Anyone experience Auto Tranny 2-3 Slow Upshift w/"Flare"?

[CaptSkip]

Hello all! New guy here, glad I found you all! (hi)

My '01 Protege ES, 67K miles, Auto Trans, on the 2-3 upshift when at approx, 4-5K RPM, will slowly complete the shift, and during the shift the RPM "flares-up" 300-500 RPM. This happens consistently when cold and becomes intermittent when at temp.

According to an Auto Tranny Specialty Shop in my city, there is a known issue with Ford/Mazda Auto Transaxles specific to this slow 2-3 upshift and RPM flare-up.

When I searched here I found this thread:

<a href=http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51719&highlight=auto+tran>Please help! What's wrong with my tranny?</a>

His '99 LX Protege has the <B>same tranny</B> as my '01 Protege ES <B>and LOTS of other Mazda and Ford Product</B>; a Mazda# FN4A-EL / Ford# 4F27E.

My tranny shop guy says the fix is a parts swap involving tranny pump/valve/etc. parts with the tranny staying in/on car.

Anyone do this repair?

[ProtegeES03]

my car does this as well... I'm sure we're not the only ones. How big of a problem is this though?

[Marik123]

Mine does that too. When changing from 2-3 gear at 2000-3000RPM, it will shift slower than usual and rise up the RPM by 200-400, also there is a slight jerk when it actually shift. My car is a 2000 PRO LX 1.6L Auto tranny, dont know if it has the same tranny as the 1.8/2.0L ES..

[CaptSkip]

From here: <a href=http://www.txchange.com/id.htm>Automatic Transmission Application (Identification) Guide</a>

The following product use the <B>FN4A-EL</b> Mazda / <B>4F27E</B> Ford Tranny:

PROTEGE 99-03 4 SP FWD L4 1.6/1.8L/2.0L FN4A-EL 4F27E

Mazda 6 03 4 SP FWD L4 2.3L FN4A-EL 4F27E

[Ford] FOCUS 00-03 4 SP FWD L4 2.0L/2.3L 4F27E

[ProtegeES03]

the question is does this pose any significant problem besides delay in shift

[CaptSkip]

Serious problem....??? Tedious, annoying, squirrely....For sure! ;)

[J.P.]

Mine did not do that until the day the transmission died. It shifted fine, regular oil changes, and at 182 000 km - that was it. I lost third and fourth in a matter of an hour, and it was toast. I ended up getting a used tranny from a decent local yard, but the rebuild was going to be $2500. Stay away from Mr Transmission for any of the Canadian members, they were over DOUBLE their "estimate". Bunch of rip off artists if you ask me.

[Mr. Win]

mine does that now... i just try not to mess with it much and ill swap in a new one when it dies.

[CaptSkip]

LOTS of shops out there that are EAGER to diagnose ALL problems with "you need a new tranny...right now"!

My latest research: (attn)

Previous Mazda trans-axles had the same 2-3 up-shift flare problem, specifically the F4A-EL and GF4A-EL. Sonnax makes an after-market Pump Rebuild Kit, Part no. K74878, to correct this problem:

http://www.transmissionspecialty.com/parts/PDF/K74878(rb).pdf

http://www.transmissionspecialty.com/parts/parts/K74878.htm

http://www.transmissionspecialty.com/parts/DM/Imports.htm

http://www.sonnax.com/


<B>The '99 to'03 Proteges use the newer FN4A-EL.</B>

The tech-rep I spoke to at Sonnax, did not know if the above kit would work on this trans-axle, or if a kit for this trans-axle is available or to be introduced.

My '01 ES has the 2-3 upshift flare consistently when cold, but only under moderate acceleration and when the 2-3 shift is at app. 4K RPM. Once at temp, it happens intermittently and the RPM flare-up is greatly reduced to hardly noticeable.

Live with it I suppose. (jerkit)

I'll post any more info I discover.

[solid_snake]

I also have problems with my Auto tranny, I have an '99 LX 1.6L but the only thing is the O/D Light flashing from time to time and the CEL on.

[J dragon]

Ford and Mazda have Cheap Tranny's?...Maybe they should start studying Acura/honda trannys

[Fade]

Guess when mine goes then it'll be time to order one from Lentech.

Hopefully I'll be able to beef it up before that happens though.

[MIA protege]

mine does the same thing ... real badly and everytime it shifts from 2-3 ... my car is boosted so i thought that was the problem. it didnt start till i got the turbo.

[Shorebroke]

*bump* up an old thread.

My car is starting to do this now. Gonna go check the fluids, see if that helps. If not, gonna take it to my friends shop, have them look at it.

the search button kicks ass.

[CaptSkip]

UPDATE: After owning my '01 Protege ES since late fall of '04, it has become obvious that for at least my car, the "upshift with flare" problem is COLD WEATHER/TEMP DEPENDENT....that is to say...it only happpens in the cold/winter months and as the operating temp is reached, it's hardly noticable even when it's really cold outside.

Soooo, I'll just live with it as a slight annoyance.

Love the Mazdas! A Mazda Speed is next!

[kold]

I figure I will update this thread with a link to my own thread, as I am currently having this problem:

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123621367

This problem started happening about a week ago, and my transmission has now failed. The car will shift out of second, but on 3rd gear it has a permanent flare, and i cannot get any power to the ground. My drivetrain is under warranty, so I think i will be getting a new transmission soon. I've been driving it still, waiting for my dealer to get a transmission in for replacement, and yesterday the transmission started giving a permanent grind while flashing the OD light.

I am now limited to driving in gears 1 and 2 (not D) while I wait so if you still have drivetrain warranty, get this to your dealer ASAP!

It's weird you say that this doesnt happen at operating temps, cause when my transmission is cold, it seems ok, but when it is hot, it is very bad.

[CaptSkip]

Kold...I'll go check your link, but it sounds like you just basically lost third gear in a gradual proccess...that evolved kinda through this known issue with this and previous Mazda/Ford Transmission. See my post above dated 03-04-2005 08:31AM...I did a bunch of research on this weird issue.

Thank God for warranties...great for cars, who cares for toasters! I'm sure your dealer/Mazda will make it good! (thumb)

[kold]

Kold...I'll go check your link, but it sounds like you just basically lost third gear in a gradual proccess...that evolved kinda through this known issue with this and previous Mazda/Ford Transmission. See my post above dated 03-04-2005 08:31AM...I did a bunch of research on this weird issue.

Thank God for warranties...great for cars, who cares for toasters! I'm sure your dealer/Mazda will make it good! (thumb)

Yeah, I dont doubt that this is a known issue with this model of transmission, but i dont know if you can call driving 63000 km and then losing 3rd gear in a matter of 300 km gradual. I would classify it more as a sudden failure, but i think there are a lot of people getting this problem gradually as well...Hopefully people can pay attention to this and recognize this problem and get it fixed before a catastrophic failure occurs! :)

[CaptSkip]

Hey kold,

I re-read your original post with the discription of the process of your transmission failure. I do see how for you it came on suddenly and failed quickly.

The "auto-tranny flare" issue when up-shifting from 2nd to 3rd and when cold, for my '01 Protege ES is also specific to havivg the engine make that shift either side of 4K RPM. I've had the car since Fall of '04, bought it with 62K miles IIRC. I just put 3K miles on the car with a quick trip to the East Coast and back. Not a lick of a problem, save replacing all 4 brake pads after driving thru the Great Smoky Mountains TWICE! She's at 79K miles now.

I'm relatively confident that for my car, it's not an indicator of impending failure, having now lived with the annoyance thru two cold seasons.

I'd sure fight for a new tranny, under warranty, cause to pay for a new one is 2-3K dollars.

[kold]

If you still have warranty, watch it carefully for any indicators of the problem getting worse. Watch for the rough clunk downshift from 3-2, and the flare getting larger.

They ordered a new transmission for me, and it's on the way. It is going to be put in free of charge, so I'm glad for that. Hope your car doesnt develop any further problems...