the MSP) over the weekend I still find the MS6 WAY quicker and WAY faster than the MSP. The MSP will produce power quick enough at WOT, but it just doesn't produce the same torque as the MS6 so the power doesn't seem productive. In addition, the MSP generates lots of wheel-hop, of which there is NONE in the MS6. Hit it and you get a tiny bit of wheel-spin and then warp speed...all 4 wheels turning. The experience is not quite the same in the MSP.

Very close to my house is a long straight strip between an industrial complex and the back of a residential area. I used to drive my 14 y/o son to and from football practice along this route. I would occasionally hit it in the MSP for a short burst just to feel the MSP take off. My son, also a car fan, would love it. After hitting this same strip in the MS6 once I'll quote comments he made with an ear-to-ear grin...."Holy shit, this car is scary fast!"

Now, I've never had a 300-400HP+ 4 cyl car before, so this may be chump-change to the guys who have one of those. However, this car is denitely quick enough to surprise more than a few people in other performance marques. When the Toronto rep presented the car to me, he mentioned that the car was an "Audi killer in sheep's clothing." Mazda hype no doubt, but after driving it for a week or so now I'm not so sure that it was all hype.

I'm biased because I own it and love it. But I definitely believe that anyone who is basing their opinion of the car on previously reported times will be very pleasantly surprised.

R

[Mazda3]

Ok, I'm back!!
I didn't get to drive the car, but I went along with the mechanic on the PDI drive. He was easing into the throttle, not mashing it down so it was hard to gage the performance. But it does pull hard in all gears. Like its was stated before downshifting is not really required for making manouvers because the torque is there all the time. I was VERY impressed with how quiet the car was in the cockpit. Very little wind or road noise and you can hardly here the engine under normal driving. Only when you put the hammer down can you even tell the car is running. Unfortunately he was pretty mellow and didn't drive it hard enough for me to really tell how well it handles.

From what I experienced I can't honestly say it felt like a 13.9 sec car, but he was easing into it so who knows. I had coffee yesterday with one of the testers for the AJAC (Auto Journalists Association of Canada) awards. They just finished testing 61 new models for 2006. He said it was one of the nicest driving cars he's ever driven. One of the tests is on an oval track. The Speed 6 was the second fastest around the track out of 61 cars. Only the Z06 beat it, which obviously slaughtered everything. Results of these test will be released to the public first week of December.

[Rainman]

Ok, I'm back!!
But it does pull hard in all gears. Like its was stated before downshifting is not really required for making manouvers because the torque is there all the time. I was VERY impressed with how quiet the car was in the cockpit. Very little wind or road noise and you can hardly here the engine under normal driving. Only when you put the hammer down can you even tell the car is running. Unfortunately he was pretty mellow and didn't drive it hard enough for me to really tell how well it handles.

The torque is especially noticeable in 5th and 6th gear where previously you would have to downshift to get the acceleration, but now you just step on the gas harder and off you go!


He said it was one of the nicest driving cars he's ever driven. One of the tests is on an oval track. The Speed 6 was the second fastest around the track out of 61 cars. Only the Z06 beat it, which obviously slaughtered everything. Results of these test will be released to the public first week of December.

I agree. I haven't driven everything, but I have driven Volvos, Infinitis, and Lexus marques and I find this car to be every bit as comfortable and well-crafted as any of them. And considering that at 130 kmh in 6th gear when the tach is barely touching 2000 RPM this thing has the potential to be very scary...
(thumb) Also, the manner in which it makes this power without too much excitement in the cockpit is very reminiscent of many of the luxury, or near-luxury marques.

R

[vindication]

so the turbo??

[Rainman]

so the turbo??

Not sure. Been trying to find specs on it. Nothing in the owner's manual or online that I can find. it is tucked away too far for me to get to it easily so I'll have to wait until I get it on a hoist before I know what type of turbo it is.

R

[CHICO2003]

Those Motortrend times weren't actual track testing, they were quoting Mazda's VERY conservative estimates. Look for real times to be around 5.5 and 13.9. I am going to be driving one shortly, I'm just waiting for the mechanic to finish the PDI.(glare)


What makes you say Mazda's estimates were conservative? Wishful thinking? YOUR estimates are nearly a second quicker in both tests! How the hell did you come up with those numbers???

[crossbow]

Thats what he's guessing the performance is based on the new final drive. I agree with his 1/4 mile time estimate (with a good competent driver), and low 14's otherwise. I think the 0-60 is worsened by the final drive change, as a shift to third is now required, so it should fall around the 6 to 6.2 range.

The important strengths for this car will be its trap speed (at the end of the 1/4) and its 55-75 or 85 times (highway passing). With the amount of low end power its got available, it can probably pass cars faster in 6th, then a standard 6 can in 4th gear.

[Rainman]

Thats what he's guessing the performance is based on the new final drive. I agree with his 1/4 mile time estimate (with a good competent driver), and low 14's otherwise. I think the 0-60 is worsened by the final drive change, as a shift to third is now required, so it should fall around the 6 to 6.2 range.

The important strengths for this car will be its trap speed (at the end of the 1/4) and its 55-75 or 85 times (highway passing). With the amount of low end power its got available, it can probably pass cars faster in 6th, then a standard 6 can in 4th gear.

Perhaps, but unless you only want to take this car to the strip it is more than adequate for daily driving, and probably for autocrossing as well (its weight aside, with proper footwear, of course). Furthermore, once the direct injection is figured out a little tweaking will make this thing a force to be reckoned with. I figure that there isn't much out there that I would see commonly that would manhandle this car on the street, and certainly not on the highway. There are alot of exotics that you won't see often that will dispatch this car in a freeway showdown, but those are cars are few and far between. Against the rest of the stuff that you will see day to day, this car is an ace in the hole.

R

[CHICO2003]

Until I see some actual test figures, all of this talk about numbers is purely speculation. Personally, considering it's hp and tq, I'd be dissapointed with anything >6 secs/14.4

[Mazda3]

Until I see some actual test figures, all of this talk about numbers is purely speculation. Personally, considering it's hp and tq, I'd be dissapointed with anything >6 secs/14.4


Don't you guys read the other threads?
You might want to check this out before you continue this conversation.

http://www.msprotege.com/vbb222/showthread.php?t=123615525

[GrandBelialKey]

so the turbo??
It's a Hitachi bushing turbo

[CHICO2003]

Don't you guys read the other threads?
You might want to check this out before you continue this conversation.

http://www.msprotege.com/vbb222/showthread.php?t=123615525


i'm sure I'll take some abuse for this but... i'm not 100% sold on that article. check out the wording... "this gets the ms6 up to 100khm in 5.5 seconds." not something like "the best time we recorded was...." I don't know... it almost seems like they took that data from some 'estimated' type of source. I could and probably am wrong about this... i sure hope so! but considering the source (certainly not a motor trend or car and driver) I'm just not 100% convinced. afterall... this car is pretty damn heavy! with about the same hp as an evo and about 600lbs heavier... I would expect the disparity to be greater. again, since this will be my next car, I hope I'm wrong. 5.3 is freakin sick!