Lowering springs

[triston2469]

I am thinking about lowering my car but I dont know how low to go. I have found a pair of 2" lowering springs for $75 brand new. I just dont know if 2 inches is too low. I know it will end up being really low then and I am worried it will be too low. Please tell me what you guys think.

[Mikey444]

If you live in an area with fairly smooth roads and have mild winters than I wouldnt worry about a 2 inch drop, should be ok.

[crossbow]

More then a 1 inch drop will cut your rear shock longevity to 1/3 normal. A 2 inch drop will cause your rear shocks to start leaking around 20k miles.

By the 6's design, there is very little default shock travel. Any excessive lowering causes the car to ride on the bump stops, which is very bad for the shocks, and even worse for unpredicable handling.

If your lowering for looks, just put about 120 on the side to replace your rear shocks in another 20-30k miles. (120 for both).

http://forum.mazda6tech.com/viewtopic.php?t=3035&start=0

[Da 6]

Yeah if you wanna drop that low coilovers would be a better deal to save up. After you replace the shocks with the koni yelows, mazdaspeed shocks(corksport), or auto exe(corksport) the price you paid in springs and shocks will be almost $100 shorta D2 coilover kit. $100 short is if you didn't pay a shop to install the springs and struts ;)

[triston2469]

More then a 1 inch drop will cut your rear shock longevity to 1/3 normal. A 2 inch drop will cause your rear shocks to start leaking around 20k miles.

By the 6's design, there is very little default shock travel. Any excessive lowering causes the car to ride on the bump stops, which is very bad for the shocks, and even worse for unpredicable handling.

If your lowering for looks, just put about 120 on the side to replace your rear shocks in another 20-30k miles. (120 for both).

http://forum.mazda6tech.com/viewtopic.php?t=3035&start=0

Well when i get the money saved up then i am going to buy some new shocks anyway. i am going to buy some racing shocks. Thanks everyone

[crossbow]

There aren't any racing shocks other then konis, which require you to cut the front struts.

The only package which offers both rear and front shocks, with springs, is adjustable coilovers.

[Mikey444]

More then a 1 inch drop will cut your rear shock longevity to 1/3 normal. A 2 inch drop will cause your rear shocks to start leaking around 20k miles.

By the 6's design, there is very little default shock travel. Any excessive lowering causes the car to ride on the bump stops, which is very bad for the shocks, and even worse for unpredicable handling.

If your lowering for looks, just put about 120 on the side to replace your rear shocks in another 20-30k miles. (120 for both).

http://forum.mazda6tech.com/viewtopic.php?t=3035&start=0

None of this I knew. You stun me once again with new info.

[mazdakaki]

There aren't any racing shocks other then konis, which require you to cut the front struts.

The only package which offers both rear and front shocks, with springs, is adjustable coilovers.

I guess you guys still haven't got the Bilstein Damper in store... I was on Bilstein B8 (specially made damper for lowered cars)

check the picture

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v660/mazdakaki/P1010773.jpg

[crossbow]

The blisten damper is only for atenzas. Mazda 6's (US/Canada) can't use them.

There isn't yet a blisten shock set available for the US. :(

[Da 6]

if our cars werent made in the same plant as the mustangs... I have the konis(since febuary) and it's been hell trying to find a shop that will do the fronts! I even took the shocks off the car and removed the springs and bumpstops but nor myself or any of the guys in the shop could figure out where koni was measuring from since the entire instruction manul is pictures only. Some people are like wow we are just soo over negative but when you have been where we have been to waste the money and time, we only do it to prevent you from the going thru it to ;) slaming the car too far can also cancel out the benefit of lowering the car.

[Mikey444]

I dont see the point in lowering the car. It already handles extremely well stock. My V6 is actually extremel agile in corners and I dont seem to experience the excessive understeer that others describe which is probably due to the fact that since I have a hatch there is more weight in the back of the car and it is better balanced. Just my $0.02

Crossbow will probably suprise me yet again with a new theory lol

[Da 6]

you need to personaly see what a V6 and I4 handeling is like in extreme conditions ;) then when lowered and on better than stock tires. Springs alone can lessen the nose dive when braking hard. Combination of Aftermarket Springs/Coilovers and rear sway bar are unbelevable!

[Mikey444]

without a doubt, but we have worst roads here than you can imagine

[mazdakaki]

:( The blisten damper is only for atenzas. Mazda 6's (US/Canada) can't use them.

There isn't yet a blisten shock set available for the US. :(

[triston2469]

I dont see the point in lowering the car. It already handles extremely well stock. My V6 is actually extremel agile in corners and I dont seem to experience the excessive understeer that others describe which is probably due to the fact that since I have a hatch there is more weight in the back of the car and it is better balanced. Just my $0.02

Crossbow will probably suprise me yet again with a new theory lol

Well being that you have the V6, you probably have the 17" rims and low pro tires. Mine is a 4 Cyl with the 16" rims and tall tires. I think that lowering my car will do alot for it. As far as handling, it does handle well, but I just want to be able to go faster around corners. My next move after springs is going to ba strut tower brace. I know those help out alot.

[Killer]

Well being that you have the V6, you probably have the 17" rims and low pro tires. Mine is a 4 Cyl with the 16" rims and tall tires. I think that lowering my car will do alot for it. As far as handling, it does handle well, but I just want to be able to go faster around corners. My next move after springs is going to ba strut tower brace. I know those help out alot.Larger swaybars would allow you to "to be able to go faster around corners." :2cents:

[crossbow]

The standard 6 is designed to understeer for safety. There's a ton of unreleased potential in the car, which is why you see it beating the bmw's in the SCCA World Challenge races.

Our primary issue is we don't have adjustable front camber. Thus the only way to get negative front camber is to drop the car. We can't use camber plates (double wishbones, not shitty macpherson struts), so we have to wait until one of the tripoint teams releases a new upper wishbone for us.

Hows camber work? Here's an excellent example. Look at my rear tire, notice how its straight with the ground even though my car is maximizing its body roll with the D2's. Now look at the front wheels, notice how they're tilted out, and not having 100% contact with the road. If you find this hard to see, look at the rear wheels, then quickly look at the fronts, you'll see them tilting out.

http://www.glue.umd.edu/~greghess/vir/vir9.jpg

We need front negative camber soooo badly. And an LSD, and stiffer shocks, and stiffer springs.

The car can pretty much outhandle every "current" (destroyed by older models of course) sedan on the road, and its been proven it can in the race series. But it sure as hell doesn't stock.

[Mikey444]

Is that a Mazda 6s you are racing or 6i?

[Da 6]

both cars he had were 6s

[Mikey444]

Hey crossbow, do you have any other pictures of you racing your car? If you do, would you post them for me please?

[crossbow]

http://www.glue.umd.edu/~greghess/vir/vir91.jpg
http://www.glue.umd.edu/~greghess/vir/vir92.jpg
http://www.glue.umd.edu/~greghess/vir/vir93.jpg
http://www.glue.umd.edu/~greghess/vir/vir94.jpg

http://www.3dluvr.com/crossbow/autocross/autoxspeed1.jpg
http://www.3dluvr.com/crossbow/autocross/autoxspeed3.jpg
http://www.3dluvr.com/crossbow/autocross/autoxspeed5.jpg

[Mikey444]

nice, thnx man

[triston2469]

You have a nice car man. I am hoping to get a sponsor soon so I can get my car the way I want it. I like the pics of your car though. I need to take some of my car as well, but probably wont till after I lower it.

[Da 6]

Rode in it today during AutoX and it's fast and way less body roll from the last ride on stock height.

[crossbow]

I need da 6's rear shocks. Stupid rear d2 shocks SUCK ASS. I'm ordering those koni rears today allan :).

http://www.glue.umd.edu/~greghess/autox/autoxfun.jpg

Shot from yesterday taken by Sal (SC3) with allan (Da 6) having a blast in the passenger seat :).

[Da 6]

remember +++ is what I am at. You can experiment with ++++ if you wish ;) I'm still pissed nobody will do my fronts!

[Mikey444]

Damn I got to travel the few extra miles next time I am in New-York to race with you guys :D

[Da 6]

triston2469 (http://www.msprotege.com/forum/member.php?u=16539)
I missed your post on the 1st page...to reply to strut tower bars and their functionability on the 6....

http://www.msprotege.com/members/Da%206/torsion.jpg


In the above picture the car comes with two braces in the front(blue). These braces do more than any thin strut tower bar can and will ever do. The strut tower bar for the front is nothing but decoration. As for the rears, look at the picture and you can see a massive rear brace(red) that is clearly visable if you pop the trunk and look under the deck. this is why you don't need and can't instal a traditional rear strut tower bar. All the bolts for the suspention are hidden under the car making instalation and adjustments to the rear shocks more difficult and extreme compared to a civic or neon. Last but not least strut tower bars do nothing for our cars cause we don't use "Struts" on our cars. Think of it this way, strut towerbars for chassis stiffining is like a thing of the 1990's compared to mazdas braces in our car now ;)

[Killer]

sway bars will do the trick if you dont want to lower it,

[Da 6]

just a rear sway bar will correct most understeer issues...real quick :)

[triston2469]

thanks, but i am going to lower it and put front and rear sway bars on it and i know for a fact i am going to put a front strut tower brace, but i dont know about the rear ones.

[crossbow]

Just a reminder. Strut braces have no effect on this car.
1) This car doesn't have struts. Its a double wishbone setup.
2) The shock towers are braced against the firewall.
3) The car has reinforced horizontal bracing between the towers already.

They are however quite cheap, and look nice in the engine bay.

Da6 already explained this with an awesome diagram.

http://www.msprotege.com/members/Da%206/torsion.jpg

[Da 6]

Easy way to clear it up is if you don't have a hatch, walk outside to the trunk and find the bolts for the shocks ;) after a few minutes (Hopefully not hrs!) you will realize this cars suspention is set up "Funnier" than others. Link I'm gonna give you is how-to for replacing shocks/installing coilovers. When you get to the rear set, just imagine what your knucles will look like after trying to remove those bolts covered in lock tite from factory however long ago it was built.
http://www.mazda6tech.com/articles/how-to/how-to-install-shocks-springs-coilovers-2.html

[triston2469]

thanks i posted my last message with out fully reading da6's reply. now on the bright side it wont be as hard to get my springs on as i thought. looking at the diagram it doesnt look as hard to do as i was thinking it would be. thanks.

[Killer]

just a rear sway bar will correct most understeer issues...real quick :)(werd)

[triston2469]

Well got my springs on today, and the car looks great and it also takes turns better. It wasn't as hard as I thought it would be, it only took me 3 hours from start to finish. I think that is pretty good for someone who knew absolutely nothing about changing springs. I will try to have pics of it on here soon. I am very much impressed with it. The only thing is I am kinda disappointed on the fact that it isnt lower. I was expecting it to be alot lower, but I am happy that it isn't lower for the fact of bumps and all that.

[Da 6]

Give it time. Springs need to settle :)

[Killer]

Give it time. Springs need to settle :)I totally agree. When I first installed my springs on my Acura I was like.."Hay...WTF? It barely went down!" now..its slammed..LOL (2 years later) (rofl)

[Da 6]

yeah I put the Koni rears on at super stiff(++++) and they also in turn dropped the rear. Once I get back I'll try the D2's out. triston what springs did you go with?

[triston2469]

yeah I put the Koni rears on at super stiff(++++) and they also in turn dropped the rear. Once I get back I'll try the D2's out. triston what springs did you go with?


I got Megan Racing, and actually they have settled i think now, cause it is lower than it was when i got done with it. It is actually right where i thought it would be now. It looks sexy now. I cant wait to start working on my engine. I would put a body kit on it as well, but I wont be able to get on post if I leave. They have pop up barriers that sit about 3 or 4 inches off the ground.

[Da 6]

that sux! My lip kit takes a beating and I'm glad it's the lip kit and not the actual sports bumper. Pop up bariors are supose to be flat as in burried in the ground. We have the cheap looking ones but they are flush with the road. How low is the rear? is it close to mine? if so save up and invest in shocks.

[triston2469]

that sux! My lip kit takes a beating and I'm glad it's the lip kit and not the actual sports bumper. Pop up bariors are supose to be flat as in burried in the ground. We have the cheap looking ones but they are flush with the road. How low is the rear? is it close to mine? if so save up and invest in shocks.

Actually the rear is not as low as yours. It is about as low as the front was originally. I entered my car into a carshow today and left with forth place in the 1980 to present class, so I am really happy with it now. That make my day for the next couple of weeks. As soon as I am able to get some pics of it I will put them on here so you can see it.

[triston2469]

This is what my car looks like after i droped it.

[Killer]

This is what my car looks like after i droped it.

Much better. :)

[anarchistchiken]

Da 6, you're a nice guy from what I can tell and seem to be intelligent when it comes to 6's, but I can understand maybe half of what you type!

Triston, you need to get your allignment fixed as fast as you physically can. Those tires are gonna die fast with the camber on those rear wheels.

[Da 6]

Are you refering to pop up bariors or my lipkit moving up to 2 inches when it comes in contact wit a harden surface in my last post?

also give viewers a 56K warning for picts like those ;)

[triston2469]

Da 6, you're a nice guy from what I can tell and seem to be intelligent when it comes to 6's, but I can understand maybe half of what you type!

Triston, you need to get your allignment fixed as fast as you physically can. Those tires are gonna die fast with the camber on those rear wheels.


Actually as as far as my allignment, before i lowered my car it pulled to the right and now it holds straight when you let off the wheel, so i honestly think i fixed my alignment, but i will soon find out.

[Da 6]

yeah right wheel usualy breaks free on the 6 so you never know. I found myself not lossing the inside tire as quickly as I use to on stock height.

[triston2469]

Hey Da 6. How low did you drop your car? j/w

[Da 6]

Eibach pro kit front and Eibach pro kit and Koni Yellow(adjustable dampening) rear. The front wheel gap is just enough to get a "normal" flat hand into but the rear (due to subs and work equiptment) the top of the tire sits at the lip of the rear fender. Due to the rear shocks I almost never bottom out. I'll find pictures when I can cause I'm miles away(live in Northern Virginia) from my dome pc and digi cam. My sideskirts and front lip basicly sit on a pepsi can. My next step is D2 fronts cause I can't install the front konis :(

[Killer]

Eibach pro kit front and Eibach pro kit and Koni Yellow(adjustable dampening) rear. The front wheel gap is just enough to get a "normal" flat hand into but the rear (due to subs and work equiptment) the top of the tire sits at the lip of the rear fender. Due to the rear shocks I almost never bottom out. I'll find pictures when I can cause I'm miles away(live in Northern Virginia) from my dome pc and digi cam. My sideskirts and front lip basicly sit on a pepsi can. My next step is D2 fronts cause I can't install the front konis :(How is the ride my friend?...I really enjoy the ride in stock form, any BIG differece other than improved handling???

[Da 6]

How is the ride my friend?...I really enjoy the ride in stock form, any BIG differece other than improved handling???Slight accel and reaction to curves are extremely noticed. Ride quality is slightly taken away depending on how stiff you go. When I went full stiff I could feel bumps I couldn't normaly see w/o laying flat in the roadway to spot.The stiffer shocks almost cancel out the rearward body roll when you launch so that helps keep more weight on the drive wheels. Not shure if crossbow experienced it but some bumps I may get a lil airborne. My next step is D2 front shocks and swap the eibach for stiffer d2 rears. Once I get back and swap out to the new falkens alone will make a big difrence over the mishelin pilotless.

[Killer]

Slight accel and reaction to curves are extremely noticed. Ride quality is slightly taken away depending on how stiff you go. When I went full stiff I could feel bumps I couldn't normaly see w/o laying flat in the roadway to spot.The stiffer shocks almost cancel out the rearward body roll when you launch so that helps keep more weight on the drive wheels. Not shure if crossbow experienced it but some bumps I may get a lil airborne. My next step is D2 front shocks and swap the eibach for stiffer d2 rears. Once I get back and swap out to the new falkens alone will make a big difrence over the mishelin pilotless.Keep me posted...the wife loves the look of a lowered car..but is concerned about ride degredation. (boobs2)

[triston2469]

Keep me posted...the wife loves the look of a lowered car..but is concerned about ride degredation. (boobs2)


Actually all i did is buy springs and my car still rides the same as it did. Megan Racing makes a 2 inch drop for the car that makes it look really good, and like I said it still rides the same, only corners better. And they are priced better than most i have seen. i paid 75 for my springs.

[Killer]

That is just about all the drop you need on a 6. looks good.

[crossbow]

Be prepared to replace the rear shocks in about 10k miles. They wear extremely rapidly on drops over 1 inch.

[triston2469]

Be prepared to replace the rear shocks in about 10k miles. They wear extremely rapidly on drops over 1 inch.

ya i am actually saving to get the adjustable ones that all you have you do is turn a nob and you can raise and lower the car.

[crossbow]

Those don't exist. Now there are threaded coilovers...which involve lots of turning and twisting till you get the ride height you want...those exist.

The nobs on the shocks are for adjusting the rebound rate.

http://www.wam.umd.edu/~greghess/setting.jpg

[Da 6]

/\Those are what I want for the fronts..but not as low as he has his.

[Killer]

Those don't exist. Now there are threaded coilovers...which involve lots of turning and twisting till you get the ride height you want...those exist.

The nobs on the shocks are for adjusting the rebound rate.

http://www.wam.umd.edu/~greghess/setting.jpg

That's the ticket right there. (alright)

[triston2469]

That's the ticket right there. (alright)


I see, well I will have to get those then.

Thanks

[RHAGEL]

What about the Racing Beat set up? they have a modest drop with sway bars. Will the stock shocks hold up fairly well with this kit. Fairly well meaning at least 40k miles?

[crossbow]

Should. The racing beat springs sacrifice the least amount of suspension travel, and thus should have the longest longevity.