HELP: MSP Overheating?

[livelyjay]

So, on my drive into work this morning I noticed something strange. My temp gauge was sitting at C, then shot up to halfway after just a few minutes of driving. I didn't really pay any attention to it. Well halfway on my drive into work the temp gauge started going higher. I then shut of AC, started blasting the heat, and turned off all accessories. The air coming out of the vents was very hot at first, then it started fluctuating hot and warm, all while the temp gauge was jumping from mid-level to H. By the time I got into work the gauge was sitting right on H.

My coolant overflow tank is empty. And I have the Ion FMIC and P5 radiator. Any ideas as to what is going on? Bad thermostat? Low coolant? Bad heater core?

[Focus]

coolant level ?

[livelyjay]

If you're asking how my coolant level is, the overflow tank was empty, and the engine was hot so I didn't want to take off the radiator cap. I'll check it during lunch. If it's low, can I put regular tap water in, or do I have to use distilled water?

[Focus]

Buy some premixed.

[livelyjay]

The only problem is there are no parts stores anywhere near here. There are plenty of car dealerships, but they charge $18 for a bottle of coolant. Guess I could try putting just a little bit of water in there, and drive over to the dealership during lunch.

[BOOSTR]

How any miles do you have on your original thermostat? Did this happen all of a sudden or has the temp guage been slowly going up? Can you hear the fans cycling?

[livelyjay]

The fans are definitely cycling. They were on when I parked at work this morning. I just bought the car, so I don't know if the original thermostat is in there. The car has 30300 miles on it. Funny thing is I went on a 900 mile road trip this weekend and had no problems at all.

[Rawyzf]

If the overflow tank is empty, you definatly need some coolant/water. I would put just water in there until you can see it in the overflow on the very bottom. Then add coolant once you can get to a place to get some.

[livelyjay]

Sounds like a good plan, and I am hearing the same thing from other people. I'll fill it up during lunch and see what happens, then I'll run to a parts store after work and get some coolant. I'll keep some extra water with me just in case, and from now on I'll carry some pre-mix with me at all times.

[BOOSTR]

You still need to solve the overheating issue. Thermostat is likely, blown head gasket is the worst case scenario. Did you check the dipstick to see if coolant has gotten in to the oil? Good luck!

[livelyjay]

Well, if the coolant level is extremely low, then wouldn't I overheat? I'll check my oil during lunch as well to make sure there's no coolant in it. I'll also check the coolant hose that everyone has trouble with and make sure it's not leaking as well.

[laracroft]

Been there done that with my MSP. Especially during the summer last year.

But like me, you also probably didnt notice this until recently, and the coolant level has probably been going lower and lower. Especially after a long drive. You need to check this often and dont overlook something that's almost simple weekly maintenance. But I wouldnt panic as this point however. What you need to do is put water in there for now. It'll get you to wherever you're going within a resonable distance. Then buy a 50/50 premix. After that, check the levels periocially and watch your temp. gauge. This time at least, you'll be aware of any potential problems before they come up and then you can just go from there. Just dont run the car with water in the radiator for long, check for leaks and keep an eye on it from now on. If there's a definete problem, you'll notice within a few weeks.

[livelyjay]

Thanks for the input. I remember seeing reports of coolant issues before, guess I didn't pay much attention until now. I think I'll just replace the stock hose clamps with the worm type to stop that leak if it even exists, since it will show up any ways. I'll keep a close eye on things from here on out. I'm thinking an Autometer water temp gauge would be a good idea as well, so I can know immediately when things are getting warm, instead of the dummy gauge in the cluster.

[livelyjay]

I topped off the radiator and the overflow tank with a two liter of water. It looked like it could take some more to fill it completely, but I wasn't going back up 6 floors to get more water. I drove around to get gas, with AC blasting, and it's about 90 outside to see if I could get the gauge to move. It stayed in the middle. I bought some 50/50 blend from the gas station just in case. I'll buy some 100% soon to top off the radiator and compliment all the water I just put in. I'll keep my eye on the temp on my way home from work and top off the radiator tomorrow morning. I have another 1000+ mile trip this weekend, so we'll see what happens.

[hazeXban]

If you are that low you might have a coolant leak somewhere/maybe even a cracked radiator. I would closely monitor this, if you lose the coolant you just put in relatively quickly you have a pretty bad leak someplace.

[livelyjay]

If I had a bad leak, the coolant would be spewing out of it as soon as I put it in. As of now, no leaking it visible. I'll keep my eye on it though.

[Autox MSP]

check your plugs to make sure you don't have coolant burn off. You could also smell coolant buring from the exhaust. Its a sweet smell.
Most likely its a leak, the msp is known for it. Its slow but over time you'll lose it all.

[livelyjay]

I'll check the plugs and the oil when I get home tonight and let it cool off.

[Autox MSP]

also you dont have to worry about putting coolant till the winter, 100 water is acutally better for cooling the engine. Coolant keeps the water from freezing. Next time you fill up for coolant try using a bottle of water wetter from redline.

[TurfBurn]

also you dont have to worry about putting coolant till the winter, 100 water is acutally better for cooling the engine. Coolant keeps the water from freezing. Next time you fill up for coolant try using a bottle of water wetter from redline.

Not completely correct... the ideal mix is 20% glycol. The reason is the amount it raises the boiling point. Running just water wetter can lead to vapor barriers at hot spots in the head... this can lead to warpage, detonation and other things... you NEED to runs ome glycol in there or you can end up with instances of localized boiling... water wetter was developed for race applications where they don't allow you to run any glycol. Additionally in those applications a higher pressur cap is used to increase system pressure... I believe stock we run around 10-12 psi water system... if you want to run without any glycol you need to get into the 30 psi range to be safe..

Jason, as we've been talking by email I think you are ok and covered... you are likely in the same boat as me from all the hot weather.. .just overflowing the tank and creating leaks from the insane heat. I normally cruise around 180 degrees on the water on the highway etc... but there have been a few times with the heat just getting out of hand and me really pushing the car that I've gotten it to almost start getting to 200 degres... which was apparently enough to disturb the sytem... if you want to check for leaks get the car good and hot and then park it over a nice flat dry area and let it idle for like 20 minute and see if get any spots... rev it a few times as well to build up higher pressures and flow rates... that should cover you overall.

[Autox MSP]

try a 160 thermastat.

[TurfBurn]

try a 160 thermastat.

I'm already working on that... I'm getting the J-spec mazdaspeed ones sourced in through CorkSport since I helped them out with some stuff and I'll be getting one in my car... I think it is a 140 thermostat..... do you know of any other ones that can drop in?

And a 160 or 140 thermostat will still NOT fix the boiling issue from not running glycol.

[livelyjay]

Wanna hook me up with one of those thermostats?

[Autox MSP]

yeh but would help keep some cylinder temps down, iron block doesn't dissipate heat good as an aluminum block.
You know how much the mazdaspeed thermastat is?? one that a member here found was 90dollars. Too expensive.

[TurfBurn]

Not sure until they quote me for the batch of them... but I'm guessing 60-70 dollars.

[TurfBurn]

70-80C is the ideal range for your coolant for max power.. and you can in some cars gain roughly 2-3% in out put from going from 90C to 70C.

[orphman]

jsut wanted to let eveyone know i had my car dump all coolant at 1000 miles old... one of those stupid frictian clamps came loose and my lower rad hose worked its way off the nipple of the block.. was hard to find. make sure all your connect are made... basicaly i had exact symtoms when this happened to my car... good luck

[livelyjay]

Ok, here's what is happening. I filled up the coolant and water last night. I woke up this morning and it was still good to go. After my drive into work this morning I turned the car off, popped the hood, and guess what ... the overflow tank level started rising, then overflowed. I turned the car back on and let it idle for a minute, then turned it off. Overflow tank level stayed constant. Any ideas why this is happening? Bad radiator cap? Is it because I have a P5 radiator?

[TurfBurn]

p5 radiator is the same as the MSP radiator... so you are good there.... as far as it doing what you said..... hmm... still sounds like an air bubble possibly... have you verified that your coolant has a good bit of coolant in it? It isn't nearly all water? I'd drain some out of the valve at the bottom of the radiator and make sure it looks pretty damn yellow/green. sounds like you are getting serious boil over issues... and that is likely due to a lack of good coolant... and/or a radiator cap problem.

Later!

[livelyjay]

p5 radiator is the same as the MSP radiator... so you are good there.... as far as it doing what you said..... hmm... still sounds like an air bubble possibly... have you verified that your coolant has a good bit of coolant in it? It isn't nearly all water? I'd drain some out of the valve at the bottom of the radiator and make sure it looks pretty damn yellow/green. sounds like you are getting serious boil over issues... and that is likely due to a lack of good coolant... and/or a radiator cap problem.

Later!
It's got a good mix. I put in about 1/4 of a bottle of pure coolant after putting in a two liter of water the other day, so the mix should be fine. The cap was a bitch to put on, unlike my other car. That may be the culprit. When I get back from my trip maybe I'll just drain the whole system and start from scratch, filling up the engine through the upper hose, then the radiator and overflow tank and see what happens.

[TurfBurn]

It's got a good mix. I put in about 1/4 of a bottle of pure coolant after putting in a two liter of water the other day, so the mix should be fine. The cap was a bitch to put on, unlike my other car. That may be the culprit. When I get back from my trip maybe I'll just drain the whole system and start from scratch, filling up the engine through the upper hose, then the radiator and overflow tank and see what happens.

That's how I fill mine when I drain the motor.. works great... my coolant issue seems to be ok.. I'm guessing i just boiled over last week with the 100 degree heat.... the level sucked down a bit and now is holding pretty steady...

The caps are a little bit of a pain to get on and off but shouldn't be TOO much of an issue.