Running out of Gas

[P5MoJo]

Ok, I ran my car without gas and it died at a gasoline station. A check engine light came on and my car shakes A LOT now. I have no idea what the problem is. So if anyone has any ideas please help! Thx

[bestmazda01]

the CEL was probably misfire. reset your ECU.

[mogi]

it's not good to run out of gas, you end up getting air in your fuel lines, mechanic or something might be able to take a look at it and get the air out if it is really bad

[bestmazda01]

air in your fuel lines.... not really... the car has a fuel pump, which pumps enough fuel... and there is a fuel pressure regulator which maintains the pressure in the fuel system. All of those things wouldn't just die....

Just get some gas in her, reset your ECU, and you should be set to go. You probably just let the tank completely empty and there were likely some cruddy deposits left. I wouldn't worry much. Just see what happens after you take my suggestion.

[P5MoJo]

well i let the car sit for hours dead which resetted the ECU but it still shakes.. everytime I put the car in Drive (AT), it idles wierd. The whole DAMN motor shakes and it has a hard time going past 40mph.. HELP!

[bestmazda01]

any check engine lights?

also try replacing your spark plugs.

[P5MoJo]

yes, a check engine light came on before I hit the pump. Also, i noticed that while running the AC, the car shook while i was on the freeway. After I resetted my ECU, the CEL turned off. I'm thinking of buying an additive to see if that'll work but this sucks! Thx for the help

[Douggie]

Ok, I ran my car without gas

LOL. Nice try, but that's not the right way to counter high gas prices. :D

Anyway, I would say just keep running it. It should smoothen out later.

[quietflow]

The lights not flashing is it?

[bestmazda01]

it probably was, its not that big of a deal, i'm willing to wager that it was misfire... i just hope he wasn't "driving" too high rpms or fast.

[p5power]

note to self...don't run out of gas!! I was talking to a mechanic a little while ago, and he told me that he's found that newer vehicles tend to run into some problems when they run out of gas. If it doesn't smooth out soon, I would definitely have it checked.

[Stormtrooper77]

Do you not have a low fuel warning light?

[Brian MP5T]

Turn on the ignition and let it run to try to remove the air from the ststem for 4 Min then start again...

[peepsalot]

I heard rumors that running all the way to empty is bad becuase you pick up sludge and crap at the bottom that will clog up your fuel filter or injectors, not sure how valid that statement is.

[Mike R]

I heard rumors that running all the way to empty is bad becuase you pick up sludge and crap at the bottom that will clog up your fuel filter or injectors, not sure how valid that statement is.

that's true. And if you run the pump that low you also run the risk of burning up the fuel pump. You also can lean the motor out and F' it up good.

[Brian MP5T]

I heard rumors that running all the way to empty is bad becuase you pick up sludge and crap at the bottom that will clog up your fuel filter or injectors, not sure how valid that statement is.

It will plug the fuel filter before it does damage to the system. You will have to get the in-line changed... Rather simple job...

[bestmazda01]

that's true. And if you run the pump that low you also run the risk of burning up the fuel pump. You also can lean the motor out and F' it up good.

which is what i've been saying... a MISFIRE is the worst that can happen.
burn up the fuel pump? how? its not pumping anything. lol.

[Douggie]

which is what i've been saying... a MISFIRE is the worst that can happen.
burn up the fuel pump? how? its not pumping anything. lol.

Because the entire fuel pump is actually submerged in the fuel and the fuel actually cools the pump.

[bestmazda01]

Because the entire fuel pump is actually submerged in the fuel and the fuel actually cools the pump.

werd.

[aMaff]

running any pump, fuel, water, etc, w/o fluid in it is just asking for trouble (and I don't just mean w/ cars...)

[P5MoJo]

So, the CEL is back again after I resetted the ECU. The CEL keeps flashing and my car has a hard time accelerating and has a rough idle, nearly dying everytime I come to a stop. I tried an additive to hopefully clean out the fuel injectors like everyone is saying, but I think the problem is much worse than that. I'll get it checked this weekend.

[bestmazda01]

compression check.

[Brian MP5T]

So, the CEL is back again after I resetted the ECU. The CEL keeps flashing and my car has a hard time accelerating and has a rough idle, nearly dying everytime I come to a stop. I tried an additive to hopefully clean out the fuel injectors like everyone is saying, but I think the problem is much worse than that. I'll get it checked this weekend.

Wow, That's Fucked!

[peepsalot]

blinking CEL has a special meaning, can't remember what it is. But under specific conditions it is designed to blink like that. Get your CEL code checked immediately and try not to drive it until you get this figured out.

I'd try replacing the fuel filter if you can. I hear it is built into the pump somehow (boom01).

[Brian MP5T]

Blink is a Misfire. Very Horrid Condition for an electronic controlled engine.

[Gambino]

Do you let it run until the gas light comes on a lot? I have heard of fuel pumps going bad quickly because of this (getting too hot, as mentioned earlier). I dont know a lot about them, could he need a whole new pump?

[bestmazda01]

haha, wow. i said it was misfire the first post i wrote.


and its bad that it is STILL MISFIRING.
The fuel filter is a life long filter. It doesn't need to be changed.

[P5MoJo]

so, if it is misfiring. What needs to be fixed/replace/reset?? Thanks for all the input.!

[bestmazda01]

you need to get a compression test, where you take your spark plugs out and stick a compression tester in there

[solid_snake]

get an obd reader and get the DTC from the ecu, it should tell you what cylinder specifically is misfiring

[solid_snake]

Workshop manual says:

POSSIBLE CAUSE OF MISFIRE:

1. Ignition System
2. Fuel Injectors
3. Fuel Pressure
4. Evaporative Emission system
5. Base engine
6. Crankshaft pulse wheel
7. Crankshaft position (CKP) Sensor
8. LOW FUEL OR RUNNING OUT OF FUEL
9. Camshaft position (CMP) sensor
10. Stuck open EGR valve

I will try to look in the manual for more info

Hope this helps

[GNO]

Because the entire fuel pump is actually submerged in the fuel and the fuel actually cools the pump.
The fuel acts as a coolant and lubricant for the pump. So here's another vote on yes, it's bad to run too low on fuel. However, most pumps can withstand the abuse for a bit. Hopefully, he wasn't punished too severly as a first time offender.


the CEL was probably misfire. reset your ECU.
Why recommend he reset the ECU to clear the CEL? Why not recommend he run a scan and find out what code was set?

Many parts stores will run a scan for you. Some of them will charge but many will do it for free. Pick up the phone and start calling. Even when the CEL is cleared, it's stored in the memory. So if you've reset again, the information is still retrievable. I recommend scanning.

Although it's most likely a fuel issue, just because it happened after running out of gas doesn't necessarily mean it is a fuel issue. If it's a mis-fire, you can narrow down which cylinder(s) is/are mis-firing by running a scan. If it's isolated to one cylinder, then you can check that injector or spark plug. If it's two cylinders that are on the same coil, that coil may be bad. If it's across the board, you can check the fuel pressure. See how helpful a scan can be?

[solid_snake]

The fuel acts as a coolant and lubricant for the pump. So here's another vote on yes, it's bad to run too low on fuel. However, most pumps can withstand the abuse for a bit. Hopefully, he wasn't punished too severly as a first time offender.


Why recommend he reset the ECU to clear the CEL? Why not recommend he run a scan and find out what code was set?

Many parts stores will run a scan for you. Some of them will charge but many will do it for free. Pick up the phone and start calling. Even when the CEL is cleared, it's stored in the memory. So if you've reset again, the information is still retrievable. I recommend scanning.

Although it's most likely a fuel issue, just because it happened after running out of gas doesn't necessarily mean it is a fuel issue. If it's a mis-fire, you can narrow down which cylinder(s) is/are mis-firing by running a scan. If it's isolated to one cylinder, then you can check that injector or spark plug. If it's two cylinders that are on the same coil, that coil may be bad. If it's across the board, you can check the fuel pressure. See how helpful a scan can be?


that's what i said, but yours is in better and understandable words

[bestmazda01]

reset it... before he ran completely dry, he thru a misfire. there is no other code that would have happened at the precise same time.

if he reset it and it came back, the problem just got worse.
and guess what, the manual says a blinking CEL as a result of low or no fuel means? MISFIRE... how many more times must we/I say it?

His blinking CEL was misfire. Now, who knows what it is. Still COULD be misfiring, causing the symptoms he is talking about.

[solid_snake]

running out of fuel can lead to engine misfire (that's what the stupid manual says, lol)

reset the ECU, if it still blinks, get the DTC and it should tell you what cylinder or the whole engine is misfiring...

[bestmazda01]

wow... how many more times do i need to say it?

[solid_snake]

i believe that's enough lol

[solid_snake]

if he reset it and it came back, the problem just got worse.
and guess what, the manual says a blinking CEL as a result of low or no fuel means? MISFIRE... how many more times must we/I say it?

His blinking CEL was misfire. Now, who knows what it is. Still COULD be misfiring, causing the symptoms he is talking about.
here you go:
http://www.msprotege.com/members/solid_snake/MIL.jpg
i was just trying to say that, but i got a little messed up (screwy)

BTW this is from Tribute's manual, the protege manual just says that it should be taken to the stealership

[bestmazda01]

lol, misfire damaging your cat?! who the fuck cares about the cat...

HELLO>>> ENGINE!!! lol, idiot manual writers.

By the way, i have filled up with my car on, no cel...

[solid_snake]

lol, misfire damaging your cat?! who the fuck cares about the cat...

HELLO>>> ENGINE!!! lol, idiot manual writers.

By the way, i have filled up with my car on, no cel...
lol, i know, i just wanted to state that the CEL blinking was misfire in a more understandable way because everybody got it backwards :(

Mazda Protege, 3, 6 manual: "If the check engine light remains on or
flashes continuously, do not drive at high
speeds and consult an Authorized Mazda
Dealer as soon as possible."

Mazda Tribute manual written by Ford Motor Company :"Engine misfire is occurring which could damage your catalytic converter.Under engine misfire conditions, excessive exhaust
temperatures could damage the catalytic converter, the fuel
system, interior floor coverings or other vehicle components,
possibly causing a fire."

[Brian MP5T]

lol, misfire damaging your cat?! who the fuck cares about the cat...

HELLO>>> ENGINE!!! lol, idiot manual writers.

By the way, i have filled up with my car on, no cel...

Cat, Pistons, Manifold... (braindead

They are trying to not scare the shit out of you. Lets say Piston 1 isn't getting proper, fuel. It will run lean and get very hot. Melting rings, warping Heads, Killing Gaskets...

(flame)

[P5MoJo]

Ok, my friend brought over his OBDII scanner and it said that:

Diagnostic Trouble Codes
P0025 Exhaust Camshaft Position Timing - Over-Retarded (Bank 2)
P0303 Cylinder 3 Misfire Detected
P2100 Throttle Actuator Control Motor Circuit /Open

How much will it cost to fix this because I'm worried about the camshaft. BestMazda01, what shop do you work at? LoL this sucks.. thanks everyone!!

[Brian MP5T]

Looks like the timing might have jumped the belt. Take the top cover off and with a 14 MM rotate the camgear clockwise until you see two marks line up.. Your Gears have an I and an E on them. I is for intake Cam...

Here refer to this, you can check the timing yourself or just take it to a dealer if you do not feel comfortable.

HOW TO TIME THE MOTOR (http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113133)



http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/GEAR%20-%206.jpg

[P5MoJo]

Ok, got it fixed at the dealership for $300.00! Very expensive just for 4 spark plugs, new wires, and a fuel filter cleaning. The damn Sparco wires was shorting out my damn spark plug on piston 3. I replaced them a few thousand miles ago with Bosche +2.. POS I knew I should've stayed with the stock NGK's. But, my car has regained its power and it felt better than before. Thanks everyone!

[solid_snake]

Ok, got it fixed at the dealership for $300.00! Very expensive just for 4 spark plugs, new wires, and a fuel filter cleaning. The damn Sparco wires was shorting out my damn spark plug on piston 3. I replaced them a few thousand miles ago with Bosche +2.. POS I knew I should've stayed with the stock NGK's. But, my car has regained its power and it felt better than before. Thanks everyone!
glad you could fix the problem (well ,the dealer for a fairly large amount of money) :)

[shane02pro5]

Dude, they saw you coming...